Why I’m not atheist or agnostic.

[HonestJoe]

I have a hunch that there is a higher power(s), what we humans call god(s). Relying on my intuition here.

Are you sure you're only relying on intuition? Do you think there could be no social or cultural background that would influence your perception? I can't help noticing that, while you wrote "god(s)" here, you slip back to "god" by the end of the post and refer to "God" in your profile. A subtle but significant difference I hope you recognise.

Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered.

What universe are you living in!?! I'm looking at this screen with a pair of eyes that don't work perfectly! And even with those imperfect eyes, I can look around and see countless other examples without even getting up (which is good, since my knees aren't as perfect as they once were either).

The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.

So something as amazing as our brains couldn't exist without something even more amazing existing to create them? Doesn't that inevitably lead to one of the age-old problems with the idea of a creator god?

Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god? What does it tell you?

No, I use my gut for digesting food. I follow my instincts when it comes to considering any ideas, but I'll always follow that up with evidence, logic and other people's opinions and ideas. I don't find hunches of much use on their own and beyond the most simple things, they're often flawed or incomplete one way or another.

Or, you know, they don't work perfectly.

 

[1137]

And what's more, they can be shown to exist.

Okay? People have been interacting with the Gods for millenia.

Really? So when you see a cliff, you should keep right on running towards it, because there's nothing there at all?

... what? There's a cliff...

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Okay? People have been interacting with the Gods for millenia.

And fairies, and ogres, and flying horses, and spirits made of fire, and pixies, elves, leprechauns, banshees and a whole zoo of other critters they've dreamed up -- and never once in all that time were able to demonstrate for all to see.

And writing a book saying you did something is not evidence that you did it. It's evidence you have an imagination, and can write -- that is all.

 

[Link]

It's perfect only from a perspective of the value of patience, resilience, and trial of humans with humans, good and evil.

It's not perfect in the sense of pleasure and final home. This world is created in truth as a trial to prove ourselves to God and be rewarded in our position in the next.

It also said the world changed as humans became more disobedient. For example, before Nuh it was said that all trees had fruits according to hadiths.

 

[ChristineM]

Life is too trippy for there not to be a god

I would say precisely the opposite,

Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered.

No, no, no, the universe is chaotic on a universal scale with the gravity of every single mass exerting its force on every other mass. Every object falling into the gravity well of every other object.

The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.

I have far greater faith in time and evolution.

Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god?

No,i follow the lack of evidence, and many pointers that tell me.

What does it tell you?

They tell me no gods exist

 

[RestlessSoul]

I have a hunch that there is a higher power(s), what we humans call god(s). Relying on my intuition here.
Life is too trippy for there not to be a god I think. Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered. The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.
Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god? What does it tell you?

Something in me - not sure it’s my gut - has always told me that there’s a God of some description, that life is truly miraculous, and that the fantastic complexity and beauty around us and within us, did not happen by accident.

I would not want to lose touch with that part of me, nor for that voice which only speaks in silence, to be drowned out by worldly clamours. That would be a kind of death before dying, a death of the spirit, preceding the inevitable death of the mind and body.

It seems to me also, that those who trust only their heads and not their hearts, are in as much danger of being led astray by their egos as those of us who are spiritually inclined are of being led astray by our intuition - which, after all, was surely given to us by God or nature for a reason..

 

[Mock Turtle]

I have a hunch that there is a higher power(s), what we humans call god(s). Relying on my intuition here.

Well I have no such intuition. I do have an intuition that religious beliefs are more an expression of the needs of humans though, and that is backed up by the evidence that so many contradict each other and hence all cannot be correct. If any came from a God then such seems to be a rather shoddy mess in my view. And it is mainly from religions as to where any God concepts come from. I do however leave the possibility open as to there being some divine force and hence being agnostic. My intellect tells me this not my intuition, given I know my limitations and assume this is so for so many others too, even the best minds, given we still lack definitive knowledge in so many areas.

Life is too trippy for there not to be a god I think. Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered.

I think you need more knowledge if you think this. Drugs can seemingly simulate religious experiences and life is far from perfect. Plenty of defects are passed on from parents to child, and non-human life is even more unpleasant for so many species. Apart from this, have you looked off Earth? Or do you ignore the vastness out there and where we and our little world are but gnats compared with such. Seems more like chaos than order for most other places. Not even mentioning the 13.8 billion years it took to arrive at the point we are at now and as to the last few tens of thousand years mainly having seen progress in humans. Before this we were more like so many other animals.

The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.

I doubt you would have thought this if living 30,000 years ago. Information has a tendency to build upon itself, and we have been voracious learners, such that we are all too ready to forget what it was like even as to a few hundred years ago.

Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god? What does it tell you?

No. My gut tells me nothing - hence why I am agnostic as to such. My gut is easily pleased I fear.

