YHWH: Worship ONE GOD, not MANY GODS. Worship Me, alone!

[TransmutingSoul]

Hi Tony,

That doesn't even make sense. The same God would not teach different faiths that contradict each other.

Hello, hope you are well and happy. To me It makes perfect sense, as I up to the last couple of centuries, man did not have the capacity of a worldly vision.

Who is saying there is a contradiction, man or God, what about the other sheep not of the Christian fold?

Regards Tony

 

[YoursTrue]

Right - The Father did not die on the cross. But the body he took on did. Acts 20:28 says ...feed the church of God which he hath purchased with his own blood.

The Father was the eternal Spirit of God. The Son was the fleshly body the Father made to dwell in and sacrifice for our sins. But it is not 2 different persons. God was dwelling in that fleshly body. 2 Corinthians 5:19

So did Jesus die? By that I mean temporarily. When he was put to death, did he die?

 

[YoursTrue]

The fleshly body the source took on was the mediator.

God loved mankind so much that he took on a fleshly body, lived a perfect life, then sacrificed that fleshly body for our sins, to show us how to live, and prove how much he loved us.

Trinitarians think God is 3 different persons, but he isn't. He was a Spirit that didn't have flesh and blood to sacrifice for our sins. So he made himself a body that could shed blood for our sins. The Spirit was the Father of that body, so he called it his Son. But it wasn't another person. It was the one and only God manifesting himself in a fleshly body. The Spirit was eternal and couldn't die, but the body was flesh and blood and could die.

So there were two. One in heaven and one on earth, according to you. One with flesh, you say, (Jesus), and the other without flesh that Jesus prayed to, although I guess you might figure that he didn't pray to the spirit within himself but rather that in heaven, even though it was implanted in him. (Right?)

 

[Truthseeker]

I want to explore the truth that Yhwh God told his favoured nation that they are to worship Him, YHWH, and YHWH alone.

Why? Because the Jews (called Israelites, at that time) were living among, in and around, other tribes and nations, who worshipped many Gods.

Yhwh instructed them that they were to have no other God bug him... that HE was to be their ONE GOD.

And to this day, Jews believe that GOD, YHWH, is their ONLY GOD.

I too, believe this. But there are many who misinterpret YHWH’s directive and confound his word. The WORD OF GOD has become adulterated.

Why is it so hard to believe the word of Jesus Christ:

• “Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.'" (Luke 4:8)
• “Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.” (John 4:23)

Why is it difficult to to understand what yhwh said:

• "You shall have no other gods before me.“ (Exodus 20:3)
• “I am the YHWH, and there is no other; apart from me there is no God....”

And the apostles tell us:

• “yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live;” ( 1 Cor 8:6)
• “One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. (Eph 4:6)

Please note, the thread is mainly about GOD being the ONLY GOD. And that because this ONE GOD is the creator, He us rightly called, ‘FATHER’ (which means: ‘Creator’, ‘Life Giver’, ‘He that brings forth’, and ‘the Head’ by ultimate context.)

So, are you trying to say that Jesus and the Holy Spirit don't share this Godship? That's what I believe, and it looks to me that's what these scriptures are saying.

 

[JerryMyers]

Your sins are forgiven when you are baptized in his name for the forgiveness of those sins. Clearly belief is necessary or you wouldn't obey the instructions given.

Your sins ARE NOT automatically forgiven when you are baptized – that’s a FALSE BELIEF which Jesus himself NEVER preached in his entire life on earth. Baptism is a symbolic act to symbolize that you have repented from your sins. Baptism itself mean nothing if you have not sincerely repented. Jesus and John the Baptist preached the baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins – Jesus NEVER preached he must die for the forgiveness of sin – that’s the teaching of man which became mainstream AFTER Jesus has departed from this world.

Acts 2:38 - He gave Peter the keys to the kingdom. Peter taught here that we are to be baptized in the name for the forgiveness of our sins.
Acts 22:16 - be baptized and wash away thy sins. This verse also clearly shows where our sins are forgiven.

