Your opinions on the U.S. border wall

[Cooky]

@Curious George, what rhetoric? The rhetoric from The Hill is propaganda? Be more specific.

 

[Cooky]

Border wall needed to protect against a 'caravan' of a different kind: drugs

...Because this was the source of the bulletpoints. I literally copied and pasted paragraphs.

 

[sun rise]

I know some of my high school friends have died from fentanyl. I tried to save a coworkers life and failed because fentanyl. It killed Prince too.

...We're literally being poisoned by China and Mexico.

Do you really think the wealthy smugglers will be stopped by a long wall? That ignores the demand side of the equation.

But as to supply, Fentanyl has taken over America's drug market. Where is it coming from? is very enlightening.

If the current regime was not focused on really stopping all the means that drugs are brought into the US, I would be inclined to look at it seriously. But that's not what they are doing.

 

[BSM1]

Billions of dollars, which will be paid largely by the middle class, to aggrandize one man's ego -- while he permanently cuts taxes on himself and members of his own class.

Uhhh,,,,

In 2006, Democrats supported legislation to build border fence - The Boston Globe

 

[BSM1]

I think it is a wasteful move. I have seen no complete cost benefit analysis. I have seen no reason to believe that a wall is necessary let alone worth the price tag. I think that people are quick to jump on the bandwagon because illegals scary.

Here ya go:

The Cost of a Border Wall vs. the Cost of Illegal Immigration

 

[BSM1]

Billions of dollars, which will be paid largely by the middle class, to aggrandize one man's ego -- while he permanently cuts taxes on himself and members of his own class.

Here ya go:

The Cost of a Border Wall vs. the Cost of Illegal Immigration

Just in case you really care what illegal aliens are costing the middle class...

 

[sun rise]

Here ya go:

The Cost of a Border Wall vs. the Cost of Illegal Immigration

Just in case you really care what illegal aliens are costing the middle class...

Their mission statement makes anything from them suspect.

From a more reputable source:
A precise cost is nearly impossible to ascertain, many experts said. That's in part because undocumented immigrants operate within the shadows, leaving their full fiscal contributions — and use of taxpayer-funded resources — at least somewhat unknown.

"It's really hard to calculate anyone’s 'net cost' or 'net benefit.' We all use all kinds of services, from roads to military protection. How do we apportion what part of that is something I or you or an immigrant use?" said Kallick.

Overall, there is a broad misunderstanding of how much undocumented immigrants contribute to America's balance sheets, and what taxpayer-funded benefits they receive, the experts interviewed by NBC News said.

 

[icehorse]

Here ya go:

The Cost of a Border Wall vs. the Cost of Illegal Immigration

Just in case you really care what illegal aliens are costing the middle class...

Scanning the link, it appears that the article is assuming mostly immigrants not migrants?

 

[Shad]

That is a reasonable point of view but of course not one that the current regime promotes. The current regime promotes hatred and fear of the "other".

Selective rebuilding of the border wall is the only funding that has a chance of passing. Trump is aiming too high regardless of rhetoric used. Trump is acting like a CEO, again, in which his goals for policy are to be enacted not debated passed/denied via Congress.

 

[ChristineM]

Amidst a government shut-down, I think it's time we discuss this potential wall, and why it's such a good or bad idea.

...Do do you or do you not support a wall on the U.S. southern border? Please explain your reasons.

I am not american so take my comment with as much salt as you want.

My first reaction when trump put forward the idea was, who is going to pay for building a 2000 mile long wall high enough to keep marauding immigrants out, and pay for the staff to patrol it and and control all the legal trade routes. As well as sea patrols at the flanks which will need to be as effective as this impenetrable wall.

Then the answer hit me, taxes will need to increase.

 

[BSM1]

I am not american so take my comment with as much salt as you want.

