Would a Christian kindly help me understand these verses?

[Doktormartini]

Hi! Thanks for reading this. I have a question! In Galatians 5:2-4 Paul says:
"2Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. "

Does this mean that the Jewish people who were circumcised would not be able to benefit from Christ? He makes it seem like if you get circumcised (which he was cause he was a Jew) then you must become Jewish and not follow Christ! He also sounds like he is ripping on Jewish people when he says the circumcised are fallen from grace! Thanks all!

 

[Bishka]

I think it is figurative.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Paul was at the time Pretty uppity...

There was a fight going on between the Jewish Christians ( who believed in Circumcision) and the Gentile Christians who he Preached to ( who did not believe Circumcision was necessary to be a Christian.
He Paul, eventually won the argument and Christians were not required to be circumcised.

What you quoted was some of the flack going round at the time.

 

[Joe_Stocks]

Hi Doktormartini,

Hi! Thanks for reading this. I have a question! In Galatians 5:2-4 Paul says:
"2Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. "

Does this mean that the Jewish people who were circumcised would not be able to benefit from Christ? He makes it seem like if you get circumcised (which he was cause he was a Jew) then you must become Jewish and not follow Christ! He also sounds like he is ripping on Jewish people when he says the circumcised are fallen from grace! Thanks all!

My interpretation of the passage is that Christians need not get circumcised to be Christian. As the Great Commission was extended to Gentiles the question was, do they have to be Jews to become Chriistians (obviously because Christianity started as a sect within Judaism)? I think Paul is saying no. Chrisians at that time shouldn't think that being circumcised and/or adhering to the Jewish dietary requirments makes you any more Christian than those who don't.

 

[Doktormartini]

Thanks all for the replies...I was a little confused. Why does he say that if you get circumcised Christ will be of no profit to you? Millions of Christians are circumcised...does that mean Christ doesn't do anything for them?

 

[*Paul*]

I'll try to help you out with this if I can.

There were a group of people known as Judaizers who taught that gentiles who converted to Christianity had to also follow the Law to to be saved:


Acts 15:1-2 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.

You see here that Paul who wrote Galations has a disagreement with them about this.

When you read Galations keep this in mind, Paul is not saying that circumcision in and of itself will damn you (he himself would have been circumcised), but if you are doing it as a work for salvation you are no longer trusting in the grace of God to save you and are putting yourself under the Law which can only bring condemnation to you.

The outcome of this dispute was settled;
Acts 15:23-29 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:
Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

Paul explains the purpose of the Law (it is a school master to lead us to Christ)

Galations 3:21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
Galations 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
Galations 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Galations 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Galations 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Galations 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Once we have come to Christ and have been justified by faith (v:24) we are no longer under this school master (v25) but by that faith by which we have been justifed we are now children of God. (v26).

Having began this walk with Christ by faith and thus receiving the Holy Spirit we must continue this way:
Galations 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Galations 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Our whole walk is to be by faith:

Galations 3:5-7 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

We which do so are the children of Abraham.

Our bondage to the Law was until the promised messiah should come.
Galations 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

So the problem with turning to circumcision to be saved was that it denies that Jesus sets free from the Law, denies that faith in Him is sufficient to save but His sacrifice must be supplemented by our works, makes a person a debtor to do the whole Law as would logically follow for if Christ didn't set you free from one aspect of the law then he didn't set you free from any of it.

Now Paul doesn't teach lawlessness as some wrongfully charge him with, he simply teaches that following the law to establish your righteousness with God will not save a man. Paul places a very high emphasis on good moral conduct in his epistles and being blameless before God and men, but this we are to do by following the Spirit and dying to self not by exalting self and following laws for that purpose.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Too many Christians want RULES to live by rather than letting their HEARTS be transformed by the Spirit of Jesus. If you rely on ANY rules in order to be a Christian, then Jesus' death means nothing to you.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Hi! Thanks for reading this. I have a question! In Galatians 5:2-4 Paul says:
"2Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. "

Does this mean that the Jewish people who were circumcised would not be able to benefit from Christ? He makes it seem like if you get circumcised (which he was cause he was a Jew) then you must become Jewish and not follow Christ! He also sounds like he is ripping on Jewish people when he says the circumcised are fallen from grace! Thanks all!

I think Paul is talking about Christians who get circumcized thinking that they need it to affect the grace of Christ. Apparently, some uncircumcised Greek Christians were taught by Jews or Jewish-minded Greeks that they needed to be circumcised and perhaps needed or did not need to subsequently follow the whole OT law. Since Paul taught that Jesus fulfilled the law in grace, this circumsicison and subsequent commitment to the law voids the faith in Christ that affects this grace.

 

[Doktormartini]

Thanks everyone! You are all great! God Bless.

 

[Aqualung]

Hi! Thanks for reading this. I have a question! In Galatians 5:2-4 Paul says:
"2Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. "

Does this mean that the Jewish people who were circumcised would not be able to benefit from Christ? He makes it seem like if you get circumcised (which he was cause he was a Jew) then you must become Jewish and not follow Christ! He also sounds like he is ripping on Jewish people when he says the circumcised are fallen from grace! Thanks all!

If you are circumcised after Christ came, you are buying into the law of Moses, not the law of Christ, so you will be judged by the law of moses, not the law of Christ. You are trying to be saved by the law, and not by grace.

 

[joeboonda]

Romans 4:6 King David says the same thing. He tells us how blessed some people are. God makes those people right with himself. But they don't have to do anything in return.

Salvation is free, no works required including circumcision. We do not add anything WE do to what HE did, taking glory away from Him. To clarify any fears, if someone has been circumcised now days due to parental preference or hygiene, etc. that does not mean they have to keep the whole law or anything. Paul was warning them not to go back to the Law and Works for salvation, not to turn from totally unmerited favor (grace) to making salvation something they could work for and achieve on their own or in addition to Christ's work on the cross. Salvation is a totally free gift given to anyone who has trusted in what Christ did on the cross paying the penalty for ALL their sins once and for all.

 

[FerventGodSeeker]

Thanks all for the replies...I was a little confused. Why does he say that if you get circumcised Christ will be of no profit to you? Millions of Christians are circumcised...does that mean Christ doesn't do anything for them?

I think it's a matter of intent. If you're circumcised at 8 days old (or even sooner, in modern times), it's not your fault, there's nothing you can do about it. However, Paul was speaking of individuals who were adults and were becoming circumcised for religious reasons because they felt they had to in order to truly follow Christ, be saved, etc. Paul's point is that the Mosaic Laws have been done away with in Christ; if you are attempting to be justified by following the Mosaic Law, Christ is of no benefit to you, because you are not acknowledging His death as doing away with those laws.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Thanks all for the replies...I was a little confused. Why does he say that if you get circumcised Christ will be of no profit to you? Millions of Christians are circumcised...does that mean Christ doesn't do anything for them?

Not at all ...
It just means it is of no particular benefit.
A sort of non event...

That is to say if all you do is get circumcised, that is no help in the matter.
You are missing all the important bits like Loving God and Jesus his son. and trusting in them.
Trusting in a Circumcision is not even on message.