Jesus, in giving Peter ‘the key to the kingdom’ simply means Jesus gave Peter the permission for Peter to teach/preach to others what Jesus had preached to him or in other words, Jesus taught his disciples from what he hears from God Almighty and Peter preached from what he had learned from Jesus and he was given that authority (to preach) by Jesus himself or if you like, given the keys to the kingdom.

For the forgiveness of sins, you must sincerely have repented from your sins and this is symbolized by the act of baptism which John the Baptist preached and later followed by Jesus. Both of them preached the baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sin, and NOT Jesus must die for the forgiveness of man’s sin

As far as him dying for our sins, why Jerry that is a basic fundamental in the scriptures. Here are just a few of the scriptures:

Nope, Jesus having to die for your sins is NEVER the basic fundamental in the scriptures, it became the basic fundamental in Christianity ONLY AFTER Jesus has departed. So, let me say it again – Jesus NEVER peached he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin.

Matthew 26:28 - For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Romans 4:24-25 - he was delivered for our offenses. That means he died for us.
Romans 5:8-9 - while we were yet sinners, Messiah died for us. ...being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Colossians 1:14 - In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins
Hebrews 9:22 - and without the shedding of blood is no remission
Hebrews 9:28 - So Messiah was once offered to bear the sins of many

Well, Romans 4, Romans 5, Colossians 1 and Hebrews 9 are NOT Jesus’ words – in fact, those quotes are not even in harmony with the words of Jesus !! And you say you are a true believer of Jesus Christ ???!!

As for Matthew 26:28, it would be foolish to take those words literally, ESPECIALLY when God Himself forbids you to consume blood AND Jesus himself NEVER preached that only through his death or the shedding of his blood can man’s sin be forgiven. So really, whose teaching are you following ??

In Matthew 26:28, Jesus was NOT speaking about his blood in its literal sense, he was speaking figuratively as a reference to his life (“my blood”) which he had committed fully (“shed for many”) to bring people out of their sinning ways (“for the remission of sins”).
Blood is a reference to life - “But be sure you do not eat the blood, because the blood is the life, and you must not eat the life with the meat” – Deuteronomy 12:23.

And the eternal Spirit of God didn't die, the body God made to dwell in and sacrifice died.

As I said before, that’s BS !!
Why? Because that belief was NEVER preached by Jesus himself – you can prove me wrong by quoting Jesus’ own words that said or even implied that he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

So did Jesus die? By that I mean temporarily. When he was put to death, did he die?

The flesh died. The Spirit of God dwelling in the flesh did not die.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

So there were two. One in heaven and one on earth, according to you. One with flesh, you say, (Jesus), and the other without flesh that Jesus prayed to, although I guess you might figure that he didn't pray to the spirit within himself but rather that in heaven, even though it was implanted in him. (Right?)

You know this appears to be a waste of time. As you are unable to answer questions. And you twist my words saying things are according to me that I have clearly disputed.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Your sins ARE NOT automatically forgiven when you are baptized – that’s a FALSE BELIEF which Jesus himself NEVER preached in his entire life on earth. Baptism is a symbolic act to symbolize that you have repented from your sins. Baptism itself mean nothing if you have not sincerely repented. Jesus and John the Baptist preached the baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins – Jesus NEVER preached he must die for the forgiveness of sin – that’s the teaching of man which became mainstream AFTER Jesus has departed from this world.


Jesus, in giving Peter ‘the key to the kingdom’ simply means Jesus gave Peter the permission for Peter to teach/preach to others what Jesus had preached to him or in other words, Jesus taught his disciples from what he hears from God Almighty and Peter preached from what he had learned from Jesus and he was given that authority (to preach) by Jesus himself or if you like, given the keys to the kingdom.

