A Candidate-Free Discussion

[Blentyn chan Celi]

Foreign policy is fascinating… but I want to talk about socialized healthcare.

Why in the world does anyone think that it is a good idea for the government to run American healthcare? Haven’t we learned anything from letting them run social security?
“If it’s broken, let the next administration fix it. I don’t want to upset my constituency.”

 

[Kidblop]

Foreign policy is fascinating… but I want to talk about socialized healthcare.

Why in the world does anyone think that it is a good idea for the government to run American healthcare? Haven’t we learned anything from letting them run social security?
“If it’s broken, let the next administration fix it. I don’t want to upset my constituency.”

Social security is broken because the Republicans keep cutting taxes on the rich and Gore's proposal for a lock box was rejected. Conservatives want to keep themselves as rich as possible.

 

[Francine]

Social security is broken because the Republicans keep cutting taxes on the rich and Gore's proposal for a lock box was rejected. Conservatives want to keep themselves as rich as possible.

Social Security isn't broken, but it is a simple transfer of money from workers to retirees. As the average age of the American population increases, we will need to keep bringing in new workers from outside our borders to keep this multi-generational compact going. Republicans act like they don't want Mexicans to come here to work.

 

[doppelganger]

Republicans act like they don't want Mexicans to come here to work.

The ones profiting from their labor don't (which in a roundabout way is all of them).

 

[Reverend Rick]

Republicans act like they don't want Mexicans to come here to work.

That is so unfair Francine. Actually many Republican want them here so they can under pay them and keep wages down.

I think of myself as a reasonable Republican. I want work visas, a path to citizenship and fairness for my visitors from the south. I also want them documented so we know who they are. The law breakers need to be deported and the hard working decent folks need to be on the books and pay taxes if they are not already doing this as many are.

We need to enforce our borders for security reasons, not to restrict entry. I want to know that who ever is in this country, is not rapists, robbers, drug smugglers, and murderers.

 

[McBell]

I want to know that who ever is in this country, is not rapists, robbers, drug smugglers, and murderers.

You have some sort of test for this?
With all the Americans who are in prison for those same crimes...
What, we ship them to Mexico as well?

 

[doppelganger]

I want to know that who ever is in this country, is not rapists, robbers, drug smugglers, and murderers.

That would require us to deport half the GOP and pretty much all of its leadership.

 

[Reverend Rick]

That would require us to deport half the GOP and pretty much all of its leadership.

Tell you what Dopp, you pick 30 politicians and I will as well and the country would be better off without them.

Both sides need to be purged.

Perhaps what we need in this country is the republicans picking the democratic candidate and the democrats picking the republican candidate. That would be interesting......

Paul vs Lieberman or something resembling that.

 

[doppelganger]

Tell you what Dopp, you pick 30 politicians and I will as well and the country would be better off without them.

That's a great idea. Why stop at 30 though? I'm not ideologically committed to a party though, so maybe that wouldn't exactly be fair to everyone.

Paul vs Lieberman or something resembling that.

Craig v. Jefferson

 

[Blentyn chan Celi]

Foreign policy is fascinating… but I want to talk about socialized healthcare.

Why in the world does anyone think that it is a good idea for the government to run American healthcare? Haven’t we learned anything from letting them run social security?
“If it’s broken, let the next administration fix it. I don’t want to upset my constituency.”

So, as I was saying before all the partisan finger-pointing broke out… Let me see if I can remember…
Yes, why do the Dems think it is a good idea to socialize healthcare? Do we really want Uncle Sam, who can't balance a budget, responsible for our healthcare? I can understand that “Healthcare for every American,” brings in votes, but do they really believe it is a good idea?

 

[Blentyn chan Celi]

Social Security isn't broken, but it is a simple transfer of money from workers to retirees. As the average age of the American population increases, we will need to keep bringing in new workers from outside our borders to keep this multi-generational compact going. Republicans act like they don't want Mexicans to come here to work.

I am a Republican, and I live in central CA where there are more Mexicans that Gringos. I have no problem with them as long as they pay taxes and I don’t have to dive behind them on the freeway.

As far as Social Security goes, it is not broken; there just isn’t enough money to go around. The only solution is to start taking more from me or giving less to Grampa. Either way, no one wants to be the guy who did what needed to be done.

I don’t know anything about Gore’s plan, but then I don’t read the tabloids.

 

[doppelganger]

Yes, why do the Dems think it is a good idea to socialize healthcare?

I'm not a Dem (though I'm supporting one for Prez this year). But why do the Repubs think it's a good idea for children to die of simple treatable illnesses because they can't get basic health care?

You unload your question, and I'll unload mine. :rainbow1:

 

[Blentyn chan Celi]

I'm not a Dem (though I'm supporting one for Prez this year). But why do the Repubs think it's a good idea for children to die of simple treatable illnesses because they can't get basic health care?

You unload your question, and I'll unload mine. :rainbow1:

The government should certainly subsidize care for those who can’t afford it, but the healthcare industry should remain privet.

 

[doppelganger]

The government should certainly subsidize care for those who can’t afford it, but the healthcare industry should remain privet.

So you actually support several proposed Dem plans.

 

[Blentyn chan Celi]

So you actually support several proposed Dem plans.

You have my attention…

 

[doppelganger]

You have my attention…

Barack Obama | Change We Can Believe In | Health Care

 

[Blentyn chan Celi]

Barack Obama | Change We Can Believe In | Health Care

It sounds like a good plan. IMO, possible problems could include:
Cost. Health care is already 16 cents of every dollar spent in America. Who is going to pay for this?
Management. I still think it is a bad idea to put healthcare in the hands of someone who is more interested in getting reelected then getting the job done.
Quality. If you remove the possibility for healthcare providers to make money, they will find a different gig.

 

[doppelganger]

It sounds like a good plan. IMO, possible problems could include:
Cost. Health care is already 16 cents of every dollar spent in America. Who is going to pay for this?
Management. I still think it is a bad idea to put healthcare in the hands of someone who is more interested in getting reelected then getting the job done.
Quality. If you remove the possibility for healthcare providers to make money, they will find a different gig.

Those are all valid concerns. Though private insurers will sacrifice quality and call it better management when left to their own devices. I have a long post on another thread that outlines the full scope of the problem of which the lack of availability is but one piece.

 

[tomspug]

Foreign policy is fascinating… but I want to talk about socialized healthcare.

Why in the world does anyone think that it is a good idea for the government to run American healthcare? Haven’t we learned anything from letting them run social security?
“If it’s broken, let the next administration fix it. I don’t want to upset my constituency.”

I always get a picture in my mind of a trash can labeled "government". Anything we can't be bothered to deal with ourselves, we toss in the bin. Health care reform? Won't be bothered, let's just have the government do it.

 

[Smoke]

Yes, why do the Dems think it is a good idea to socialize healthcare? Do we really want Uncle Sam, who can't balance a budget, responsible for our healthcare?

If Uncle Sam is too incompetent to manage healthcare, then he should shouldn't be trusted with the national defense, intelligence, foreign relations, or law enforcement, either, since all of those are at least as important as healthcare. If they're honest, people who oppose national healthcare on the grounds of governmental incompetence should also advocate the abolition of the US military, the CIA, the FBI, the NSA, the State Department, the Justice Department, the Department of Defense, and the federal court system. Just for starters.