A Baptist church had a great idea. A drive in service! Nope.

[Twilight Hue]

But were they doing this?

Keep in mind that the mere fact that "Christianity Today" said they did everything right does not necessarily mean that they actually did everything right.

That's a valid assessment. I don't usually use Christian sources, but I do feel it's always good to have a perspective from their own eyes. From the horse's mouth as it were.

But yeah, it is a possibility they're not telling things as they are. Perhaps it's only a partial truth. I did notice a couple of small details left out. Communion and the passing of the tithe plate. ... I don't know if that was done and how.

 

[Twilight Hue]

There is no timescale. We can look at the past to see what people did. That is all. Such as, the Spanish Flu and Covid are two totally different things, with it still being mostly unknown how immunity against covid develops, and we don't know if this will be seasonal yet or not. As Newsome has repeatedly said, a timeline will not suffice because all we have is data. And we don't have enough data about covid to develop one. And keep in mind, it was predicted early on this could go on for the duration of summer, for the duration of the year.

Therein lies the issue. People are getting antsy and rightfully so.

For example, whats to stop any politician from taking advantage of the virus and prolonging it for political gain or personal advantage?

People are wondering when the indefinite or indeterminate will end? Whether a limit to the virus itself or a limit to people's patience. It's going to have to end one way or another.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Alright, but still 2 months is a big deal? Really? That's a minor inconvenience, isn't it?

It would be as far as I'm concerned. When I had my heart attack I was off for about a half a year. but it does get to the point where the money starts dwindling out and you can't pay bills, and the debt you're facing keeps getting larger and larger and makes a person think things, want to do things to stop this forced situation from getting worse.

It's noteworthy to say that there are a lot of people who still not have received any government checks to help keep food on the table and a roof over their heads.

Not a dime was seen and they're just about out of options.

People need to survive, that's the ultimate fact. And if one is going to starve to death per say, or get sick with covid and take a calculated chance, what do you think most people are going to decide?

 

[Windwalker]

It would be as far as I'm concerned. When I had my heart attack I was off for about a half a year. but it does get to the point where the money starts dwindling out and you can't pay bills, and the debt you're facing keeps getting larger and larger and makes a person think things, want to do things to stop this forced situation from getting worse.

Sure, I can understand looming desperation can be weighing on people's minds. But this business about not getting to go to church services? That may only be the pastor who's worried about the lack of offerings, whipping his people up because he is hysterical about things. You don't die from not going to church, as you should well know.

It's noteworthy to say that there are a lot of people who still not have received any government checks to help keep food on the table and a roof over their heads.

Not a dime was seen and they're just about out of options.

People need to survive, that's the ultimate fact. And if one is going to starve to death per say, or get sick with covid and take a calculated chance, what do you think most people are going to decide?

Sure, but not going to church is easy to avoid, and doesn't really do anything to help with those actual needs. Which of course is ironic, as that is what Christianity is supposed to be about, supporting those in need, rather than complaining what victims they are.

 

[exchemist]

Which doesn't mean open the floodgates. That, even now, is game over as it will over stress the already overstressed healthcare system.
The best we can now is mitigate and reduce damage where possible, as best we can, and pick up the pieces should a herd immunity develop or we get treatments. Or, we find out who exactly is at risk and basically support their every need on the tax payer dime (and keep in mind we do not know why and how this even kills young and healthy adults and children, so we wouldhave to find out).

Quite.

We tend to forget this virus has only been around 6 months. As we learn more about it, how it is transmitted, who is at risk, what will confer immunity, what the long term effects are, and how the virus may change over time, we will find ways to get gradually back to an acceptable way to live that does not impose excessive risk on vulnerable people. The rate at which our knowledge is growing is phenomenal, compared to previous epidemics, but it will still take time.

(By far the fastest way to obtain rapid answers to these questions is to "test, test, test". This is what the much maligned WHO has advised from January onward - only to be ignored by countries that were in denial or thought they knew better.)

I am confident we will get back to normal, with perhaps some manageable changes, within 12-18 months from now. But expecting it will magically go away in 3 months is just a childish denial of reality, in my view.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Sure, I can understand looming desperation can be weighing on people's minds. But this business about not getting to go to church services? That may only be the pastor who's worried about the lack of offerings, whipping his people up because he is hysterical about things. You don't die from not going to church, as you should well know.


Sure, but not going to church is easy to avoid, and doesn't really do anything to help with those actual needs. Which of course is ironic, as that is what Christianity is supposed to be about, supporting those in need, rather than complaining what victims they are.

Well if that's all going to be revised, then there would need to be a constitutional convention.

You have to remember the Constitution is one of the most important founding documents made for this country and religion is specifically pointed out.

People are being prevented from assembling together and the Constitution has made provisions for protecting congregate religion.

It's a reason why so many churches are rebelling now I think.

 

[Windwalker]

Well if that's all going to be revised, then there would need to be a constitutional convention.

You have to remember the Constitution is one of the most important founding documents made for this country and religion is specifically pointed out.

People are being prevented from assembling together and the Constitution has made provisions for protecting congregate religion.

It's a reason why so many churches are rebelling now I think.

It's a time of pubic health crisis. Normal liberties can, constitutionally, be suspended for periods of time for pubic safety. You don't need a constitutional convention in order to prohibit behaviours that put the public at risk during a pandemic. It's already in place.

This is a fabricated concern. It's not real. It's paranoia. It's fake news.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

People are wondering when the indefinite or indeterminate will end?

I know. I even caught myself wondering "how long?" in a way that suggests a time frame. But that does not exist roght now. It's just as fanciful and delusional as believing in Santa Clause. There is no getting around that fact. Its a comforting belief, like an eternal paradise, but thats all it is.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I know. I even caught myself wondering "how long?" in a way that suggests a time frame. But that does not exist roght now. It's just as fanciful and delusional as believing in Sant ita Clause. There is no getting around that fact. Its a comforting belief, like an eternal paradise, but thats all it is.

