Why I Hate, Hate, Hate Religion!

[Oberon]

You are so incredibly one dimensional. The churches were divided so of course their strongest opposition would come from churches. Not all Christians were anti-Semitic, but enough were in order to cause the holocaust to happen. You're just covering for the anti-Semitic Christians that were Nazis by denying their existence as Christians.

First of all, churches in Germany were not divided. They were overwhelmingly lutheran. Second, The Nazi party discouraged, discriminated against, and persecuted members of ALL christian churches.

Again, where is your evidence that the Nazi party policies did anything to support christianity? Why were the top leadership positions filled by atheists?

I'm not covering for anything. All I'm trying to do is correct your baseless accusations and ill-conceived conceptions of history.

You simply have no knowledge of this period at all, and all you can do is point to propaganda and make ad hominem attacks (any one who disagrees is "covering" for the anti-semitic christians).

 

[dogsgod]

The basic point is that athiestic ideologies have only in the last century been responsible for almost as many deaths (perhaps more) than religion in the last thousand plus years.

Moa, Statlin, Hitlre, Pol Pot, Kim Jong-il, and a number of other communist or otherwise atheistic regimes have collectively murdered and exterminated hundreds of millions of people.

There is no such thing as an atheistic ideology, it's simply propaganda rhetoric spewed out by the ignorant.

 

[Storm]

You are so incredibly one dimensional.

 

[Storm]

There is no such thing as an atheistic ideology, it's simply propaganda rhetoric spewed out by the ignorant.

Of course there is. That's not to say that atheism itself is or holds an ideology, but they're not the same thing.

 

[Alla Prima]

You have never challenged the assertion that the Nazi party was based on Christianity, you have simply denied it.

I don't know how you got that. The Nazi party was based on German racial superiority. It's goals were nationalist expansionism and antisemitism.

 

[Oberon]

There is no such thing as an atheistic ideology, it's simply propaganda rhetoric spewed out by the ignorant.

This statement is so ridiculous and ill informed I can't believe it. Anti-religious atheism formed an intergral part of the ideologies of the various regimes I referred to.

 

[dogsgod]

Of course there is. That's not to say that atheism itself is or holds an ideology, but they're not the same thing.

You have yet to support anything you state. If there is such a thing as atheistic ideology then explain it to us.

 

[Storm]

Anti-theism, in all its flavors, is atheistic ideology.

 

[dogsgod]

This statement is so ridiculous and ill informed I can't believe it. Anti-religious atheism formed an intergral part of the ideologies of the various regimes I referred to.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's you pointing over there to books and websites and saying that's what I referred to. You've explained nothing.

 

[dogsgod]

Anti-theism, in all its flavors, is atheistic ideology.

I thought so.

 

[Storm]

I thought so.

Good, we finally agree on something.

 

[Oberon]

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's you pointing over there to books and websites and saying that's what I referred to. You've explained nothing.

I know, I point to sources rather than your baseless rhetoric. How foolish of me.

"There's no such thing as an atheistic ideology."

So when a marxist-based communist regime like Mao's or Stalin's avidly persecutes religious expression and promotes atheism as an ideal, that's not ideology?

Let's pick up the dictionary I have nearest to me and check out what ideology means:
"A set of doctrines or beliefs that form the basis of a political, economic, or other system"

So a set of anti-religious and atheistic beliefs of a political regime fits quite well as "atheistic ideology." And if you want to argue that Mao and Stalin and so on did not express such beliefs, I would be more than happy to go over that, because they are even more radically opposed to religion than hitler, who at least used pro-christian propaganda, despite his anti-christian policies.

 

[ChristineES]

We already know there are Christian anti-semitics, what we are trying to make you and others see is that only a small percentage of Christians are anti-semitic. Putting the holocaust on all Christians isn't right. The Nazis were a group of hatred, and Hitler was the leader of that group. And even if Hitler said he was a Christian, it doesn't mean he was acting like one when he and the Nazis killed those 9 million people (6 million of whom were Jewish). Killing those people, exterminating them, goes against all of Jesus' teachings. That is what we are trying to get you to understand.

