Why do we find ancient references to 8 people in a large boat in diverse cultures and languages

[whirlingmerc]

For example in the Chinese pictogram for a large boat there are 8 people.
but also Egyptian hieroglyphics reference 8 people in a large barge.
Why so?
Coincidence?
Ancient evidence for Noah?

 

[SalixIncendium]

Because the coxswain wasn't added until more modern times?

 

[whirlingmerc]

Because the coxswain wasn't added until more modern times?

It appears there is an ancient reference to 8 people on a large boat. And from there, early dynasties build on that. The 8 people morphed into an octet of gods

note image from Egyptologist Gavin Cox

 

[nPeace]

For example in the Chinese pictogram for a large boat there are 8 people.
but also Egyptian hieroglyphics reference 8 people in a large barge.
Why so?
Coincidence?
Ancient evidence for Noah?

Eight people in a large vessel in an Asian location from one of the most ancient cultures... That's some huge coincidence.

 

[Father Heathen]

Lord of The Rings features dwarves...but so does Dungeons and Dragons! Explain that.

 

[FragrantGrace]

The earliest recording, 4,250 years old and possibly parts being at least 7,500 years old, is Mesopotamian and in the cuneiform Sumerian text. It is known as the epic of Gilgamesh.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

For example in the Chinese pictogram for a large boat there are 8 people.
but also Egyptian hieroglyphics reference 8 people in a large barge.
Why so?
Coincidence?
Ancient evidence for Noah?

Coincidence, confirmation bias, and highly massaged descriptions of "8 people in a boat".

The far more likely explanation for stories and ideograms of people in boats is that.... many cultures had boats.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Eight people in a large vessel in an Asian location from one of the most ancient cultures... That's some huge coincidence.

Which cultures? Name them?

If you can come up with any that aren't direct cultural successors and predecessors of one another I'll be very surprised.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

View attachment 28807

It appears there is an ancient reference to 8 people on a large boat. And from there, early dynasties build on that. The 8 people morphed into an octet of gods

note image from Egyptologist Gavin Cox

Shocking that various sea faring cultures would have descriptions and artwork featuring boats. No possible explanation except that the Noah story is literal history. Every single depiction of boats can be shoehorned in to support the theory, if you disregard all the inconvenient stuff like, you know, context.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Lord of The Rings features dwarves...but so does Dungeons and Dragons! Explain that.

And Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter features real historical people and places, therefore it's all true.

 

[Audie]

For example in the Chinese pictogram for a large boat there are 8 people.
but also Egyptian hieroglyphics reference 8 people in a large barge.
Why so?
Coincidence?
Ancient evidence for Noah?

Since there was no flood, you tell us.
In the process, be so kind as to say why
there are so many stories of man-god kings
whose destiny is to return to rule.

Oh and mermaids. Why do so many cultures
have mermaids??

 

[nPeace]

Which cultures? Name them?

If you can come up with any that aren't direct cultural successors and predecessors of one another I'll be very surprised.

What did I say? Chinese..."One of the most ancient cultures". Am I wrong.
The 10 Oldest Ancient Civilizations That Have Ever Existed

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

What did I say? Chinese..."One of the most ancient cultures". Am I wrong.
The 10 Oldest Ancient Civilizations That Have Ever Existed

That's one. Now show how that particular Chinese ideogram is so amazingly similar to things in other non contingent cultures? As far as I can see, you want me to be amazed that the Chinese ideogram for "large boat" features a boat, and I just don't find that that amazing.

"船 - "Large boat"
This is actually the Chinese word for a simple "boat" or "ship" (chuán), not some particularly large variant. The correct term and hanzi for "large boat" is 舸 (gě). Japanese, notorious for its homophones, refers to both symbols as fune, which is possibly where this mistake arose.

CMI attempts to break this character down into its components in order to establish a connection to the great Flood:

• 舟 does, when taken on its own, indeed mean "boat" (zhōu);
• 八 is indeed the number "eight" (bā), if used in isolation;
• 口 means "mouth" or "opening" (kǒu). CMI translates it as "people", to which it only has a very tangential relation, as 口 is the measure word for people.[note 2] The actual character for "person" is 人 rén, another common component that obviously does not appear in this character.

An alternative would be to use the character 舩, which also means "boat/ship/vessel" and is pronounced the same (chuán, Jpn. fune), but much less common. Its radicals are:

• 舟 "boat", same as above;
• 八 "eight", same as above;
• 厶 "personal/private", a variant of 私 (sī), which is even more tangential than the connection to "people" above.

