A bloodthirsty god?

[Harmonious]

Valid points.

I would give you some more frubals, but I have already given them to you for your 1st reply here. Damn system won't let me give you more.

Thank you kindly.

 

[Autodidact]

Okay...this is just my opinion that I've formed thru study but...like everything I've been reading in these Forums..."just my opinion". However, I think God had to do it for a reason. His Plan, once man and woman screwed things up with that "mess-up" in the Garden, was to pave the way for the Messiah to come and save mankind. During all this, Satan tried his best to stop it and still does. When the angels came down and mated with earthly women, the union produced some strange soulless beings. To me...this is why God would wipe out a whole nation of people...including women and children. Noah wasn't perfect...but his lineage was. This was why only his family was saved from the second flood. Then when the Messiah came along...things changed. The Old Law was done away with and the "eye for an eye" thing...was put aside. Okay...there's a lot more but in the effort to save time and space...what do you think so far?

I think this is an ancient, primitive, barbaric myth comparable to say the Gilgamesh.

 

[Autodidact]

people liked killing people better if a god ordered it so they said to profets
yo we need a good reason to kill someone, and there like ok wel just say god told us to do it
happend alot back then

and still happens now.

 

[Autodidact]

This and other threads explore the possibility of theodicy, which is basically the attempt to exonerate God in the face of the evil apparent in creation or evil done at his hands or by his authorization.

As a Christian, I find this among other passages deeply troubling. But the real issue, for me at least, is the question of God's attitude toward his creation and the people that populate it. And to answer that question, my controlling image is the cross. There, God demonstrated his love for all of humanity and made a full disclosure of his character -- nonviolent and longsuffering. Yes, this observation must be held in tension with passages as we see here. But in the end, we are looking through a glass darkly, as they say. We know only in part, and what we do know we're apt to confuse. In the end, we can only place ourselves at the mercy of the Creator, whether he is a tyrant (as you may fear) or a benevolent father (as you may hope). What other option -- assuming the existence of a creator -- are open to us?

Exactly. Assuming the existence of this particular creator, that is. Another good reason not to assume that.

btw, I don't find killing your son to somehow vicariously atone for the sins that people are supposed to have inherited from their distant ancestor eating the wrong fruit to be particularly loving either.

 

[Riverwolf]

I think this is an ancient, primitive, barbaric myth comparable to say the Gilgamesh.

Uh.... Gilgamesh describes a man who has sex with animals, and then given a human prostitute so as to become as a human. On the surface, this and other parts can point to the same kind of barbarism.

Then again, the Bible doesn't call the "sons" of the children of God soulless, and in fact, they aren't even human at all; they were giants, and were already wiped out by the flood. So the "myth" that Green Kepi spoke of doesn't even exist.

 

[Heneni]

For starters, IF god said go kill such and such, they would appear dead to the isrealites and even to their own people, but they are not dead to god.

Secondly, god seemingly organised the 'beating' of the Isrealites on a few occasions as well, so at least that doesnt mean he was unfair.

The wages of sin is death, for everybody anyway. The bible did not say, natural death necesarily. Death now or death later, no difference, what you get for sinning is death.

If the wages of sin is death, then god has the power to decide when death should be, like for any of us, he is the one that decides when the time is up, and when payment for sins is due.

However keep in mind that god is able to awake anybody from their death sleep and send them back to earth, which is what I believe he does. So all of us, at one point in time, have been on the 'other side' of the isrealites, and we were also at one point been 'an isrealite'. So we have actually had experience in being the instrument of justice, and the one on which justice was excecuted.

However, after jesus all that changed. He came to bring life. So then. Justice was served with jesus, for jew and gentile alike. Now, the wages of sin does not have to be death. Back then, as david said, the dead went to sheol, the place of the dead, to sleep. After jesus, when you die you dont have to go to sheol, the place of the dead, sort of like a holding place, but instead you go to paradise, (not heaven) where abraham and moses and the rest of the children of god are. Infact I believe that when Jesus was raised from the dead, so were you, and you were translated out of the kingdom of darkness (sheol) and into the light(paradise). Which means, your spirit was taken to paradise. It is from here that you are incarnated back onto this planet.

