Yule Deity

[The Hammer]

I am personalizing a ritual for Yule I will be doing tomorrow, and I have become stumped on what deity to call upon. I was originally going to call upon Odin, as that is what felt right. But as I did a little deeper thinking on the matter, I don't know if that is entirely appropriate. Odin is seen as a deity of death and war, among the usual magic, shamanism, wisdom and poetry. So a celebration of rebirth centered around a deity of death? Idk... maybe I am just over-thinking the whole thing. I am also currently trying to figure out how to center all of the 8 seasonal festivals around 1 deity each, but that is another story .

Any ideas friends of the Norse?

 

[Faybull]

Wasn't Odin, resurrected? I recall that he had to die once, in order to learn what death was.

 

[Infinitum]

I associate Yule strongly with the winter solstice and the celebration of the light returning, so Dagr comes immediately to my mind. Baldur is another option. It really comes down to what Yule means to you.

 

[Nietzsche]

Wasn't Odin, resurrected? I recall that he had to die once, in order to learn what death was.

Pierced by a spear, for nine days and nine nights, on the World-Tree Yggdrasil, and when he returned to life he gave an eye to Mimir to drink from his well, and be granted the secret & knowledge of life & death, as well as the Runes and the 18 Charms(9 plus 9).

However;

I am personalizing a ritual for Yule I will be doing tomorrow, and I have become stumped on what deity to call upon. I was originally going to call upon Odin, as that is what felt right. But as I did a little deeper thinking on the matter, I don't know if that is entirely appropriate. Odin is seen as a deity of death and war, among the usual magic, shamanism, wisdom and poetry. So a celebration of rebirth centered around a deity of death? Idk... maybe I am just over-thinking the whole thing. I am also currently trying to figure out how to center all of the 8 seasonal festivals around 1 deity each, but that is another story .

Any ideas friends of the Norse?

Odin is the God of War, Death and the Berserk, yes. But he's also the God of Poetry, Wisdom & Magic. And in the guise of the Wanderer he walks the earth, looking for those who would uphold or reject the Norse equivalent of Sacred Hospitality.

Odin makes for a perfectly good Yule Deity due to that.

 

[Storm]

I would recommend Baldur, since he's the closest Asatru has to a typical Dying God. But that's from the eclectic perspective, and Asatru is a bit of an outlier. I'm not at all sure Yule means to you what it means to me.

 

[Nietzsche]

I would recommend Baldur, since he's the closest Asatru has to a typical Dying God. But that's from the eclectic perspective, and Asatru is a bit of an outlier. I'm not at all sure Yule means to you what it means to me.

Baldur's death in the most ancient versions of the story was just that, death. In the originals it seems as though Odin is the one who resurrects after Ragnarok, to start the cycle anew.

 

[Storm]

Baldur's death in the most ancient versions of the story was just that, death. In the originals it seems as though Odin is the one who resurrects after Ragnarok, to start the cycle anew.

Thank you, I didn't know that. I only know the version where he's "yeah, he's dead," but prophesied to fill that same role.

That's why I said "closest to," the fact that he was by no means continually resurrecting like the ones more familiar to me. Your response makes me wonder, was he later depicted in that role?

 

[Nietzsche]

Thank you, I didn't know that. I only know the version where he's "yeah, he's dead," but prophesied to fill that same role.

That's why I said "closest to," the fact that he was by no means continually resurrecting like the ones more familiar to me. Your response makes me wonder, was he later depicted in that role?

Baldur/Baldr was turned into a Christ-figure during the Christianization. Though, even with Baldur dead, he was killed by mistletoe. So the "winter holiday" feel was there before that, just Baldur died and stayed dead, despite Odin's attempts to resurrect his son.

I think this was far better without Baldur resurrecting because of that. It suddenly becomes much more understandable as to why Odin and Loki have a falling out. His son is dead, and Hel will not release him.