The idea behind this setup is to suggest that the character refers to the eight people that were on the Ark: Noah, his wife, their three sons and their wives. However, CMI is making a crucial mistake in disassembling the character completely. What they ignore is the fact that Chinese characters are not made up exclusively of components that provide a meaning, but also of phonetic radicals that are supposed to offer a clue as to how they're pronounced. In both of the cases above, they simply skip this part in order to extract the meaning they want from it. The first character does not feature 八 and 口 as separate components, but rather as the combination 㕣 yǎn, with the (irrelevant) meaning of "marsh". Likewise, the second one features 公 gōng, "public" as the additional component.

Another point which they ignore completely is that there are specific kanji/hanzi for an ark — 方舟 (fāngzhōu) in Chinese or the Japanese 箱舟 hakobune which translates roughly as "square-boat", or "box-boat".[12] Noah's Ark would be ノアの箱舟 — Noa no Hakobune.

The number eight has significance in Chinese culture (e.g., Eight Immortals, Eight Trigrams of the I Ching). Finding yet another eight is unsurprising.

Creationists use this claim to bolster the idea that the Chinese, along with all other cultures, are descended from Noah and his family. Creationists fail to realize that of the two deluge legends from Chinese mythology, one myth involves the flood being averted twice, and the other features a brother, Fuxi, and a sister, Nuwa, survive the flood in a gourd, with all non-divine life perishing. Moreover, the Chinese invented the word "八" 1,800 years ago. Why would the Chinese wait 1,200 years after the Flood to commemorate it in their written language? The claim that Chinese characters commemorate the Noachian Deluge is nonsense.

It may be tempting to argue that the top of 㕣 is actually 几, as that is how it tends to be rendered in Modern Chinese. However, the 几 in the phonetic component 㕣 is actually a 八 in older versions of the character. "

Hanzi of Genesis - RationalWiki

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Since there was no flood, you tell us.
In the process, be so kind as to say why
there are so many stories of man-god kings
whose destiny is to return to rule.

Oh and mermaids. Why do so many cultures
have mermaids??

Dragons, too. Therefore Dungeons and Dragons is true?

 

[nPeace]

That's one. Now show how that particular Chinese ideogram is so amazingly similar to things in other non contingent cultures? As far as I can see, you want me to be amazed that the Chinese ideogram for "large boat" features a boat, and I just don't find that that amazing.

That's not my fight.
What I said was true. I confirmed it.
What you are apparently seeing is in none of my posts, so I am not sure where you are looking, or what you are looking for.

"船 - "Large boat"
This is actually the Chinese word for a simple "boat" or "ship" (chuán), not some particularly large variant. The correct term and hanzi for "large boat" is 舸 (gě). Japanese, notorious for its homophones, refers to both symbols as fune, which is possibly where this mistake arose.

CMI attempts to break this character down into its components in order to establish a connection to the great Flood:

• 舟 does, when taken on its own, indeed mean "boat" (zhōu);
• 八 is indeed the number "eight" (bā), if used in isolation;
• 口 means "mouth" or "opening" (kǒu). CMI translates it as "people", to which it only has a very tangential relation, as 口 is the measure word for people.[note 2] The actual character for "person" is 人 rén, another common component that obviously does not appear in this character.

An alternative would be to use the character 舩, which also means "boat/ship/vessel" and is pronounced the same (chuán, Jpn. fune), but much less common. Its radicals are:

• 舟 "boat", same as above;
• 八 "eight", same as above;
• 厶 "personal/private", a variant of 私 (sī), which is even more tangential than the connection to "people" above.

The idea behind this setup is to suggest that the character refers to the eight people that were on the Ark: Noah, his wife, their three sons and their wives. However, CMI is making a crucial mistake in disassembling the character completely. What they ignore is the fact that Chinese characters are not made up exclusively of components that provide a meaning, but also of phonetic radicals that are supposed to offer a clue as to how they're pronounced. In both of the cases above, they simply skip this part in order to extract the meaning they want from it. The first character does not feature 八 and 口 as separate components, but rather as the combination 㕣 yǎn, with the (irrelevant) meaning of "marsh". Likewise, the second one features 公 gōng, "public" as the additional component.