 

[icehorse]

I have a hunch that there is a higher power(s), what we humans call god(s). Relying on my intuition here.
Life is too trippy for there not to be a god I think. Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered. The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.
Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god? What does it tell you?

My take is that amazing things can evolve, given enough time.

My second thought is that it's hard for me to square the idea of a designer who would be so friggin' cruel.

 

[ppp]

Life is too trippy for there not to be a god I think. Everything works perfectly, the universe is ordered. The potential of our brains and the thoughts it can produce is too amazing (for me) to not be intelligently designed or divine in nature.

Not to put you down. You are probably a fine human. But that line of thinking all looks like ego to me.

Do you follow your gut when it comes to belief in god? What does it tell you?

I don't follow my gut. I generally try to falsify it. My reasoning says that whether or not there was a god, there is no reason to believe that there are any humans who know or are capable of knowing such. No reason to believe that they are or ever have been any humans with the least clue.

 

[Dogknox20]

My take is that amazing things can evolve, given enough time.

My second thought is that it's hard for me to square the idea of a designer who would be so friggin' cruel.

.
icehorse Good to meet you... God is Perfect!
I say... The Cruel you see proves there is Evil!

Can't blame God for the evil in the world! God does all things perfect, if God did not then he would not be God!
God created Adam.. The first perfect man! This perfect man introduced corruption into God' perfect creation! Creation was corrupted by the "Free Will" choice of the perfect man to sin!

"The wages of Sin is death"!

Death entered and from then on man died! All men are sinners! Man needed to be redeemed BUT we were stuck between a rock and a hard spot... We needed another "Perfect Man" but all are born corrupted! That is until God himself became part of his own creation! Jesus was born man so he could die as a perfect man! CAN'T.....

icehorse can't die if first you are not born! Jesus died "Sinless"! Death had no hold on Jesus because he was sinless....

"The wages of Sin is death"!

Jesus rose from death never ever to die again.. No one can die twice.. WHAT...

icehorse what we have to do is get our sorry ssa's immersed (Baptized) into the risen body of Jesus!

.

 

[firedragon]

Not even an informed opinion? I'm underwhelmed. Just out of curiosity, why did you think it to be something worth sharing?

This "gut feeling" thing sounds intuitively invalid. I understand why you asked this question. But it has a profound insight JS.

This "gut feeling" is there in even atheists. Even some atheists believe in a "higher power". I mean they identify as an atheist, but still believe in a higher power.

There was a study done by I think in collaboration with Stanford. Hmm. I could have mistaken the university, so if you wish I can find out and confirm it. This study came up with research findings that showed children are born with this "gut feeling".

Maybe this is more profound than we simplistically consider.

 

[firedragon]

An informed opinion would make on an agnostic I think. Isn’t belief in god simply a deeply rooted conviction that is a hunch? Is belief in god an informed opinion for anyone? Is it for you?
Edit: I always appreciate the dryness of your responses, actually do.

I think you did nail it in some way. There is more to what you say than meets the eye. I am guessing, that even you don't know how profound your OP is. No offence meant.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

This "gut feeling" thing sounds intuitively invalid. I understand why you asked this question. But it has a profound insight JS. ...

Maybe this is more profound than we simplistically consider.

I humbly suggest that you are either romanticizing intuition or abusing the term "profound."

 

[firedragon]

I humbly suggest that you are either romanticizing intuition or abusing the term "profound."

I am not. Because research has shown that humans have this "gut feeling". It's not some thing I cooked up just for an argument. I have even quoted it for your perusal. So why that statement of gut feeling is profound, is because consequential research is making findings that support it, though people call it a gut feeling.

So your suggestion above is conjecture. Especially since I have already given you the research. If you want specific information, just ask for it. I will give you. No problem.

Peace.

 

[icehorse]

icehorse Good to meet you... God is Perfect!
I say... The Cruel you see proves there is Evil!

Nice to meet you.

Well, given that I'm an atheist, we're probably going to have to agree to disagree on the points you made in your post.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I am not. Because research has shown that humans have this "gut feeling".

Nor did I suggest otherwise. You're better than this.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Because research has shown that humans have this "gut feeling".

'Gut feeling' is created by your bringing up, your education, your religion, and your experience of life. That is why different people have different 'gut feelings'. 'Gut feeling' does not equate to truth. When I hear the word God, I do not get the same 'gut feeling' that you might be getting.

 

[firedragon]

'Gut feeling' is created by your bringing up,

You are making conjecture. I quoted actual research.

 

[Audie]

Perhaps I'm just trying to convince myself not to become an atheist ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I don't think one "becomes an atheist", like
you might become a sailor.

What happens is a person finally realizes,
faces the fact, that it's all nonsense and they've been sold a bill of goods.

And forget the labels. Surely you won't
announce you are an A-Nigerian scamist.

Why not just be normal / sensible no- label you.



.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

"

Why not just be normal / sensible no- label you.

.

I agree, but I generally drop the 'normal' part, and often forget to be sensible.