I suggest this if you'd like to understand why I see the story as more...powerful, without Baldur's ressurection-

Over the ground on the leaving land
We stand united on our way to forever
Under the mound time will take its toll
We fall divided and it seems that we never learn

Who is right
Who is wrong
See the light
Right is always there where we belong

We all died
When you fell
Far and wide
Waiting one to take the ride to Hel

Birds of a feather
What's holding us together
When ways lead north and nether
Through rain and heavy weather we ride

Though mothers cry
Even though fathers try
To raise the dead
The last word said
So we still learn
That there is no return
Back from Hel, back from Hel, from Hel

Try as you may, you can't make all mourn
We're born alone and only death is our dowry
There he will stay, left to wonder why
We die alone into from where there is no return

Who has won
Who has lost
Boldest Son
Sent away and you will count the cost

We all died
When you fell
Far and wide
Waiting one to take the ride to Hel

Betrayn, forsaken
With lies my life was taken
The woes of war awaken
Alone, betrayn, forsaken inside

My biggest love, the thing that appeals to me about the Norse faith, is the drive to do something knowing you'll fail. Odin knows he can't bring his son back. He knows he will never win Ragnarok. He knows it has come before and shall come again.

But that's no reason not to try.

 

[Jainarayan]

Considering that Yule and the Winter Solstice - astronomically at least, though not necessarily meterorologically - signal the return of the Earth's fertility and rejuvenation I think Thor, Freyr, Jord, Nerthus and Idunn could be honored. I'm not sure what I'm going to do today: the Winter Solstice is at 18:03 (6:03 pm) EST. Maybe I'll light a candle outdoors, toast the gods and spirits, just something simple. I may scout around for some evergreens to bring indoors, maybe make some sort of arrangement, decorate the altar... not sure

 

[Storm]

I think this was far better without Baldur resurrecting because of that. It suddenly becomes much more understandable as to why Odin and Loki have a falling out. His son is dead, and Hel will not release him.

When it comes to myth, it's not my way to say 'better.' But you're quite right that it is a better fit for the rest of the tradition, morally, philosphically, and aesthetically.

It's much akin to the way post-Christian Rhiannon forgives Pwyll instantly, without so much as an offer to atone so that they can all live happily ever after. In the original, she curses him to forget not only her, but their son, but keep the pain of their loss, then makes him deathless and promptly takes her son back to her own world. So Pwyll is still wandering bereft, searching for a family he can't even remember. By the time Christianity came to the Isles, there was no room for a woman to mete out justice, even a royal woman of the fae. And a mere human? They did their best to see that Vennolandua, first of the warrior queens, was forgotten completely.

There were no few points of pagan virtue that were deemed far too subversive even to record.

My biggest love, the thing that appeals to me about the Norse faith, is the drive to do something knowing you'll fail. Odin knows he can't bring his son back. He knows he will never win Ragnarok. He knows it has come before and shall come again.

Oh yes. The Norse could have taught the Greeks a thing or two about the beauty of the tragic.

But that's no reason not to try.

If I may, it's far more exquisite than futile, stubborn defiance.

A guarantee of defeat is no reason to compromise one's integrity. To be worthy, we must be prepared to suffer any cost. To suffer agony, defeat, humiliation is vastly preferable to betrayal of that we claim to stand for.[/QUOTE]

 

[Riverwolf]

Baldur/Baldr was turned into a Christ-figure during the Christianization. Though, even with Baldur dead, he was killed by mistletoe. So the "winter holiday" feel was there before that, just Baldur died and stayed dead, despite Odin's attempts to resurrect his son.

I think this was far better without Baldur resurrecting because of that. It suddenly becomes much more understandable as to why Odin and Loki have a falling out. His son is dead, and Hel will not release him.

I think it still works with Balder resurrecting. After all, when Odin himself finally dies and goes to Hel, that's when Balder resurrects. They'll never see each other again.

Granted, that's my own preference speaking; I think of the story in terms of its aspect as a mythic retelling of the cycle of day/night and waxing/waning year. The Sun always comes back.

 

[Quintessence]

Just to throw a wrench in things, I don't see Winter Solstice as about rebirth at all. It's the time of peak darkness.

When I was first learning about Neopaganism - specifically Wicca - there was all this talk about the path being balanced. Yet, when you learn about the wheel of the year, it is anything but balanced. There is a fixation on light and an ignoring of dark, and to me, not making Winter Solstice about Darkness is the strongest proof of that.

But, each to their own in terms of how they choose to interpret the wheel. It's probably easier to do what everyone else does and make it about rebirth of the light instead of celebrating darkness. People won't think you're an evil freak, and you won't get annoyed about Christmas lights.