For the forgiveness of sins, you must sincerely have repented from your sins and this is symbolized by the act of baptism which John the Baptist preached and later followed by Jesus. Both of them preached the baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sin, and NOT Jesus must die for the forgiveness of man’s sin


Nope, Jesus having to die for your sins is NEVER the basic fundamental in the scriptures, it became the basic fundamental in Christianity ONLY AFTER Jesus has departed. So, let me say it again – Jesus NEVER peached he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin.


Well, Romans 4, Romans 5, Colossians 1 and Hebrews 9 are NOT Jesus’ words – in fact, those quotes are not even in harmony with the words of Jesus !! And you say you are a true believer of Jesus Christ ???!!

As for Matthew 26:28, it would be foolish to take those words literally, ESPECIALLY when God Himself forbids you to consume blood AND Jesus himself NEVER preached that only through his death or the shedding of his blood can man’s sin be forgiven. So really, whose teaching are you following ??

In Matthew 26:28, Jesus was NOT speaking about his blood in its literal sense, he was speaking figuratively as a reference to his life (“my blood”) which he had committed fully (“shed for many”) to bring people out of their sinning ways (“for the remission of sins”).
Blood is a reference to life - “But be sure you do not eat the blood, because the blood is the life, and you must not eat the life with the meat” – Deuteronomy 12:23.


As I said before, that’s BS !!
Why? Because that belief was NEVER preached by Jesus himself – you can prove me wrong by quoting Jesus’ own words that said or even implied that he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin.

Of course you have to repent. Repentance is turning away from your sins with a godly sorrow. But that doesn't mean the sins you have already committed have been forgiven.

God's word is clear - repent and be baptized in the name for the remission of sins. Acts 2:38
And Paul was told to arise and be baptized and wash away your sins in Acts 22:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. Mark 16:16
.. the like figure whereunto baptism doth also now save us. 1 Peter 3:21
...that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. Acts 10:43

By your logic someone baptized by John the Baptist should be forgiven - correct? If so, why then in Acts 10:1-5 were the disciples who had been baptized unto John's baptism, baptized again?

It was foretold in Isaiah 53:6-12 how he would suffer and die for our sins.
verse 6 - YHWH hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
verse 8 - for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
verse 10 - when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin
verse 11 - for he shall bear their iniquities.
verse 12 - and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

I previously proved you wrong by giving many scriptures saying he died for our sins. You attempted to twist them. You can believe whatever you want. It's your soul.

And what about 1 Corinthians 5:7 where it says he was sacrificed for us?

But good grief, if you don't even believe the word of God the apostles taught there is really no need to continue.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Hello, hope you are well and happy. To me It makes perfect sense, as I up to the last couple of centuries, man did not have the capacity of a worldly vision.

Who is saying there is a contradiction, man or God, what about the other sheep not of the Christian fold?

Regards Tony

Different beliefs are clearly not in agreement. YHWH said there was no other God but him. So any doctrine promoting a different God is clearly trying to contradict that. Now if someone chooses to believe in a different God that is their business. But to say the beliefs are from the same God is definitely incorrect.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Different beliefs are clearly not in agreement. YHWH said there was no other God but him. So any doctrine promoting a different God is clearly trying to contradict that. Now if someone chooses to believe in a different God that is their business. But to say the beliefs are from the same God is definitely incorrect.

I see that all the diversity of Faith does not show that there is more than One God, I see man makes of our One God, into many exclusive views of God.

So a person has to consider if they are debating that the God of their Faith is a different God from the One other people worship.

In the end who is it, that is Making more then One God, but the person debating the God of their Faith is the only One God, but others faiths have a different God/Gods?

All the best, stay well and happy.

Regards Tony

 

[JerryMyers]

Of course you have to repent. Repentance is turning away from your sins with a godly sorrow. But that doesn't mean the sins you have already committed have been forgiven.
God's word is clear - repent and be baptized in the name for the remission of sins. Acts 2:38
And Paul was told to arise and be baptized and wash away your sins in Acts 22:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. Mark 16:16
.. the like figure whereunto baptism doth also now save us. 1 Peter 3:21
...that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. Acts 10:43

Yup, God’s Words are clear and so are the words of Jesus. You repent because you want to seek forgiveness from God. You seek forgiveness from God Almighty in hope that all your sins are washed away and ultimately, you can enter His kingdom of heaven.

