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A Chance for Atheists to Recover

Ant0nio

Member
1. Don't worry, the animals I eat don't breath either anymore..
2. Withholding information can also be seen as lying. I think sometimes it's needed to withold information.
3. And if I ask really really softly?
4. Done.
5. Here in the Netherlands it is possible to get a prescription to get marihuana. Those are not from animals, comes from "god's garden" mother nature, being vegetarian and you'll get very comfortable taking them. According to you, this is all ok.
But what if you play doctor yourself and the same results with the same??

1. The point of being vegetarian is to not incur the heavy karmic debt that comes with eating meat. The suffering of the animal all goes to you when you eat it, and that suffering has to come out in some form. There is no suffering in heaven, so if you cause suffering to others willingly and knowing (animals included) you won't be able to learn this method of meditation.

2. Try your best to be honest.

3. As long as there is consent from both parties for you to get something, it is ok.

4.good.

5. Marijuana is labeled as an intoxicant in the precepts. Don't take any mind altering drugs. Certain situations are questionable, but the bottom line is that you need a clear head to meditate effectively. Marijuana is out.

Drugs are bad :(, they ruin you. Be drug free.

All of these precepts are really guidelines, no need to be fanatical, but try your best to do what is right.

Again, marijuana is not allowed, it's bad for your meditation.

Here is a question that was asked of the master about drugs:

The Horror of Drugs


Spoken by Supreme Master Ching Hai
Hsihu, Formosa, June 27, 1995
(Originally in English)

Q: I have a problem with the meditation. Before, for a few years, I was taking quite a few hallucinatory drugs.

M: So what happens now? If you don't take, it's good for you. Of course, you damaged the brain cells a little; but it's all right, we'll repair it. So you have problems when you meditate. What kind of problems?

Q: Concentration.

M: Concentration - that's why you have to practice, of course, but I think you're okay; you are repaired. Don't worry about that. Concentration is just a common "disease" of this world's people, so don't worry; take it easy and when you meditate you always have to remember here (Master points to the wisdom eye) with all sweetness and loving kindness. Then it massages your inner brain. Use your love, contact inside, that's all you need. Because you didn't take drugs for too long, it's okay. It's repairable. You do the Quan Yin Method and it will repair more. It will mend all the tissues and recharge them with new life and energy. Don't worry about that. You have to do it more diligently. Even if you can't concentrate, you do it. When you do the Quan Quang, the Light, of course, it's not easy to concentrate. But the Quan Yin Method, even if you don't concentrate, it's also there so it will help you. The Quan Yin Method means the "Sound"; it's the most beneficial for this kind of problem.

I'm very happy that you have quit the nasty habit and come back to your beautiful Self, fragrant with the elixir of love. It's more suitable for you, for such a handsome guy. So he is very clever and strong. It is very difficult to get out of that habit. If you are in, I think you're finished. Many people are finished. Sometimes they end their lives because they can't do anything about it. You know drugs are very nasty. When a drug addict has no food, drugging "food," then he feels like millions of needles are pinching him from inside and his whole body is like it's on fire and things like that when he can't get it on time. Terrible, and they're in agony all the time; or it's like thousands of snakes are biting them at the same time everywhere, from inside the brain. That's how drugs damage the nerves of people and make them die a horrible and slow death.

That's why all of the drug-selling people are the most horrible beings in this world. They trade such a poison, killing people's brains, energy, youth and their precious intelligence. The drug-selling people are terrible. If they realized what harm they do to the world, I think they would stop. I don't think they realize it because, as the drug dealer they probably don't take it themselves. They know it very well and don't take them. If they do take them, they always have enough supply, so they might die eventually from the poison but not in such agony; they would die from the drugs, that's all. Overdose and die quickly, but not in such agony, so they don't realize what harm they are doing to the youth of this world.

It's terrible. See how terrible it is? Very rarely can people get out of that habit. This is really terrible. All the time the world is in trouble. Actually drugs are one of those things we can avoid; therefore, we must avoid them. We must avoid spreading suffering to humankind by trading drugs, encouraging the use of drugs, having anything to do with drugs, or covering for the people who buy, sell or accidentally stumble onto drugs and become the victim of them.

We must avoid them - drugs, cigarettes, alcohol and things like that. It's a disaster that we can avoid, so we must avoid it. We can die anytime of anything, of course; but if we inflict suffering upon ourselves and upon other people, then we take the karma.