Another point which they ignore completely is that there are specific kanji/hanzi for an ark — 方舟 (fāngzhōu) in Chinese or the Japanese 箱舟 hakobune which translates roughly as "square-boat", or "box-boat".[12] Noah's Ark would be ノアの箱舟 — Noa no Hakobune.

The number eight has significance in Chinese culture (e.g., Eight Immortals, Eight Trigrams of the I Ching). Finding yet another eight is unsurprising.

Creationists use this claim to bolster the idea that the Chinese, along with all other cultures, are descended from Noah and his family. Creationists fail to realize that of the two deluge legends from Chinese mythology, one myth involves the flood being averted twice, and the other features a brother, Fuxi, and a sister, Nuwa, survive the flood in a gourd, with all non-divine life perishing. Moreover, the Chinese invented the word "八" 1,800 years ago. Why would the Chinese wait 1,200 years after the Flood to commemorate it in their written language? The claim that Chinese characters commemorate the Noachian Deluge is nonsense.

It may be tempting to argue that the top of 㕣 is actually 几, as that is how it tends to be rendered in Modern Chinese. However, the 几 in the phonetic component 㕣 is actually a 八 in older versions of the character. "

Hanzi of Genesis - RationalWiki

Interestingly the Chinese symbol for "boat" or 船 is made of 舟 (which means vessel), 八 (meaning eight) and 口(meaning mouth); 船 literally translate "eight people in the boat". This character was used in the ancient Chinese story of Noah's ark. Many other non-christian countries have similar story line of Noah's ark in the Genesis' account of the Bible. Indians, Sumerians, Egyptians, American Indians and the Peruvians wrote historical account about a universal flood.

CMI misrepresents ancient Chinese language?

 

[whirlingmerc]

The earliest recording, 4,250 years old and possibly parts being at least 7,500 years old, is Mesopotamian and in the cuneiform Sumerian text. It is known as the epic of Gilgamesh.

In the Gilgamesh story, the ark is shaped like a cube with 7 stories. With center of mass in the middle it would roll all over the ocean like a volleyball

The ark of Noah on the other hand is shaped like a very stable boat

 

[whirlingmerc]

That's not my fight.
What I said was true. I confirmed it.
What you are apparently seeing is in none of my posts, so I am not sure where you are looking, or what you are looking for.


Interestingly the Chinese symbol for "boat" or 船 is made of 舟 (which means vessel), 八 (meaning eight) and 口(meaning mouth); 船 literally translate "eight people in the boat". This character was used in the ancient Chinese story of Noah's ark. Many other non-christian countries have similar story line of Noah's ark in the Genesis' account of the Bible. Indians, Sumerians, Egyptians, American Indians and the Peruvians wrote historical account about a universal flood.

CMI misrepresents ancient Chinese language?

Dragons, too. Therefore Dungeons and Dragons is true?

There seem to a pattern of

connections with the Biblical account

 

[whirlingmerc]

That's not my fight.
What I said was true. I confirmed it.
What you are apparently seeing is in none of my posts, so I am not sure where you are looking, or what you are looking for.


Interestingly the Chinese symbol for "boat" or 船 is made of 舟 (which means vessel), 八 (meaning eight) and 口(meaning mouth); 船 literally translate "eight people in the boat". This character was used in the ancient Chinese story of Noah's ark. Many other non-christian countries have similar story line of Noah's ark in the Genesis' account of the Bible. Indians, Sumerians, Egyptians, American Indians and the Peruvians wrote historical account about a universal flood.

CMI misrepresents ancient Chinese language?

The pictograph is pretty clear

 

[whirlingmerc]

That's not my fight.
What I said was true. I confirmed it.
What you are apparently seeing is in none of my posts, so I am not sure where you are looking, or what you are looking for.


Interestingly the Chinese symbol for "boat" or 船 is made of 舟 (which means vessel), 八 (meaning eight) and 口(meaning mouth); 船 literally translate "eight people in the boat". This character was used in the ancient Chinese story of Noah's ark. Many other non-christian countries have similar story line of Noah's ark in the Genesis' account of the Bible. Indians, Sumerians, Egyptians, American Indians and the Peruvians wrote historical account about a universal flood.

CMI misrepresents ancient Chinese language?

It appears there is a good case it is true

 

[nPeace]

There seem to a pattern of View attachment 28808 connections with the Biblical account

Copy cats with a twist. A work of an expert plagiarist artist.