So, the keyword for the forgiveness of your sin is repent – where in your whole Bible, did God Almighty or His prophet, Jesus, say your sins can only be forgiven by Jesus having to die for your sin ??

By your logic someone baptized by John the Baptist should be forgiven - correct? If so, why then in Acts 10:1-5 were the disciples who had been baptized unto John's baptism, baptized again?

When and where exactly did I ever say or imply that ‘someone baptized by John the Baptist should be forgiven’ ???

It was foretold in Isaiah 53:6-12 how he would suffer and die for our sins.
verse 6 - YHWH hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
verse 8 - for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
verse 10 - when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin
verse 11 - for he shall bear their iniquities.
verse 12 - and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Christians seem to have an ‘identity issue’ with words such as ‘suffering’, ‘sacrifice’, ‘blood’, ‘pierced’, etc, as every time they came across these words, they relate those words with Jesus. Truth is, even among the Christian and Jew scholars, the debate of who is the ‘Suffering Servant’ in Isaiah 53, is still raging on. The suffering servant could very well be a reference to the nation of Israel seen as one entity. In the Book of Isaiah, Israel is often referred to as ‘My Servant’, for example, “You are My servant, O Israel” (Isaiah 49:3)

I previously proved you wrong by giving many scriptures saying he died for our sins. You attempted to twist them. You can believe whatever you want. It's your soul.

You should not be quick to credit yourself because truth is, you have proven nothing.

Read what I wrote – I said “you can prove me wrong by quoting Jesus’ own words that said or even implied that he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin” (see Post#245). Have you done that for you to say you have proven me wrong??

If you are a true believer, then, you should know that anyone can quote hundreds of other people's words saying Jesus died for your sin BUT if God Almighty and/or his servant, Jesus, DID NOT spell it out or imply it so, then, you are just a follower of those other people, NOT a true follower of Jesus Christ.

And what about 1 Corinthians 5:7 where it says he was sacrificed for us?

So, what about 1 Corr. 5:7?? The last time I checked, 1 Corr. 5:7 reflects the words of Paul, NOT Jesus.

So, tell me, why can’t you even find a single quote of Jesus saying he was sent to die for your sins ?? I will tell you why – because he NEVER said it as he was never sent to die or sacrifice his life for your sins – it’s that obvious !

But good grief, if you don't even believe the word of God the apostles taught there is really no need to continue.

Good grief indeed !! If you cannot even understand what God Almighty or His prophet, Jesus said or DID NOT say in your own Bible, but instead follow the words of other people, then, you are right – you should be running along and debate with someone who will not challenge your understanding – that’s what people who cannot back up their claims or do not want to seek the truth normally does anyway. But do knock on my door if you ever find, in your own Bible, verse(s) that quoted Jesus as saying or implying he was sent by God to die for your sins. Cheers!

 

[Brian2]

So does that mean you understand there is not a Trinity?

No, to me what I said shows that Jesus is YHWH.
The Father is YHWH also and so it the Holy Spirit (2Cor 3:17)
I think it is plain that the Father and Son are not the same,,,,,,,,,,,person, for want of a better word and that the Spirit of God is not the same person as the Father or the Son.

 

[Brian2]

Brian,
God did not become a man. He overshadowed the virgin Mary, and made himself the body of a man to dwell in and sacrifice for our sins. Since he fathered the body, he called it his Son. But it wasn't another person. It was God himself dwelling in the body. Colossians 2:8-9 and 2 Corinthians 5:19

To me the Son was there in the beginning with the Father and in the creation.
Heb 1:1 Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.
So the Son was more than just the body of Jesus.
Heb 10:4.......because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. 5Therefore, when Christ came into the world, He said: “Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, but a body You prepared for Me.