There's still the issue of making sure people are fed and still have a roof over their heads. Otherwise it's a fairly safe bet things are going to get more contentious.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

There's still the issue of making sure people are fed and still have a roof over their heads.

This is going to require orderly, organized, amd dare I say, inconvenient methods to reduce risk of exposure. For somethingsz there may be no other solution for now than uncle sam pays our rent and bills for some. It will have to be repaid, of course, but it would have been soent anyways with rebuilding were this a war against a human invader. It'll suck, but life is unfair, life is hard, **** happens, and ultimately no matter what yoh die. This is just something we just happened to get caught in (like a shooting, natural disaster, car wreck at the hands of another). We can deal with it, endure what we must while we must, or be a bunch if babies and keep on thinking about me evem though it makes it harder on everyone else.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well if that's all going to be revised, then there would need to be a constitutional convention.

You have to remember the Constitution is one of the most important founding documents made for this country and religion is specifically pointed out.

People are being prevented from assembling together and the Constitution has made provisions for protecting congregate religion.

It's a reason why so many churches are rebelling now I think.

Woukd you be willing to make it so that anyone who goes to church gets bumped down the list on treatment? That's the only way I can see making this remotely fair, because their going puts me at risk when are both at the store getting groceries.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Or, better yet. Church services now last two werks and everyone is quarantined and confined to the church building for two weeks.

 

[Wandering Monk]

Or, better yet. Church services now last two werks and everyone is quarantined and confined to the church building for two weeks.

Now that seems like an interesting idea. Same for restaurants.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Now that seems like an interesting idea. Same for restaurants.

Something has to be done. Those of us not being reckless and selfish should NOT be expected to bear an elevated risk because some people are apparently unable to think of anyone other than themselves, or believe Civid Fantasies and Myths. But those church goers, when we need groceries their selfish **** puts me at risk. I shouldn't have to tolerate that.

 

[Wandering Monk]

Something has to be done. Those of us not being reckless and selfish should NOT be expected to bear an elevated risk because some people are apparently unable to think of anyone other than themselves, or believe Civid Fantasies and Myths. But those church goers, when we need groceries their selfish **** puts me at risk. I shouldn't have to tolerate that.

I know it is frustrating, but we put each other at risk every day, don't we?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I know it is frustrating, but we put each other at risk every day, don't we?

Not to this extent, not like this.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Woukd you be willing to make it so that anyone who goes to church gets bumped down the list on treatment? That's the only way I can see making this remotely fair, because their going puts me at risk when are both at the store getting groceries.

Well if you're following the same procedures as everybody else, I don't see how the risk could be any greater.

Unless I'm missing something here.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well if you're following the same procedures as everybody else, I don't see how the risk could be any greater.

Unless I'm missing something here.

Increased socialization, increased number of people in close quarters, increased chance of catching covid, icreased risk of passing covid to others in early stages, very typically while being presymptomatic (or some asymptomatic).
Now, you take these massive gatherings out of the equation, and everyone's risk goes back down. But, basically going out and partaking in the reopening--that includes going to church--puts everyone at risk. Such as, I'm scheduled to donate blood tomorrow. But what if the people that'll be taking it were among the throngs needlessly in the stores today? That may put me at a higher risk because anyone of those two or three people I'll be interacting with could be out catching covid going off to newly rwopened stores.
And that's just me. Everyone remaining sensible I assume can relate in some approximate way.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Well if you're following the same procedures as everybody else, I don't see how the risk could be any greater.

Unless I'm missing something here.

I'll put it another way.
I could be making money. It would get me outnof the house, help me feel better, movijg around, etc., but that puts me and everyone I am near at a higher risk because I would be frequently out within close quarters around other people. But I'm getting unemployment so I just do not take that risk. Going out a couple times a week is far less risky than a few times a day, just because I'm not potentially exposing myself as often. And as much as I enjoy driving rideshare, I'm thinking this might be the end of it for me, because this could go on for awhile before I'd be comfortable being in such close proximity to so many people. It did alot of good for me, amd I doubt I everyvfully give it up (I had too much fun to not occasionally do it on the weekends), but being realistic about the situation, its time to move on to other things because a year is too long just wait and do nothing, and no real justification to put my life on the line and risk further serious injury to my body than what I already have. Demand is up, income is up, so is the chances of catching and spreading covid because of increased mingling. People wanting to go to church need to put that sort of serious thought into their decisions, because many if them do use services like Lyft and Uber to go to and from church, they will be going to the grocery stores, they will be doing and going wherever else, putting people at risk.

 

[Wandering Monk]

A recent story. These two churches were doing all the right things and still had Covid outbreaks. They chose to close to protect their members.

“Seating was marked to only permit sitting within the six foot guidelines, all doors were open to allow access without the touching of doors, and attendees were asked to enter in a social distancing manner and were dismissed in a formal manner as well to ensure that the social distancing measures were adhered by all,” the church told the outlet.
...
“Although the parish had followed cleaning, sanitation and social distancing guidelines prescribed by State health officials since reopening on May 2nd, they determined at that time it was best to close the Church immediately to public Masses until the results of their tests were known,” the archdiocese said.

“This past weekend, five of the seven members of the Redemptorists religious community learned that they had tested positive for COVID-19, including two priests who had been active in celebrating public Masses at Holy Ghost since May 2nd,” the religious organization added. “As a result of these findings, all Masses at Holy Ghost Church remain cancelled until further notice.”​

Two Southern churches forced to reclose after leaders, congregants get coronavirus