"Why Is It That Atheists Don't Believe In God?"

[TransmutingSoul]

Humanism also originated from God.

Very much so, I would agree.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

My father was a staunch atheist. I'm a staunch Hindu. You were born into a Baha'i family?

No, a lot would not be, but I would bet a million their influence is still in our Current Frame of Reference.

It could very well be the Atheists views of ones father, still permeates our current belief. I know my fathers views still plague me in thought from time to time.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Fear of God is not what people think it is. Once a while back I was discussing this with one of my atheist friends on another forum and I went to the trouble of making up a Word document with all the references in Gleanings to fear of God, and I was surprised at what I found. I know you do not like scriptures posted to you so I will spare you those. I am not even sure where I put that Word doc. Maybe I will paraphrase the gist if I can find it. As I recall fear of God means reverence towards God, not fear that God is a-gonna getcha.

Did you come to the conclusion that the fear of God, is the fear or our own selves removing ourselves from the Light, the Love? That G0d will leave us to ourselves or test us with the good of this world and the next?

Would be interested to hear.

Regards Tony

 

[ArtieE]

Just because one does not believe in Jesus or God does not mean that this teaching did not originate from them. Humanists have simply taken what they like and used that but left behind what they don’t agree with

LOL humanists haven't taken anything from Jesus or God. Anybody with half a brain understands that it's better for a society and its people to love your neighbors instead of hating them and to not cheat or lie or steal or murder. Now, if that is something you personally needed to be taught and commanded to do and you think that goes for everybody else too you have a big problem...

 

[Trailblazer]

Did you come to the conclusion that the fear of God, is the fear or our own selves removing ourselves from the Light, the Love? That G0d will leave us to ourselves or test us with the good of this world and the next?

Would be interested to hear.

Well, not exactly, but here is something along those lines....

“Cleanse from your hearts the love of worldly things, from your tongues every remembrance except His remembrance, from your entire being whatsoever may deter you from beholding His face, or may tempt you to follow the promptings of your evil and corrupt inclinations. Let God be your fear, O people, and be ye of them that tread the path of righteousness.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 275​

There are a lot more "fear of God" quotes in my trusty Word document, but I do not want to overburden anyone. This one just happens to be my favorite and straight to the point.

 

[ArtieE]

Early Hinduism is the Vedic texts or Vedic scriptures. All teachings by Jesus that observe compassion for others were already in Vedic text 3000 years earlier.
When I first read some of them I was like "hey this sounds like the new-age conceptions of Jesus?"


The Hindus, followers of the oldest of the religions now being practiced, believe that one’s own Self or Soul is reallly identical with the Self or Soul of all other creatures. Hence one who injures another injures oneself. In the Hindu Vedas, “Love your neighbor as yourself'” is an inherent precept of unity with the absolute self, ‘That art thou’ (tat tvam asi). So, it follows that because one loves oneself, one is bound to love one’s neighbor, who is not different from oneself”

“This is the sum of duty; do naught onto others what you would not have them do unto you.” (Mahabharata 5,1517)

“One should not behave towards others in a way which is disagreeable to oneself. This is the essence of morality. All other activities are due to selfish desire.” (Mahabharata, Anusasana Parva 113.8)

loverofhumanity, are the Vedic texts also from your god?

 

[Vinayaka]

No, a lot would not be, but I would bet a million their influence is still in our Current Frame of Reference.

It could very well be the Atheists views of ones father, still permeates our current belief. I know my fathers views still plague me in thought from time to time.

Regards Tony

In the old days when family was more important, and kids didn't move away so much, took over their father's business, and all that, i think it's true. But these days, with globalisation, and people moving away for years, or forever, I think the parental influence has diminished a ton. These days kids go to other sources than their parents. In other words, our parents had more influence on us, that we do on our kids. Changing times is all, neither a good thing nor a bad thing.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

It is not that the Christians do not believe that teaching, it is that they do not follow that teaching. Do you understand the difference?

Ah, but you see, the real key is this: they suppose that there is infinite punishment for not following Christ's teachings, and infinite reward for doing so. That is why I used the analogy of the stove burner. I do not put my hand there because I truly believe in the result. The Christian who truly believes what he thinks he believes could no more not follow than I could put my hand on the burner. Therefore, I contend that the belief is not deeply real part of their existence.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

You can lash out with all the defensive self-proclamations you want, but all of the posts I've read or your's are nothing but those of a over the top negative tiny closed mind. All you bring to the table here is complete negativity, and trying with all your might to drag everyone down to your low level of negativity. Making all of your above bravado for nothing, your posts here only show me that you are dead inside and filled with negative emotions. So I still find my statement correct.

So I just have to ask, why is it so important to you to come here and force everyone to close their minds and accept your tiny closed minded and limited view of the world?