The body was not the Son, the body was the vessel in which the Son came into the world as a human.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

No, to me what I said shows that Jesus is YHWH.
The Father is YHWH also and so it the Holy Spirit (2Cor 3:17)
I think it is plain that the Father and Son are not the same,,,,,,,,,,,person, for want of a better word and that the Spirit of God is not the same person as the Father or the Son.

Your problem is that there is only one YHWH. I agree that the Messiah was YHWH but not in the same way you claim.

Which of your 3 is the Father? The one called the Father or the Holy Spirit as it says in Matthew 1:18-20 ?

 

[TrueBeliever37]

I see that all the diversity of Faith does not show that there is more than One God, I see man makes of our One God, into many exclusive views of God.

So a person has to consider if they are debating that the God of their Faith is a different God from the One other people worship.

In the end who is it, that is Making more then One God, but the person debating the God of their Faith is the only One God, but others faiths have a different God/Gods?

All the best, stay well and happy.

Regards Tony

I see that all the diversity of faith means they all can't be true or correct.

 

[TrueBeliever37]

Yup, God’s Words are clear and so are the words of Jesus. You repent because you want to seek forgiveness from God. You seek forgiveness from God Almighty in hope that all your sins are washed away and ultimately, you can enter His kingdom of heaven.

So, the keyword for the forgiveness of your sin is repent – where in your whole Bible, did God Almighty or His prophet, Jesus, say your sins can only be forgiven by Jesus having to die for your sin ??


When and where exactly did I ever say or imply that ‘someone baptized by John the Baptist should be forgiven’ ???


Christians seem to have an ‘identity issue’ with words such as ‘suffering’, ‘sacrifice’, ‘blood’, ‘pierced’, etc, as every time they came across these words, they relate those words with Jesus. Truth is, even among the Christian and Jew scholars, the debate of who is the ‘Suffering Servant’ in Isaiah 53, is still raging on. The suffering servant could very well be a reference to the nation of Israel seen as one entity. In the Book of Isaiah, Israel is often referred to as ‘My Servant’, for example, “You are My servant, O Israel” (Isaiah 49:3)


You should not be quick to credit yourself because truth is, you have proven nothing.

Read what I wrote – I said “you can prove me wrong by quoting Jesus’ own words that said or even implied that he has to die for the forgiveness of man’s sin” (see Post#245). Have you done that for you to say you have proven me wrong??

If you are a true believer, then, you should know that anyone can quote hundreds of other people's words saying Jesus died for your sin BUT if God Almighty and/or his servant, Jesus, DID NOT spell it out or imply it so, then, you are just a follower of those other people, NOT a true follower of Jesus Christ.


So, what about 1 Corr. 5:7?? The last time I checked, 1 Corr. 5:7 reflects the words of Paul, NOT Jesus.

So, tell me, why can’t you even find a single quote of Jesus saying he was sent to die for your sins ?? I will tell you why – because he NEVER said it as he was never sent to die or sacrifice his life for your sins – it’s that obvious !


Good grief indeed !! If you cannot even understand what God Almighty or His prophet, Jesus said or DID NOT say in your own Bible, but instead follow the words of other people, then, you are right – you should be running along and debate with someone who will not challenge your understanding – that’s what people who cannot back up their claims or do not want to seek the truth normally does anyway. But do knock on my door if you ever find, in your own Bible, verse(s) that quoted Jesus as saying or implying he was sent by God to die for your sins. Cheers!

Your answers are ridiculous. To not accept other verses just because they were not spoken by the Messiah is also ridiculous. The word says all the scripture is given by inspiration of God. 2 Timothy 3:16

Hebrews 9:26-28

Here are a few from the Messiah if that helps you.
Luke 24:46-47
Luke 9:22 (must suffer, be slain, and be raised again the third day)
John 6:51 (my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world)
John 15:13-14 (He laid down his life for his friends - those who obey him.)

