That humans claim to speak for God. That happens a lot.
God, Himself, speaking doesn't seem to happen as far as I can tell.
Tom
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Why do you dislike Islam?
- Thread starter Epic Beard Man
- Start date
God, Himself, speaking doesn't seem to happen as far as I can tell.
Tom
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
quotes have been removed but what on earth do you think that means? will of the people who claim to speak for God? Did you not get the memo? The Qur'an is the speech of God.
No Muslim claims to speak for God - we recite what God revealed in Qur'an through/via our recitation of the Qur'an, in Arabic - and that my dear Luis, is not the same as what you claim. Not even at a stretch.
Try again. Bring ya A-Game
Besides, I was asking about the "whole world is evidence" part - what on earth are you talking about? - that is the question!!!
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
I'm asking for the evidence and you answered the whole world is the evidence,
do you think you're smart, but believe me you aren't and don't ask me for the evidence
because all your posts are the evidence.
Is it that difficult to accept the simple, supreme fact that no one has to agree with you on the Qur'an being "speech of God" - or, for that matter, that there is any god in the first place?
You may doubt my sincerity, but that only means that you are stubborn and wrong.
To think I once thought Islaam was only slightly worse than Christianity...
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
We said it's your opinion, it's about faith, so what you think and believe in
can't be taken seriously because it's just an opinion.
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
The whole Muslim world agrees with me, because I'm not making this up lol - this is the Raison D'être of the Qur'an!
I do doubt it Luis, I find you to be disingenuous and desperately seeking susan in a closet that has "celibate" written on it! I hope the analogy doesn't do a swinging monkey jump over your noggin!
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
Qur'an - Surah Ar Rahmaan (the Beneficent)
Starts with Ar Rahmaan - one of the attributes of God which is The Beneficent, then God says He taught the Qur'an, the most blessed of revelations - but to whom? The next verse He says that He created Man and the one after - taught him Speech - by which he can recite it - the Qur'an.
But you won't understand - this basic cotext and context is far above your stationed ability to study!
peace
But.
That's exactly what you're doing. You are claiming to speak for God.
In post #152 I used the term "invincible ignorance". This is an example of what I was referring to. You speak for God, insisting that God wrote the Qur'an. But God never said any such thing. Humans , Muslims, are always the ones speaking for God.
Tom
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
And I asked for the evidence that God didn't really communicate with a messenger, you think it isn't true but you should have the evidence otherwise
it's your opinion and many have similar opinions as yours but that doesn't make it a fact.
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
look above - while you was busy writing this weird stuff, I was showing you the cotextual and contextual understanding which puts your claim in the bin.
Here you go, I'll post it again so you don't miss it:
Qur'an - Surah Ar Rahmaan (the Beneficent)
Starts with Ar Rahmaan - one of the attributes of God which is The Beneficent, then God says He taught the Qur'an, the most blessed of revelations - but to whom? The next verse He says that He created Man and the one after - taught him Speech - by which he can recite it - the Qur'an.
But you won't understand - this basic cotext and context is far above your stationed ability to study!
peace
EDIT - you know it's amazing. The very usage of the classical Arabic is beyond amazing even. The very opening words - Ar-Rahmaan - don't just reflect the divine attribute of "The Beneficent" - but intone "extremely beneficent, without equal". None were ever called this in Arabia before the revelation of the Qur'an. The very opening words were chest heavingly soul satisfyingly mind blowingly awesome then, and even now 1439 years later! The depth is lost on unilingual speakers of language who have no desire to learn this most amazing of languages - yet somehow claim "If God wanted me to know this, why didn't He reveal it in English?" while they go on to write computer code - irony... deeply devastating irony! Lost over their cuckoo's nests. God help 'em
You are quoting the Qur'an to demonstrate that you are the official spokesman for God?
That's pretty invincible ignorance.
Tom
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
It's time for that facepalm again. You shouldn't use that word "ignorance" mate - unless you place it in your passport as a middle or maiden name
I want your scholarship, not your showmanship! Go learn how to study an holy book.
In another thread, DavidFirth is trying to convince me that he is the true spokesman for God by quoting the NT.
I don't find any of you convincing as spokesmen. But I am left convinced that God doesn't care enough to provide a credible spokesman.
Thats my evidence.
Tom
Mohsen
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
You call that evidence? This subjective nonsense you call evidence? lol
You sure you know how to even measure a claim?
No Muslim here claimed to speak for God - while David Firth apparently did - IF, we are to believe you! But I don't believe you, because you have been caught with your pants down now more than once on this page alone!
Wipe your nose!
You make the big claim,produce evidence of equal stature.
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
It's an evidence that false messengers exist, nothing more.
What I dislike is the idea that Muhammad, a person we can't prove existed is the spokesperson for God.
If he were portrayed as a wise leader, great, we can criticize his wisdom. What I dislike is the claim that he had the authority to speak for God.
For example we could discuss the wisdom of the Burqa and Abaya. As traditional, cultural dress, ok.
I mean I could wear a kilt as a cultural statement I suppose, but it being a commandment from God causes problems for some folks.
Ponder This
Well-Known Member
My biggest objection to the Islamic community as a whole would be their arrogance:
because they have, essentially, the most perfectly preserved revelation... seeing as the Arabic language practically came into existence in relative close proximity with the Qu'ran, unlike other religions (even those who claim to be more recently revealed cannot claim to have their language so closely tied to their revelation and thus be as accurately preserved).
So some of the Muslim community suffers from an arrogance that develops out of the notion that their revelation is more perfect than other revelations and they need to be reminded to remain humble because revelation is given according to the ability of the people to understand.
because they have, essentially, the most perfectly preserved revelation... seeing as the Arabic language practically came into existence in relative close proximity with the Qu'ran, unlike other religions (even those who claim to be more recently revealed cannot claim to have their language so closely tied to their revelation and thus be as accurately preserved).
So some of the Muslim community suffers from an arrogance that develops out of the notion that their revelation is more perfect than other revelations and they need to be reminded to remain humble because revelation is given according to the ability of the people to understand.