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Why is there a Hell?

ID_Neon

Member
I was noticing such statements as "why does God need to burn me in Hell if I don't believe in Him."

Such a statement requires that we have some authoritative thread that simply in the OP quells any room for questions such as this.

The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?
 

Iti oj

Global warming is real and we need to act
Premium Member
I was noticing such statements as "why does God need to burn me in Hell if I don't believe in Him."

Such a statement requires that we have some authoritative thread that simply in the OP quells any room for questions such as this.

The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?
i understood this best after reading inferno

the real argument against hell is if God is all loving and all forgiving... if these were so God would welcome us anyways. unless the true creator of hell is humans?
 
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ID_Neon

Member
God is creator of everything but by virtue of creating humans He necessarily created Hell.

It's not a punishment, it's a result of our straying away from God.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
I was noticing such statements as "why does God need to burn me in Hell if I don't believe in Him."

Such a statement requires that we have some authoritative thread that simply in the OP quells any room for questions such as this.

The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?

Justice is when the punishment fits the crime. No human being is capable of any offense that's proportionate to burning for all eternity. Therefore eternal damnation is an unjust concept, and no being of infinite love and understanding would ever permit such a thing.

Also, how does one stray from something that's ultimately all pervasive and all encompassing? If hell is separation from god, and ones stint in hell is eternal, what's the force that prevents them from returning to god?
 
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Madhuri

RF Goddess
Staff member
Premium Member
I think that portrays a particular interpretation of what hell is, of what it means to be 'separate' from God, assuming this is even possible. I personally believe that if God is everywhere and in everything, it is impossible to be separate, except in our belief/illusion of separation.

In my religious upbringing (Hinduism) I have learned that in the material existence, there are heavenly and hellish planets as well as those such as Earth, in the middle. Hell is not a punishment from God. In fact, we are not judged by God at all. Where we go is a result of our karma (actions) and state of consciousness. As a simple example, a person who spends their life on drugs, scamming people, living in ignorance, being selfish etc. has a very 'low' state of consciousness. This alone will cause the soul to be attracted to a place with low consciousness. Hellish planets are such places. They are full of selfish beings and suffering (because suffering comes from selfishness).

The heavenly planets are obviously the opposite of that. And Earth (or similar planets) is somewhere in the middle because you can experience either reality here.

So my understanding of hell is that it is not a place set up by God to punish us. It is a place (places) that exists of our own making. It is not an eternal existence. Wherever we are, the experiences help us learn and grow and eventually we rise higher and higher. It is a personal progression, where we ultimately reach a state of enlightenment and escape the cycle of birth and death to be in the unity of God.

In my opinion, the Christian and Islamic concept of hell is too simple, especially when hell is considered to be an actual place and one that involves fire or burning. I do not understand how separation from God equals eternal burning. Nor do I even understand how it is possible to have any separation from God beyond perceptual experience.

I especially do not see the logic of defining free will as the choice between choosing God over not choosing God (or choosing evil). Free will is having the choice to make your own decisions; do what you want. It is a sort of freedom. But when the choice is 1) faith in something you do not even know is real or 2) eternal damnation, it is not a fair choice. That makes me think of the famous quote 'an offer he can't refuse'. If this is reality, then free will is a curse because without free will there would be no exposure to 'evil', there would be no natural pull toward things that are considered 'sinful'. This 'free will' seems to only give us biological and psychological urges to do things that we would apparently not have without 'free will'.

In other words, I do not think that the concept of hell you have presented makes much sense at all. I do not think that a God who creates hell as a place of eternal punishment or suffering makes much sense at all. I do not think that a God who requires blind faith makes much sense at all. I do not think that the Abrahamic concept of free will makes much sense at all.
 
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not nom

Well-Known Member
The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?

but it's described as something god does to people. without compelling arguments you can't just simply redefine it to be something people "choose" -- how would they do that, anyway?
 

Iti oj

Global warming is real and we need to act
Premium Member
but it's described as something god does to people. without compelling arguments you can't just simply redefine it to be something people "choose" -- how would they do that, anyway?
I have heard humans say that.... i cant think of a time when i heard God say that...in all seriousness, maybe its not something god sends us too but something god tries to protect us from. im not sure what the scriptures say probably both... i wish i still had GODBAR
 
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ID_Neon

Member
but it's described as something god does to people. without compelling arguments you can't just simply redefine it to be something people "choose" -- how would they do that, anyway?