 

[TrueBeliever37]

To me the Son was there in the beginning with the Father and in the creation.
Heb 1:1 Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.
So the Son was more than just the body of Jesus.
Heb 10:4.......because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. 5Therefore, when Christ came into the world, He said: “Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, but a body You prepared for Me.

The body was not the Son, the body was the vessel in which the Son came into the world as a human.

The son was made of a woman, made under the law. Galatians 4:4 The son didn't exist until birth, except in the mind and plans of God.

I think it says but a body hast thou prepared me. ( It doesn't appear to be in the Hebrew text I have. It seems to have come from the Septuagint.) So I don't really have a way to verify how it was worded.

 

[Soapy]

The source is the mediator?

Does mediator have a different definition in scripture?

No, the mediator is not the source. Trinitarians have to speak against the truth and reality of the scriptures because if is the only way to maintain the fallacy that is the trinity.

Brian2 claimed that the son (Jesus) is God because he could do all that the Father SHOWED HIM AND TAUGHT HIM to do…

You can see the farce in that … Let’s say it’s true… what was the son, then, BEFORE the Father taught him and showed him what to do?

See it? You won’t get an honest answer from a trinitarian on that. Most likely they will say that the Son ALWAYS KNEW what to say and so EVEN BEFORE the Father taught him what to say and do… they have to say this otherwise they have to admit that Jesus WAS NOT GOD BEFORE HE BECAME GOD….

Can God ‘BECOME’? … No! God IS, that’s what his name, ‘YHWH’, means!

Ask a trinitarian what ‘YHWH’ means?

And ask a trinitarian what ‘Father’ means…!

Oh dear… but WE know that ‘Father’ means:

1. ‘He who CREATES’
2. ‘He who BRINGS INTO BEING (that which was not already in being…!)
3. ‘He who GIVES LIFE’

No.3 credits the Son of Man as being ‘The ETERNAL FATHER’. But we know that this is when Jesus ‘GIVES ETERNAL LIFE’ to those he deems worthy at the mercy seat as he judges mankind in the second resurrection.

Yes, Jesus will be the ‘Eternal Father’ as he grants ‘Eternal Life’ to them.

But ask a trinitarian about this and likely they will claim that this points to Jesus ALWAYS BEING ABLE TO GIVE LIFE….

Ummm… You answer, ‘But….!! But … Doesn’t scriptures say that THE FATHER GRANTED JESUS TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO GIVE LIFE… and this was near the end of Jesus’ ministry… (John 5:26-27)

• “The Father has life in himself, and he has granted that same life-giving power to his Son.
• And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.“

The previous verses are of relevance also in giving further context.

All these ‘grantings’ confirm what Jesus said, that:

• ‘The Father is greater than I’

Yet Trinitarians disclaim what Jesus says and say that Jesus IS GOD and is EQUAL to GOD…!!!

Check the wording… How is he GOD and equal to God?

Reality check: The trinitarian wants to say that the Son is EQUAL to the Father… but they can’t dismiss the ‘My father us greater than I’ line so they substitute ‘God’ instead… remember the supposed claim from the Jews that Jesus was blaspheming by calling himself ‘Son of God’? Well, did Jesus really claim to be EQUAL TO GOD? No! In fact Jesus went to pains to claim that he

• ‘Only said that God is my Father!’

and that the term, and title, ‘God’ refers to anyone of greatness of which even the GOD OF THE JEWS spoke of mankind and angels as being ‘GODS’, AND YET Jesus did not claim to be such a one of greatness.

Jesus went on to explain what he meant by ‘Son of God’ saying that he was:

• ‘Doing the works of the Father’

And that is exactly how I believe ‘Son of God’ is defined, hence:

• “All who follow the spirit are children of God” (Romans 8:14)

Ask a trinitarian to define ‘Son of God’ and … hummmm… (shake my head in sorrow at their miscreation!)