Because I love watching those who think they are so spiritually superior that they have to resort to vituperative bile like you just spilled. The contradiction is genuinely amusing.

 

[Ancient Soul]

Because I love watching those who think they are so spiritually superior that they have to resort to vituperative bile like you just spilled. The contradiction is genuinely amusing.

Thank you for so eloquently proving my points that you are completely dead inside and have nothing but energy sucking negativity and hate to bring to the table.

Also thanks for showing everyone that you are here bashing everyone in a religious forum and don't even know what "spiritual" even means. I find that funny.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Thank you for so eloquently proving my points that you are completely dead inside and have nothing but energy sucking negativity and hate to bring to the table.

Also thanks for showing everyone that you are here bashing everyone in a religious forum and don't even know what "spiritual" even means. I find that funny.

I shall try to be reasonable, and a little less combative than you are being at the moment. Terms like "completely dead inside" and "energy sucking negativity" are, after all, just a little bit on the ad hominem side of the argument spectrum, for which you should probably be reported, but I can't be bothered. In spite of what you think, I am not "bashing," I am engaged in philosophical debate. If that's not to your taste, perhaps you should not engage, but at this point, you are, in fact, the one "bashing."

Perhaps you haven't noticed what the subject matter of this thread is, which is "Why Is It That Atheists Don't Believe In God?"

Now, let me point out that I am quite qualified to provide answers to that question, since I am one of those atheists being referred to. And throughout all of my answers in this thread, I have been very careful to provide actual reasons and arguments for why I do not believe in such a thing. Those people who find my reasons and arguments tiresome, as I presume that you do, mostly counter with some variant on "I can't think of any other answer." But you see, "I can't think of any other answer" does not equate to "therefore, GOD!"

Now, as it happens, I have been studying the question of why the universe exists for some time...to the best of my limited ability. I don't know the answer yet, but what I do know is that there is an immense amount of solid, scientific and philosophical thought on the matter, much of which does not seem to require the need for God at all. And I know something else, too. If, in the end, the search winds up actually requiring a "need for God," that still will tell you absolutely nothing, because then, for the same reason that "why is there something rather than nothing" begs for an explanation, "why is there a God rather than no God" would require nothing less. And that might be an even more difficult conundrum than the existence of the universe.

So despise me all you like, but take at least a few minutes to think, rather than just spew venom at those for whom you can come up with no better argument.

 

[Ancient Soul]

Thank you for so eloquently proving my points that you are completely dead inside and have nothing but energy sucking negativity and hate to bring to the table.

Also thanks for showing everyone that you are here bashing everyone in a religious forum and don't even know what "spiritual" even means. I find that funny.

I shall try to be reasonable, and a little less combative than you are being at the moment. Terms like "completely dead inside" and "energy sucking negativity" are, after all, just a little bit on the ad hominem side of the argument spectrum, for which you should probably be reported, but I can't be bothered. In spite of what you think, I am not "bashing," I am engaged in philosophical debate. If that's not to your taste, perhaps you should not engage, but at this point, you are, in fact, the one "bashing."

Perhaps you haven't noticed what the subject matter of this thread is, which is "Why Is It That Atheists Don't Believe In God?"

Now, let me point out that I am quite qualified to provide answers to that question, since I am one of those atheists being referred to. And throughout all of my answers in this thread, I have been very careful to provide actual reasons and arguments for why I do not believe in such a thing. Those people who find my reasons and arguments tiresome, as I presume that you do, mostly counter with some variant on "I can't think of any other answer." But you see, "I can't think of any other answer" does not equate to "therefore, GOD!"

Now, as it happens, I have been studying the question of why the universe exists for some time...to the best of my limited ability. I don't know the answer yet, but what I do know is that there is an immense amount of solid, scientific and philosophical thought on the matter, much of which does not seem to require the need for God at all. And I know something else, too. If, in the end, the search winds up actually requiring a "need for God," that still will tell you absolutely nothing, because then, for the same reason that "why is there something rather than nothing" begs for an explanation, "why is there a God rather than no God" would require nothing less. And that might be an even more difficult conundrum than the existence of the universe.

So despise me all you like, but take at least a few minutes to think, rather than just spew venom at those for whom you can come up with no better argument.

And everything in this post of your's, and all of your other posts, only reinforces what I stated, you are full of negativity and hatred, and dead inside.

And I see that you totally avoided the fact that you spewed out your venom for my not being "spiritual", but have no idea what "spiritual" actually is.

Got anything uplifting or POSITIVE to add to these forums?

You can do it if you TRY!

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

And everything in this post of your's, and all of your other posts, only reinforces what I stated, you are full of negativity and hatred, and dead inside.

And I see that you totally avoided the fact that you spewed out your venom for my not being "spiritual", but have no idea what "spiritual" actually is.