My first reaction when trump put forward the idea was, who is going to pay for building a 2000 mile long wall high enough to keep marauding immigrants out, and pay for the staff to patrol it and and control all the legal trade routes. As well as sea patrols at the flanks which will need to be as effective as this impenetrable wall.

Then the answer hit me, taxes will need to increase.

This was approved and partially funded by the Democrats in 2006. They were all for it before Trump took over; this is not Trump's idea, he's just following up on the original legislation. The savings from the welfare paid to just a
fraction of the illegal aliens that crash our border will more than pay for whatever steps we take to stem the flow. But even if that weren't not the cased, we have a legal right to protect our sovereignty as a nation.

 

[Cooky]

I am not american so take my comment with as much salt as you want.

My first reaction when trump put forward the idea was, who is going to pay for building a 2000 mile long wall high enough to keep marauding immigrants out, and pay for the staff to patrol it and and control all the legal trade routes. As well as sea patrols at the flanks which will need to be as effective as this impenetrable wall.

Then the answer hit me, taxes will need to increase.

I don't know, the federal government receives over 3 trillion dollars every year from us citizens in taxes. That's $3,000,000,000,000.00

If you include federal, state and local, it's expected to be 6.5 trillion in 2019.

Trump now says border wall could cost as little as $15 billion, pay for itself

 

[Shad]

Yes its legal, thanks to Reagan/Bush Jr/TRump. That’s been Warren Buffet’s arguement for decades. Only a government mandate (i.e. - change in the tax laws) can cure this.

This is not a duty of government in my view.

Human nature, even among the best of the wealthy, won’t result in charity from the rich to the poor, to the middle-class, or to the government. We need a return of the old tax laws, just like Reagan said there should be. Suprise!

There are plenty of in the upper class that donate millions to charities. You are advocating redistribution of wealth not charity.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I know some of my high school friends have died from fentanyl. I tried to save a coworkers life and failed because fentanyl. It killed Prince too.

...We're literally being poisoned by China and Mexico.

I fully realize it's a terrible problem, but building a wall along the US/Mexico border is not going to stop it. All those billions would be much better spent looking for ways to convince Americans (and Canadians, too, because it's also a problem here) to not use opioids as recreation. I know that won't be easy, but that's still no excuse for blowing billions on a wall that will do, literally, nothing to stop the carnage.

 

[Shad]

This was approved and partially funded by the Democrats in 2006. They were all for it before Trump took over; this is not Trump's idea, he's just following up on the original legislation.

Even back in the 90s this was an issue of Dems.

 

[Augustus]

Less kids dying of fentanyl and opioid overdoses.

Assuming that a wall makes it significantly more difficult to smuggle drugs into the US (which it won't), it will likely increase fentanyl usage.

The harder you make it to smuggle, the more you incentivise the smuggling of low bulk products. Smuggling sufficient fentanyl is much easier than smuggling the heroin it will frequently be sold as.

The more heroin users being sold fentanyl instead of heroin, the more deaths you will get.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I think it is a wasteful move. I have seen no complete cost benefit analysis. I have seen no reason to believe that a wall is necessary let alone worth the price tag. I think that people are quick to jump on the bandwagon because illegals scary.

Let's look at the plus side before we declare it worthless. I want to be fair to both sides.

For example it would be an epic site for graffiti:

 

[Shad]

Look at all the trouble Israel has with tunneling under their wall and they have a pretty short wall.

Tunneling requires more effort than walking across a line on a map. Ergo it is effective as a hindrance to low effort terrorism but less effective against organized terrorism. It is the cost and effectiveness relation that is the question.

 

[Curious George]

Here ya go:

The Cost of a Border Wall vs. the Cost of Illegal Immigration

That is not quite a complete cost benefit analysis, is it?

 

[BSM1]

That is not quite a complete cost benefit analysis, is it?

What difference does it make? Do we do a cost analysis on every dollar the government spends? If that were the case, the US taxpayer would have a few more bucks in their paychecks.