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Who will win the debate?

Who will win the debate according to the media?

  • Trump

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • Harris

    Votes: 11 73.3%
  • Split between them

    Votes: 2 13.3%

  • Total voters
    15

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
And the plan of the Democrats is to even spend more than ever.
Spending is certainly necessary, but restoring American manufacturing base in a planned manner is just as important. American business is not interested in training and employing people, it is only interested in making the most money at the least cost.
It is people's wages that get spent, that can create long term growth and profits.
World trade is circular and benefits everyone. But for stability you need a platform of manufacturing yourself to work from.

America has neither the educated nor skilled workforce. Nor the supply chains , to restart any of its lost industries.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Spending is certainly necessary, but restoring American manufacturing base in a planned manner is just as important. American business is not interested in training and employing people, it is only interested in making the most money at the least cost.
It is people's wages that get spent, that can create long term growth and profits.
World trade is circular and benefits everyone. But for stability you need a platform of manufacturing yourself to work from.

America has neither the educated nor skilled workforce. Nor the supply chains , to restart any of its lost industries.
That wouldn't have happened if industry had been kept here in the first place.
 

Soandso

ᛋᛏᚨᚾᛞ ᛋᚢᚱᛖ
I was wrong in my initial suspicions. Harris won pretty handily and even fox news admits it
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
That wouldn't have happened if industry had been kept here in the first place.
World trade is good
But like anything, if taken to the extreme it is destructive.
It started with just a little local outsourcing
Then became an industry in itself, led by consultants and money men.
They searched the world for the most easily to be exploited.
The made fortunes by asset stripping American business who could no longer compete.

However little did they know that first Japan, Then Korea and vietnam Taiwan and later China and many other south east asian countries would take technology and manufacturing to another level.

In the meantime the education training and skills of the American People along with their jobs and workplaces had rusted and faded away. The American way of life based on skill and hard work was gone. And no one of importance cared, they were still making money.

In the meantime time along with the jobs and factories,, an even more precious thing had taken root in the east. And that was research and development led by the now largest and highly educated work force in the world.

Along the Way, China had abandoned its communist face and embraced it's own form of capitalism.
And in the last forty years, has come from nowhere to be the arguably largest industrial and technological base in the world and the second largest economy.

Some people in the west are still fooled into thinking that China. Is still a backward nation making shoddy cheap goods. But the truth is that in very many fields they now lead the world and are rapidly catching up in others. They have the most complete supply chains in the world.

Everything is not lost for America, but the position as future world leaders probably is.
Their future is undoubtedly in cooperation with China, not in trying to obstruct it or in trade war with it.

America can not match the Chinese infrastructure or its supply of highly educated workers.
it musts divert its energy and money into rebuilding the things that matter, education, infrastructure, high tech manufacturing, and research. It probably still has the ability to partner with China but it will been a long road to get anywhere near equalling them again. It can not do so by rebuilding the past. It must embrace the new hightec manufacturing world and build its supply chains from scratch.
However there is the real possibility that the American capitalist system is not up to the task as it lacks the cooperative spirit. So apparent in thee East.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
This is not about who you agree with or not, but who you think the media will call the winner.
The media will not declare a winner simply because they all want to keep it a "mega-cage-match" to the end. Because that's what keeps people tuning in (for more advertising).
 

Spice

StewardshipPeaceIntergityCommunityEquality
At least for the emotionally unhinged crowd that you might be right on that point.

But as for Sense and Sensibility on policy matter I would say Trump washed the floor with Harris.
Unfortunately Trump didn't speak of any "policy" just a lot of "I will", "I did", and ignoring direct yes-no questions that could have saved him in some respects. Speaking of how great Venezuela is doing these days was not a positive note, IMO.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Unfortunately Trump didn't speak of any "policy" just a lot of "I will", "I did", and ignoring direct yes-no questions that could have saved him in some respects. Speaking of how great Venezuela is doing these days was not a positive note, IMO.
That part is true. Neither had really expressed detailed ways that they would go about with achieving their goals.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
World trade is good
But like anything, if taken to the extreme it is destructive.
It started with just a little local outsourcing
Then became an industry in itself, led by consultants and money men.
They searched the world for the most easily to be exploited.
The made fortunes by asset stripping American business who could no longer compete.

However little did they know that first Japan, Then Korea and vietnam Taiwan and later China and many other south east asian countries would take technology and manufacturing to another level.

In the meantime the education training and skills of the American People along with their jobs and workplaces had rusted and faded away. The American way of life based on skill and hard work was gone. And no one of importance cared, they were still making money.

In the meantime time along with the jobs and factories,, an even more precious thing had taken root in the east. And that was research and development led by the now largest and highly educated work force in the world.

Along the Way, China had abandoned its communist face and embraced it's own form of capitalism.
And in the last forty years, has come from nowhere to be the arguably largest industrial and technological base in the world and the second largest economy.

Some people in the west are still fooled into thinking that China. Is still a backward nation making shoddy cheap goods. But the truth is that in very many fields they now lead the world and are rapidly catching up in others. They have the most complete supply chains in the world.

Everything is not lost for America, but the position as future world leaders probably is.
Their future is undoubtedly in cooperation with China, not in trying to obstruct it or in trade war with it.

America can not match the Chinese infrastructure or its supply of highly educated workers.
it musts divert its energy and money into rebuilding the things that matter, education, infrastructure, high tech manufacturing, and research. It probably still has the ability to partner with China but it will been a long road to get anywhere near equalling them again. It can not do so by rebuilding the past. It must embrace the new hightec manufacturing world and build its supply chains from scratch.
However there is the real possibility that the American capitalist system is not up to the task as it lacks the cooperative spirit. So apparent in thee East.
I think it also entails the mentality of CEOs where in the old days the chief executive officer was actually invested into his company wanting it to last essentially forever.

Now with today's CEOs, companies are just tools to make profits for themselves and their shareholders, and then once its sucked dry, they abandon the company and go on to another one to drain dry.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Unfortunately Trump didn't speak of any "policy" just a lot of "I will", "I did", and ignoring direct yes-no questions that could have saved him in some respects. Speaking of how great Venezuela is doing these days was not a positive note, IMO.
He loves to adamantly promise things that he has no idea at all how to deliver. And some people believe him. Which I find very strange.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
I very much doubt Harris would be any different.
She wasn't making all those wild promises. Trump was throwing them out there left and right. He knows that no one can disprove a wild promise, so he throws them around like confetti. And there always seems to be a few fools that believe them.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
She wasn't making all those wild promises. Trump was throwing them out there left and right. He knows that no one can disprove a wild promise, so he throws them around like confetti. And there always seems to be a few fools that believe them.
Like fracking, preserving 2nd amendment rights?

Think the chameleon woman will honor those promises?
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Like fracking, preserving 2nd amendment rights?

Think the chameleon woman will honor those promises?
I think as president she will be very limited in what she can and cannot do ... as the Constitution dictates. Trump neither seems to understand nor respect this. And in fact has been promising to ignore and totally disrespect it.
 
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