 

[TrueBeliever37]

No, the mediator is not the source. Trinitarians have to speak against the truth and reality of the scriptures because if is the only way to maintain the fallacy that is the trinity.

Brian2 claimed that the son (Jesus) is God because he could do all that the Father SHOWED HIM AND TAUGHT HIM to do…

You can see the farce in that … Let’s say it’s true… what was the son, then, BEFORE the Father taught him and showed him what to do?

See it? You won’t get an honest answer from a trinitarian on that. Most likely they will say that the Son ALWAYS KNEW what to say and so EVEN BEFORE the Father taught him what to say and do… they have to say this otherwise they have to admit that Jesus WAS NOT GOD BEFORE HE BECAME GOD….

Can God ‘BECOME’? … No! God IS, that’s what his name, ‘YHWH’, means!

Ask a trinitarian what ‘YHWH’ means?

And ask a trinitarian what ‘Father’ means…!

Oh dear… but WE know that ‘Father’ means:

1. ‘He who CREATES’
2. ‘He who BRINGS INTO BEING (that which was not already in being…!)
3. ‘He who GIVES LIFE’

No.3 credits the Son of Man as being ‘The ETERNAL FATHER’. But we know that this is when Jesus ‘GIVES ETERNAL LIFE’ to those he deems worthy at the mercy seat as he judges mankind in the second resurrection.

Yes, Jesus will be the ‘Eternal Father’ as he grants ‘Eternal Life’ to them.

But ask a trinitarian about this and likely they will claim that this points to Jesus ALWAYS BEING ABLE TO GIVE LIFE….

Ummm… You answer, ‘But….!! But … Doesn’t scriptures say that THE FATHER GRANTED JESUS TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO GIVE LIFE… and this was near the end of Jesus’ ministry… (John 5:26-27)

• “The Father has life in himself, and he has granted that same life-giving power to his Son.
• And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.“

The previous verses are of relevance also in giving further context.

All these ‘grantings’ confirm what Jesus said, that:

• ‘The Father is greater than I’

Yet Trinitarians disclaim what Jesus says and say that Jesus IS GOD and is EQUAL to GOD…!!!

Check the wording… How is he GOD and equal to God?

Reality check: The trinitarian wants to say that the Son is EQUAL to the Father… but they can’t dismiss the ‘My father us greater than I’ line so they substitute ‘God’ instead… remember the supposed claim from the Jews that Jesus was blaspheming by calling himself ‘Son of God’? Well, did Jesus really claim to be EQUAL TO GOD? No! In fact Jesus went to pains to claim that he

• ‘Only said that God is my Father!’

and that the term, and title, ‘God’ refers to anyone of greatness of which even the GOD OF THE JEWS spoke of mankind and angels as being ‘GODS’, AND YET Jesus did not claim to be such a one of greatness.

Jesus went on to explain what he meant by ‘Son of God’ saying that he was:

• ‘Doing the works of the Father’

And that is exactly how I believe ‘Son of God’ is defined, hence:

• “All who follow the spirit are children of God” (Romans 8:14)

Ask a trinitarian to define ‘Son of God’ and … hummmm… (shake my head in sorrow at their miscreation!)

Hi Soapy,

YHWH is God. But he took on flesh and was here on earth as the Messiah. So the Messiah was God manifest in the flesh. The Trinity is an incorrect doctrine.

 

[Soapy]

The son was made of a woman, made under the law. Galatians 4:4 The son didn't exist until birth, except in the mind and plans of God.

I think it says but a body hast thou prepared me. ( It doesn't appear to be in the Hebrew text I have. It seems to have come from the Septuagint.) So I don't really have a way to verify how it was worded.

‘A body thou has prepared for me.’ is not in the Old Testament (Psalm 40:6)

But more importantly this verse:

• “I desire to do your will, my God; your law is within my heart.” (Psalm 40:8)

points to the prophesy of Jesus praying to his Father, praying to GOD, restating the purpose for Jesus’ being ‘Son of God’.