InvestigateTruth
Veteran Member
I find it strange that you don't believe a God is able to write an infallible Book as a guidance for humanity, just as a Father who cares for His children to guide them to the right way of life, and tell them what is wrong and what is right.I touched on this last night but will repeat it here. I do not see these as "concepts that people came up with". No. Rather they are descriptions of actual realizations through actual experience. This is what mysticism is. It's not theological or metaphysical or fanciful speculations about something that the imaginations comes up with (which can have some value). Mysticism rather is about actual data gathering research. It is about exploration. It is about direct experiential encounters.
These are descriptions of firsthand experience, not "concepts people came up with at one time". They are maps of the terrain and territories that the explorers discovered on their journey. And, they are relatively consistent with the maps of other explorers who explored the same terrain on their own expeditions. The fact that there are commonalities in these descriptions that all say, "a river runs through here", means these are not just wild speculations about something no one has ever encountered. This is indicative of an objective reality.
Yeah, in theory. But yes and no. It also can be a way to never sail off across the sea because the "infallible source" claims the earth is flat and you'll fall off the edge. It can offer you a sense of security never having to risk anything being told Answers with a capital A, but that comes with a hefty price tag. You never get to step outside the box and move about under your own agency and feel what it is like to truly live, the way you were created to be.
Spirituality is about freedom of movement. It's about dancing. Not being told which foot goes where in a set, or fixed patterned movement. "Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty". That's what this means to me.
Everything we hear anyone say, regardless of the source, should be tested and proven by ourselves. Simply memorizing words and calling them truth, but never testing them is not really dancing, or living. It's just rigidity and inflexibility.
That's the problem with claiming infallible sources. It's like these fundamentalists who escape any self-responsibility and agency and make grandiose claims, "It's not my words, but God's words!". That is utter nonsense and a self-delusion. It's hiding inside of a box, not stepping out and dancing free under the the light of the sun.
And yet the Buddha himself said everyone can become a Buddha. Everyone Can Become a Buddha.
"And Buddha said that everyone can achieve what he did; everyone can become a Buddha. This is because we all have “Buddha-nature” – the fundamental working materials that enable Buddhahood."The way I state this is this. Everyone is already Enlightened. We just haven't been enlightened to that reality yet.Enlightenment, Awakening, Salvation, is simply the Realization of what we already fully are. So absolutely yes, everyone can become Enlightened, because that is our true Nature. We all came from God, not some other source.
Now we are talking much closer to how I see things. Yes, you are agreeing that our true Nature is perfect, or to give that another term, Divine. Again, we all came from the same Source, which is the Divine. Not some other source outside of God.
Regarding the ego never completely disappears, I will conditionally agree with this, but not entirely so. This is a little complex and abstract, so I know this may be challenging. The human ego is simply how we perceive ourselves as distinct and separate from others. It is functionally necessary for me to be able to self-identify in this way. In this sense, I can never get rid of that "egoic self" anymore than I can get rid of my body and still be considered a human being.
But what we can "get rid of" or what we can "overcome" is that we no longer self-identify with that egoic-self, as the ultimate reality of who and what we are. This is what it means to "die to yourself" and live in the Spirit. When we realize "I have a body, but I am not my body. I have an ego, but I am not my ego", then we begin to be able to transcend that view of ourselves into something higher or greater than the egoic self. We become liberated from its chains it holds upon us.
Now we are able to live "in the Spirit" instead as the center of gravity of who and what we are. And the more we do that, the more the lower levels in us, such as our egos and our bodies, become transformed by the energies of that higher Self, or our spiritual nature, which comes from God and is Divinity itself in us.
This is what Enlightenment does. This is what Salvation is. "I am in the world, but I am not of the world". "I have overcome the world", and such. All language to describe a real, tangible, practical, direct experiential reality. Not just fluffy lofty words.
Does this take eons? It can. This is the teaching of reincarnation, coming back again and again until we find that Truth and are eventually set free from the trap of our mistaken self-identities. However, it can happen more rapidly by following tried and true paths, taught by other Masters.
But the goal is to become a Buddha yourself, not to set them upon a pedestal and tell yourself "I can never become Enlightened". That is a lie we tell ourselves, or that others tell us in order to keep us underneath their power and control.
Of course everyone is in a different place in following these things, but the core of any authentic religion is the mystical realization of union or reconciliation with the Divine. That the cornerstone that set the foundation in place. But of course, that can become buried and replaced by the dogmas of religiosity, forgetting their own spiritual Source.
Of course, as I said everyone is in a different place. But I make a distinction between exoteric and esoteric religion. Most everyone starts with exoteric religion: external rules and practices that they are to follow. An authentic exoteric religion, should lead to an esoteric, or interior religion, or one of realizing the principles on a spiritual subjective way. Esoteric religion leads to Awakening. Exoteric religion is at best the supporting structures of that building, scaffolding to climb to help in the construction of that inner building.
But when all there is is the exoteric religion, then you have religiosity, devoid of a spiritual heart. Then that is some the ways of the world, or the flesh, ot the ego "doing God". That is where you have what you describe above
The experiences you talk about has never been reported by billions of others whatsoever. Even on this Forum there are many atheists, who never experienced such things.
Why shouldn't God be able to talk to humanity in their own language? Why couldn't God write a Book, in which He speaks to us all? So that everyone have the opportunity to know what God says, instead of leaving them to guesses and imaginations about God?
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