Not really? Cite the scripture of where Hell is a verb such as damnation?

Because the word damnati comes from the Gladiatorial arena, not the Bible.

Being sent to Hell is ... abscent from the Bible. It is actually explained by Jesus as a result of choice, not a condition bestowed upon you by God.
 
To satisfy the requirement of the inherent dualism prevalent in homo sapiens sapiens. Monotheism assumes a singularity yet science has yet to find a monopole (along with god, of course); I consider science more relevant to my being than theology.

For me, hell is absurd; being an atheist, it seems hell is just for me, according to many xtians I encounter. ;)

Information has no polarity, it simply exists; hell is merely a filter to aid an individual in sifting "bad" information, which may lead in immoral behavior, from other information.
 
To satisfy the requirement of the inherent dualism prevalent in homo sapiens sapiens. Monotheism assumes a singularity yet science has yet to find a monopole (along with god, of course); I consider science more relevant to my being than theology.

For me, hell is absurd; being an atheist, it seems hell is just for me, according to many xtians I encounter. ;)

Information has no polarity, it simply exists; hell is merely a filter to aid an individual in sifting "bad" information, which may lead in immoral behavior, from other information.

Stole my thunder, though I would not have been nearly as articulate.:)
 

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
I'm a theist (panentheist, specifically) and I don't believe in Hell. A purgatory like place, I'm a bit more open to, but a realm of punishment for all eternity? Doesn't make sense to me.

The concept of Hell seems too foreign for me to be comfortable with. I don't think such a place could be rationalized.
 

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I was noticing such statements as "why does God need to burn me in Hell if I don't believe in Him."

Such a statement requires that we have some authoritative thread that simply in the OP quells any room for questions such as this.

The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?

A hell of torment is a common teaching in many religions, including professed Christians, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Islam. The Bible does not teach that God will torment people endlessly in Hellfire. The words rendered Hell in some Bible translations are Sheol and Hades. As used in the Bible, these represent mankind's common grave. Revelation 20:13 speaks of death and hell giving up the dead in them. Thus hell will be destroyed forever after all those in hades or hell are resurrected.
 

not nom

Well-Known Member
Not really? Cite the scripture of where Hell is a verb such as damnation?

that's a noun.

Being sent to Hell is ... abscent from the Bible. It is actually explained by Jesus as a result of choice, not a condition bestowed upon you by God.

yeah, right. "don't fear the one who can kill you, but the one who can kill you and send you to hell". to name just one. you just make this stuff up as you go along really.

and you didn't answer the question -- how does one reject god?

there are 50 groups claiming that you reject god by rejecting their specific teaching. but GOD occurs nowhere in that.

so when you say people choose hell, you're just making stuff up because it makes you feel that makes the puzzle pieces fit together. well, it doesn't. try again.
 
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fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
Do you think that fear is why there is a hell or why it is taught that there is a hell?
I think fear was the catalyst that created the idea of hell (at least for Christians. I would have no idea for Eastern religions). I say this because, at least in Judaism, there wasn't a concept of hell. When we start seeing the idea emerge, it came out with the idea of God being a just one. Many Jews had suffered, died, and seemingly had nothing to show for it even though God had promised them various things (such as a kingdom).

So the idea of a general resurrection or some sort of afterlife began, as a justification for doing what God wanted. However, I would also say that it was a motivation to be good.

The idea of hell was developing around the same time, and when we see it taught, it was in regards to being good, or you would be sent there. So I see it as a motivation to be good from the beginning.

(I do want to mention that I over simplified all of this for sake of the discussion).
 

Me Myself

Back to my username
I was noticing such statements as "why does God need to burn me in Hell if I don't believe in Him."

Such a statement requires that we have some authoritative thread that simply in the OP quells any room for questions such as this.

The most basic answer is any separation from God is Hell, and our separation from God is partially, our choice. God can only reveal Himself to us so far, the rest of the decision is upon us.

God didn't make Hell except in that by creating freewill, allowing us to make a choice, Hell is a necessary choice. Without that choice we could not have freewill.

I think that satisfactorily summarizes the logical argument for Hell?

If I can choose not to be where God is, then God is not omnipresent.

If the amount of God in my surroundings is measured by my free will, then hell is not eternal.
 
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