Woman says legacy restaurants are closing because nobody will work for them

[Colt]

Guess why.

‘I’ve gotten $0 checks’: Woman says legacy restaurants are closing because nobody will work for them

'Call me evil but theyre getting what they deserve.'

www.dailydot.com

“And it’s hilarious,” Queen Tay continues. “People are literally commenting, ‘I’ll work for you for $16 an hour’; ‘Give me $18 an hour, and I’ll start tomorrow.’ Do you want to know the gag? Every single one of these restaurants pay $2.13 an hour—servers are getting paid $2.13 an hour.”

“People were already going through poverty here,” she says. “Imagine. This is the poorest state in the country. When the recession hits, we were already at the bottom. We’ve been at the bottom for 30-plus years; we went lower. Everybody’s fed up here. So these managers and owners who are owning generational wealth-building restaurants that are very big names in the South and are 80-plus years old are willing to let that company die at 80 years old because they want to cry from their BMW and mansion and get a friend to go crying for them on Facebook saying, ‘No one will work for us for $2.13 an hour, boo hoo.'”
...
One viewer wrote, “I made $2.13 an hour plus tips as a server…back in 1999. The fact it’s still the same in 2024 is insane!!!”

What business do you own, or did you start? What are your margins for the restaurant that you own?

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

There are plenty of places where there are no other employers hiring.

And if you're unemployed and looking for low-wage work, odds are you don't have enough money in your chequing account to cover first and last month at a new place along with moving expenses in order to be somewhere where the job market is better.

Is it the responsibility of a business to provide housing to people? or pay for them to move?

Again: it's unethical to take advantage of someone's coerced position. Not all unethical things are illegal.

What coercion?

In your mind, does "barely meets the minimum the law requires" imply "ethical"? That's what we're talking about here.

I answered the question. If I owned a business I may do business differently but businesses are expected to follow the laws.

You misunderstand what happened in California.

Those Pizza Huts decided to get rid of their staff drivers (at $20/h) to replace them with app-based services. The drivers for those app-based services have a minimum wage of $26/h while driving. Pizza Hut would have had to pay minimum wage for their drivers' standby time, but app-based services get to pay $0/h for driver standby time.

... so the California thing isn't about where the minimum wage should be; it's about the situations when employers are allowed to pay workers nothing at all.

Ok

So when you said "too much," it wasn't like you had a particular level of poverty that you think a minimum wage worker ought to live in?

I am not sure what you are asking.

Interesting way to dance around my question.

Automation technology gets cheaper all the time. If the break-even point for some system is $20/h today, it's going to be $10/h in 6 months, and $5/h 6 months after that, then $2.50/h, then $1.25/h, etc.

A job that's vulnerable to automation will get automated no matter what the wage is. Arguing that we shouldn't increase the minimum wage because of automation risks shows a misunderstanding of reality.

Is it not true that the higher the wages the more attractive automation is going to be? Automation may create a net more jobs (designers, technicians, installers etc.) but it reduces the lower paying jobs that are needed.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

The areas in my state with the highest minimum wages ($19.71/hr-20.28/hr) has lower unemployment rates than areas in my state with the State minimum wage ($16.28/hr.)

Why is this the case? How has increased wages led to lower unemployment? What are the unemployment rates? Where is your data?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Is it the responsibility of a business to provide housing to people? or pay for them to move?

It's the ethical responsibility of a business to pay as much to a desperate employee who has no other options as they would to an employee who could leave tomorrow for a city where they'd instantly have five job offers.

What coercion?

The coercion inherent in someone knowing that they'll be evicted or go hungry without the specific job they have (or are applying for).

I answered the question. If I owned a business I may do business differently but businesses are expected to follow the laws.

So you're fine with many behaviours normally considered unethical.

I am not sure what you are asking.

What do you think is the appropriate level of squalor for a minimum wage worker? What small discretionary things - or basic necessities - would make you say "whoa whoa - those workers have it too good! Don't set the minimum wage that high!"

Is it not true that the higher the wages the more attractive automation is going to be? Automation may create a net more jobs (designers, technicians, installers etc.) but it reduces the lower paying jobs that are needed.

Missing the point.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

It's the ethical responsibility of a business to pay as much to a desperate employee who has no other options as they would to an employee who could leave tomorrow for a city where they'd instantly have five job offers.

Now we are talking about employees not applicants. They should pay each employee the same if they are doing the same job with the same experience. Paying one more over another because of a personal situation is unethical. Should a man get paid more because he has a family to support over a woman that does not have a family to support and are doing the same job with the same experience?

The coercion inherent in someone knowing that they'll be evicted or go hungry without the specific job they have (or are applying for).

How do companies know an applicant is in this situation?

So you're fine with many behaviours normally considered unethical.

No.

What do you think is the appropriate level of squalor for a minimum wage worker? What small discretionary things - or basic necessities - would make you say "whoa whoa - those workers have it too good! Don't set the minimum wage that high!"