 

[Oberon]

That is what we are trying to get you to understand.

Getting dogsgod to understand anything that doesn't fit into his preconceived biases is an exercise in futility. Even when there isn't some ridiculous website out there he can point to (as he seems to have something against actual books, especially those written by specialists), he can always fall back on rhetoric and basless mantras.

 

[sojourner]

Unconditional? What if the person is really, really ugly...

Nope. God loves my ex-wife, too.

 

[sojourner]

I was once told on a Christian board that I was going to hell because I like Star Trek. (and I am not making that up, though I wish I was).

Have they really nothing better to do with their time than to intimidate and tear down the self-esteem of nerds?
Bullies!

 

[sojourner]

I have to go with Smoke. What you have been posting around here for the past few days is so (there is no polite way to say this) so odd as to be unrecognizable as Christianity. And would indeed get you in deep trouble with any mainstream Christian church - HRC or not.

Actually, I'm affiliated with two mainstream Christian bodies. And I've held standing in both. Most UMC, DOC, UCC and ECUSA churches are open to this stuff, among others.

 

[ChristineES]

Have they really nothing better to do with their time than to intimidate and tear down the self-esteem of nerds?
Bullies!

Nerds are people ,too.

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

We already know there are Christian anti-semitics, what we are trying to make you and others see is that only a small percentage of Christians are anti-semitic. Putting the holocaust on all Christians isn't right. The Nazis were a group of hatred, and Hitler was the leader of that group. And even if Hitler said he was a Christian, it doesn't mean he was acting like one when he and the Nazis killed those 9 million people (6 million of whom were Jewish). Killing those people, exterminating them, goes against all of Jesus' teachings. That is what we are trying to get you to understand.

This is true today, most Christians are not anti-semitic. I also agree that Jew hating goes against the grain of the ideas of the New Testament but this is not the whole story.

Anti-Semitism has been a problem in Europe for over thousand years. This is why the Holocaust was called the final solution, every thing ease has been tried. The Ukrainian Cossck Bohdan Khmelnytsky killed many Jews. The number of the dead may never be known, but estimates range from fifteen thousand to thirty thousand. All of European History is filled with Jew Hate.

The Christian reformation was founded on Jew hating. Martin Luther wrote a book called “On the Jews and their lies” some quotes from this book.

From Luther's Introduction On Jews and there Lies

“I had made up my mind to write no more either about the Jews or against them. But since I learned that these miserable and accursed people do not cease to lure to themselves even us, that is, the Christians, I have published this little book, so that I might be found among those who opposed such poisonous activities of the Jews who warned the Christians to be on their guard against them. I would not have believed that a Christian could be duped by the Jews into taking their exile and wretchedness upon himself. However, the devil is the god of the world, and wherever God's word is absent he has an easy task, not only with the weak but also with the strong. May God help us. Amen.”

One more Quote from this forgotten book.

“Moreover, they are nothing but thieves and robbers who daily eat no morsel and wear no thread of clothing which they have not stolen and pilfered from us by means of their accursed usury. Thus they live from day to day, together with wife and child, by theft and robbery, as arch-thieves and robbers, in the most impenitent security.”

-Martin Luther (On the Jews and Their Lies)

What did the other founders of the Protestant movement say about the Jews.

”Their [the Jews] rotten and unbending stiffneckedness deserves that they be oppressed unendingly and without measure or end and that they die in their misery without the pity of anyone.”

---Excerpt from "Ad Quaelstiones et Objecta Juaei Cuiusdam Responsio," by John Calvin;

There is no getting around european anti-semitic beliefs. Christian thought has been steeped in it for a very long time.

 

[ChristineES]

I do understand what you are saying, wannabe yogi, and I don't disagree with it. What I am trying to point out that hating Jews is against what Jesus Himself taught. I guess it is a good thing that Jesus and His earliest followers were not European.