Got anything uplifting or POSITIVE to add to these forums?

You can do it if you TRY!

Well, little person with the "ancient soul," if I do have something positive, perhaps a thread dedicated to the topic that this one is would not be the right place. Or do you suggest that I should hijack the thread so that I can satisfy you? I believe that is considered rude, in forums such as these...

 

[Trailblazer]

Ah, but you see, the real key is this: they suppose that there is infinite punishment for not following Christ's teachings, and infinite reward for doing so. That is why I used the analogy of the stove burner. I do not put my hand there because I truly believe in the result. The Christian who truly believes what he thinks he believes could no more not follow than I could put my hand on the burner. Therefore, I contend that the belief is not deeply real part of their existence.

Hmmmmmm........
Ah, but you see, the real key is this: they suppose that there is infinite punishment for not believing that Christ died on the cross to remove their sins, and infinite reward for believing that.

The Christian who truly believes what he thinks he believes (that Jesus bled for him to remove his sins) could no more not follow than you could put your hand on the burner.
Therefore, I contend that this belief is a deeply real part of their existence.

 

[Ancient Soul]

Well, little person with the "ancient soul," if I do have something positive, perhaps a thread dedicated to the topic that this one is would not be the right place. Or do you suggest that I should hijack the thread so that I can satisfy you? I believe that is considered rude, in forums such as these...

That's ok, I had my HAZMAT venom proof suit on, so all the venom of hatred you just spewed out did no real harm. I'll just go hose it all off now.

But thanks for showing everyone that I was right, that you can only bring your hate and negativity to the table.

 

[loverofhumanity]

LOL humanists haven't taken anything from Jesus or God. Anybody with half a brain understands that it's better for a society and its people to love your neighbors instead of hating them and to not cheat or lie or steal or murder. Now, if that is something you personally needed to be taught and commanded to do and you think that goes for everybody else too you have a big problem...

Anyone understands? How did people come to understand it? Where’s your history showing people learning these things? I’ve shown where these concepts originated from can you?

People aren’t born knowing right from wrong or good from bad or moral from immoral. They are educated by knowledge passed down from generations which I firmly believe originates from the Holy Scriptures. Records exist proving this fact.

Billions of people were educated by their religions past and present.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Early Hinduism is the Vedic texts or Vedic scriptures. All teachings by Jesus that observe compassion for others were already in Vedic text 3000 years earlier.
When I first read some of them I was like "hey this sounds like the new-age conceptions of Jesus?"


The Hindus, followers of the oldest of the religions now being practiced, believe that one’s own Self or Soul is reallly identical with the Self or Soul of all other creatures. Hence one who injures another injures oneself. In the Hindu Vedas, “Love your neighbor as yourself'” is an inherent precept of unity with the absolute self, ‘That art thou’ (tat tvam asi). So, it follows that because one loves oneself, one is bound to love one’s neighbor, who is not different from oneself”

“This is the sum of duty; do naught onto others what you would not have them do unto you.” (Mahabharata 5,1517)

“One should not behave towards others in a way which is disagreeable to oneself. This is the essence of morality. All other activities are due to selfish desire.” (Mahabharata, Anusasana Parva 113.8)

Yes all religions teach the golden rule. I agree that the oldest recorded religion may be Hinduism but I believe there existed religions well before Hinduism that we have no record of.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Your cherry picking. Jesus speaks of everlasting hellfire and the whole movement requires humans to be these awful inborn "sinners" and god needs all sorts of blood sacrifice to forgive?
God--"oh no don't kill your son, I was kidding, kill lots of animals.
Passover, Yom-kippur, temple sacrifice, killing goats all over the place?
Super magic blood atonement of a demi-god brings the followers extra long forgiveness??? This obsession with sacrificial substitutionary magic blood atonement is
complete Bronze age nonsense. If there is a god it has no likeness to this ridiculous mythology.

Love your neighbor comes natural to thinking animals. Gorillas do it as well so the idea that it requires some god intervention is a fail.

For the last time, humans lived for up to 200,000 years without civilization. They would not have survived if they were all savages. They even honored their dead.
The aptitude for friendship and compassion that the gorilla KoKo showed throughout her life was not unlike human behavior.

Sorry, it's built in as a survival mechanism.

Jesus was only used as an example. I am of the belief that since history began God has sent Educators to help us develop spiritually. That records do not exist is no proof that they did not exist.

 

[Quintessence]

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[ArtieE]

Anyone understands? How did people come to understand it? Where’s your history showing people learning these things? I’ve shown where these concepts originated from can you? People aren’t born knowing right from wrong or good from bad or moral from immoral.

"religions are not the source of moral codes but, rather, social enforcers of instinctive moral behavior." An Evolutionary Theory of Right and Wrong
The Moral Life of Babies