I have no idea. But the fact is an employer is not responsible for the employees situation. What I am hearing you say is that an employer has to take into account the personal financial situation of an applicant and pay them accordingly based on that and not based on their ability, experience or potential value to the company.

Missing the point.

I don't think so.

 

[Pogo]

What business do you own, or did you start? What are your margins for the restaurant that you own?

It happens if you are in a jurisdiction that assumes a certain tip income and the non-cash income does not cover the taxes. It happens a lot in low wage cash tip situations. Not so common with advent of credit card payment.

 

[Colt]

Businesses will respond, likely not as you expect or want.
Increased labor costs will inevitably have consequences,
eg, raising prices, changing staff, reducing staff, adding
automation, changing hours. It could be one or a mix
of those.
On occasion, businesses will shut down, as you joke about.
It happened to a foundry I know of. Employees unionized
& demanded more money. They owner anticipated losing
profitability, so he closed the business.

Ironically, the state that protects an enormous underworld of illegal immigration and its cheap, under the table labor, forces business to raise wages in order to be able to pay higher taxes that subsides its enabling!

 

[Colt]

It happens if you are in a jurisdiction that assumes a certain tip income and the non-cash income does not cover the taxes. It happens a lot in low wage cash tip situations. Not so common with advent of credit card payment.

"The range for restaurant profit margins typically spans anywhere from 0 – 15 percent, but the average restaurant profit margin usually falls between 3 – 5 percent." What is the Average Restaurant Profit Margin? [2023 Data]

 

[Pogo]

"The range for restaurant profit margins typically spans anywhere from 0 – 15 percent, but the average restaurant profit margin usually falls between 3 – 5 percent." What is the Average Restaurant Profit Margin? [2023 Data]

Irrelevant to why some zero dollar paychecks are issued.

 

[Revoltingest]

It may also be the case that the owners/managers of legacy restaurants may be unable or unwilling to make changes to their business in order to deal with changes in their business environment. If the nature of the community has changed, say, incomes having gone up or down, or populations dynamics have changed since it was originally founded...not to mention changes in technology and the availability of foodstuffs and supplies...it might take an adaptation to those changed conditions to continue on.

Businesses always respond to regulation changes.
Prices change. Products change. Companies reorganize.
Restaurants are particularly risky businesses. Many fail
during their first years of operation. This suggests that
proposed changes will involve market adaption with
more failures than usual. But the industry will survive,
& customers will reap the benefits....or costs.

 

[Colt]

Irrelevant to why some zero dollar paychecks are issued.

I think that we all kind of know that many waiters and waitresses earn much more than the minimum wage and don't really report all of it. I'm a 20%+ tipper because I know they work hard! When I use a credit card I pay a cash tip separately.

 

[fantome profane]

Do any others here observe that the staunch MAGA supporters tend to not give a damn about lower-income employees?

That is because in the MAGA religion they are all going to be rich and poop on gold toilets when their chosen savior comes back. But those who lack the faith will receive Trumpy retribution.

 

[Pogo]

I think that we all kind of know that many waiters and waitresses earn much more than the minimum wage and don't really report all of it. I'm a 20%+ tipper because I know they work hard! When I use a credit card I pay a cash tip separately.

Not all do and they are taxed on an assumed wage, you are one of their good customers but some waitresses often suffer because even with tips their wage does not make minimum wage especially if their non-tip pay is one of those that is significantly below minimum wage because tips are assumed. The point is it does happen and is part of the impetus to increase minimum wages for restaurant employees. Worst case, some places include busboys as waitstaff and split tips. It is an often ugly business at the lower end.

 

[metis]

Not all do and they are taxed on an assumed wage, you are one of their good customers but some waitresses often suffer because even with tips their wage does not make minimum wage especially if their non-tip pay is one of those that is significantly below minimum wage because tips are assumed. The point is it does happen and is part of the impetus to increase minimum wages for restaurant employees. Worst case, some places include busboys as waitstaff and split tips. It is an often ugly business at the lower end.

Yes. And my wife waitressed for 30 years and often complained about the inconsistency.

 

[crossfire]

Why is this the case? How has increased wages led to lower unemployment? What are the unemployment rates? Where is your data?

ESDWAGOV - Monthly employment report

esd.wa.gov

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

ESDWAGOV - Monthly employment report

esd.wa.gov

Here is my date that contradicts yours:

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

The Bureau of Labor Statistics is the principal fact-finding agency for the Federal Government in the broad field of labor economics and statistics.

www.bls.gov

 

[crossfire]

Here is my date that contradicts yours:

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

The Bureau of Labor Statistics is the principal fact-finding agency for the Federal Government in the broad field of labor economics and statistics.

www.bls.gov

My source had a readily understandable map on the direct link showing lower unemployment in higher minimum wage areas. Where is the data contradicting this on your source?