I'm pretty sure Jayhawker wont understand but perhaps somebody else does.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Back then, as david said, the dead went to sheol, the place of the dead, to sleep. After jesus, when you die you dont have to go to sheol, the place of the dead, sort of like a holding place, but instead you go to paradise, (not heaven) where abraham and moses and the rest of the children of god are. Infact I believe that when Jesus was raised from the dead, so were you, and you were translated out of the kingdom of darkness (sheol) and into the light(paradise). Which means, your spirit was taken to paradise. It is from here that you are incarnated back onto this planet.

I'm pretty sure Jayhawker wont understand but perhaps somebody else does.

Quaint. Drivel and ignorant, but quaint ...

 

[Autodidact]

For starters, IF god said go kill such and such, they would appear dead to the isrealites and even to their own people, but they are not dead to god.

Secondly, god seemingly organised the 'beating' of the Isrealites on a few occasions as well, so at least that doesnt mean he was unfair.

The wages of sin is death, for everybody anyway. The bible did not say, natural death necesarily. Death now or death later, no difference, what you get for sinning is death.

If the wages of sin is death, then god has the power to decide when death should be, like for any of us, he is the one that decides when the time is up, and when payment for sins is due.

However keep in mind that god is able to awake anybody from their death sleep and send them back to earth, which is what I believe he does. So all of us, at one point in time, have been on the 'other side' of the isrealites, and we were also at one point been 'an isrealite'. So we have actually had experience in being the instrument of justice, and the one on which justice was excecuted.

However, after jesus all that changed. He came to bring life. So then. Justice was served with jesus, for jew and gentile alike. Now, the wages of sin does not have to be death. Back then, as david said, the dead went to sheol, the place of the dead, to sleep. After jesus, when you die you dont have to go to sheol, the place of the dead, sort of like a holding place, but instead you go to paradise, (not heaven) where abraham and moses and the rest of the children of god are. Infact I believe that when Jesus was raised from the dead, so were you, and you were translated out of the kingdom of darkness (sheol) and into the light(paradise). Which means, your spirit was taken to paradise. It is from here that you are incarnated back onto this planet.

I'm pretty sure Jayhawker wont understand but perhaps somebody else does.

Lack of understanding is not the problem, Heneni. The problem is that this is silly, antiquated mythology that makes no sense.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Back then, as david said, the dead went to sheol, the place of the dead, to sleep.

Lack of understanding is not the problem, Heneni. The problem is that this is silly, antiquated mythology that makes no sense.

At the very least, Heneni should get the mythology right rather than reducing it to simplistic nonsense.

 

[Riverwolf]

Lack of understanding is not the problem, Heneni. The problem is that this is silly, antiquated mythology that makes no sense.

Only if you look at it as a silly, antiquated mythology.

However, if you want a non-mythological way of saying what was trying to be said, read Tao Te Ching. From what I've read, the teachings in there are pretty much identical to Jewish and Christian philosophy.

And am I the only one who understood what Heneni was talking about? 'Cause I understood it perfectly.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

And am I the only one who understood what Heneni was talking about? 'Cause I understood it perfectly.

:biglaugh:

 

[Autodidact]

Only if you look at it as a silly, antiquated mythology.

However, if you want a non-mythological way of saying what was trying to be said, read Tao Te Ching. From what I've read, the teachings in there are pretty much identical to Jewish and Christian philosophy.

I strongly disagree, and I think most Christians would disagree as well.

And am I the only one who understood what Heneni was talking about? 'Cause I understood it perfectly.

I understood him just fine.

 

[Kcnorwood]

Even the NT has some things in it that show us God is not all that good.

 

[Heneni]

:beach: What was that? OH...the usual.

 

[Heneni]

Even the NT has some things in it that show us God is not all that good.

Examples? I cant think of any accept maybe revelation?

 

[Autodidact]

Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
-Jesus

 

[Kcnorwood]

Examples? I cant think of any accept maybe revelation?

Matthew 24:50-51 The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. 51He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Matthew 10:21 Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death.

Here a real kicker....

Matthew 5:17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.



Which pretty much means the laws in the OT still hold true.

 

[Riverwolf]

I guess I'm the only one who can connect the East with the West...

 

[gnostic]

I understood him just fine.

You mean "her".

 

[Heneni]

Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
-Jesus

Where is the sword have you seen it. He is not talking about a physical war.