 

[Nietzsche]

Just to throw a wrench in things, I don't see Winter Solstice as about rebirth at all. It's the time of peak darkness.

When I was first learning about Neopaganism - specifically Wicca - there was all this talk about the path being balanced. Yet, when you learn about the wheel of the year, it is anything but balanced. There is a fixation on light and an ignoring of dark, and to me, not making Winter Solstice about Darkness is the strongest proof of that.

But, each to their own in terms of how they choose to interpret the wheel. It's probably easier to do what everyone else does and make it about rebirth of the light instead of celebrating darkness. People won't think you're an evil freak, and you won't get annoyed about Christmas lights.

That is a Wiccan/NeoPagan problem rather than a Heathen problem to be honest.

 

[Storm]

Just to throw a wrench in things, I don't see Winter Solstice as about rebirth at all. It's the time of peak darkness.

Do you think they're mutually exclusive?

When I was first learning about Neopaganism - specifically Wicca - there was all this talk about the path being balanced. Yet, when you learn about the wheel of the year, it is anything but balanced. There is a fixation on light and an ignoring of dark, and to me, not making Winter Solstice about Darkness is the strongest proof of that.

I agree that there's an unfortunate trend, but I don't think we need to pick one. Of course the sun is reborn on the longest night. Of course the darkness is longest when the dying sun sets its last. How could it be otherwise?

But for me, autumn is the season of death, of darkness growing stronger, deeper, wiser as the sun grows feeble. Midwinter marks the transition back to the time of light and plenty.

But, each to their own in terms of how they choose to interpret the wheel.

Even so.

and you won't get annoyed about Christmas lights.

Wanna bet?

I don't object to the idea, but most are just ugly.

 

[Storm]

That is a Wiccan/NeoPagan problem rather than a Heathen problem to be honest.

Sorry.

 

[Nietzsche]

Sorry.

What for? There is nothing wrong with Wicca or Neopaganism, except when the former claims to be an "ancient" tradition.

 

[Storm]

What for? There is nothing wrong with Wicca or Neopaganism, except when the former claims to be an "ancient" tradition.

Oh, because I saw your response, got my threads mixed up, and thought I'd pontificated neopaganism in the Heathen DIR. LOL

That's all.

 

[Jainarayan]

Just to throw a wrench in things, I don't see Winter Solstice as about rebirth at all. It's the time of peak darkness.

Just a personal observation:

I think we perceive it that way because the weather lags behind the astronomy. From a purely astronomical p.o.v. a solstice or equinox lasts but an instant in time. And while it's true that the sun sets later as we move further away from the Winter Solstice, January seems like the longest, coldest, darkest month (ironically it isn't the darkest). We tend to get slammed with some really nasty winter weather even into mid-March. Even with knowing the amount of daylight is growing longer, I am certainly not going to plant marigolds outdoors yet.

 

[The Hammer]

Just to throw a wrench in things, I don't see Winter Solstice as about rebirth at all. It's the time of peak darkness.

When I was first learning about Neopaganism - specifically Wicca - there was all this talk about the path being balanced. Yet, when you learn about the wheel of the year, it is anything but balanced. There is a fixation on light and an ignoring of dark, and to me, not making Winter Solstice about Darkness is the strongest proof of that.

But, each to their own in terms of how they choose to interpret the wheel. It's probably easier to do what everyone else does and make it about rebirth of the light instead of celebrating darkness. People won't think you're an evil freak, and you won't get annoyed about Christmas lights.

The solstice is seen as being about rebirth because the days start getting longer from then on, but with that you have to understand and appreciate the dark as well. I tend to use the Autumn Equinox, and Samhain as the yearly focal points for darkness.

With that being said though, I also see the Winter Solstice as a time of darkness and I do give my respects to that aspect, I am not one to ignore one side of the coin.

 

[Storm]

Just a personal observation:

I think we perceive it that way because the weather lags behind the astronomy. From a purely astronomical p.o.v. a solstice or equinox lasts but an instant in time. And while it's true that the sun sets later as we move further away from the Winter Solstice, January seems like the longest, coldest, darkest month (ironically it isn't the darkest). We tend to get slammed with some really nasty winter weather even into mid-March. Even with knowing the amount of daylight is growing longer, I am certainly not going to plant marigolds outdoors yet.

Is this contradictory, though? Birth is always painful.