Of course, in war too, the people who order war take the heaviest karma. If we go to hell, we see all kinds of people there. If one day you're bored and you want to go "shopping" in hell, you have a look. Almost all the famous murderers are there and they are suffering all the time. They are suffering the feelings that they caused to millions or billions of victims when they were alive. That's what is called "hell". There is no need of a devil to pinch you, to fork you, to chop you, to grind you - no need; your eternal turmoil is enough to kill you every day. The more people you kill, the more people you abuse or agonize, the more suffering and the longer you will have to experience that.
 

BucephalusBB

ABACABB
1. The point of being vegetarian is to not incur the heavy karmic debt that comes with eating meat. The suffering of the animal all goes to you when you eat it, and that suffering has to come out in some form. There is no suffering in heaven, so if you cause suffering to others willingly and knowing (animals included) you won't be able to learn this method of meditation.

2. Try your best to be honest.

3. As long as there is consent from both parties for you to get something, it is ok.

4.good.

5. Marijuana is labeled as an intoxicant in the precepts. Don't take any mind altering drugs. Certain situations are questionable, but the bottom line is that you need a clear head to meditate effectively. Marijuana is out..
1. Shoot me in the head now and I'll have less suffering than letting me live untill I am 120 years old. (now don't shoot me in the head, I am just making a point of how I view death.)
2. I do, don't worry. I just think it's not always for the better.
3. done.
4. done.
5. Imagine yourself to have constant headaches or migrane or something. There is no prescription the doctor can give you that is not mind altering. NONE!

Drugs are bad :(, they ruin you. Be drug free
I disagree, but for the sake of this forum and it's rules, let's just say that you are giving the best option and at least the safest here..
 

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
It is not my method, it is my master's method.
It's not your master's method either. ;)

If you practice diligently, you really will be able to meet and know Jesus.
I'm not disputing that. It just won't be the "Jesus" for which most "Christians" think they are searching. :cool:

The master has to be living for you to recieve initiation to learn the method, but the master does not have to be present during your initation.
Wrong, wrong, wrong. A master might have to be living for your "initiation". You have no idea what I require though, and it is presumptuous for you to claim you do.

The vegetarian diet is a requirement however. This isn't my rule, lol, it is a requirement from my master. It is not what I think, it is what she requires to teach you her method.
Then it's a requirement for you. I'm my own "master." I couldn't care less what your master requires, and as long as you do, you will not truly have become intoxicated by drinking the living water. :rainbow1:
 

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
BTW, has anyone else noticed that all the "Prophetic advice" being offered in this thread is so lacking in self-reflection that we seem to be overrun with vampires?
:dracula:
 

tomspug

Absorbant
doppelgänger;1183206 said:
I'm not disputing that. It just won't be the "Jesus" for which most "Christians" think they are searching. :cool:
Very few historians would dispute the historical Jesus as described in the New Testament, with the exception of his miracles, which of course requires a kind of 'faith'.

The only historians that do are the ones that hold the New Testament to a sort of mythological, inscrutable standard that no other historical document from that time period could hold up to as well (and, by the way, that number of historians is significantly small).

While it may be possible that Jesus was "wrong" (in not being the Son of God), it is highly unlikely that Jesus "the man" was anything other than what Christians believe him to have been.:cool:
 

Ant0nio

Member
doppelgänger;1183206 said:
It's not your master's method either. ;)

I'm not disputing that. It just won't be the "Jesus" for which most "Christians" think they are searching. :cool:

Wrong, wrong, wrong. A master might have to be living for your "initiation". You have no idea what I require though, and it is presumptuous for you to claim you do.

Then it's a requirement for you. I'm my own "master." I couldn't care less what your master requires, and as long as you do, you will not truly have become intoxicated by drinking the living water. :rainbow1:

I'm sorry if I seem confusing, I'm only giving the requirements to learn the Quan Yin Method of meditation given by Master Ching Hai. And again, master is just a word, a better word to express what would suit this situation is teacher. She teaches a method of meditation to be able to see the Light and hear the Sound of God.

I'm not claiming that I know what you require, i'm only stating what is required to learn the Quan Yin method of meditation, to be initiated into that method, no one else's. If you don't think that this meditation or having a master would suit you, then I respect your opinoin and choice. I am by no means trying to tell you how to seek the truth, i'm only offering a way, and stating why I think this is the best method to seek the truth.

I truly don't mean to offend or alarm, only to inform and offer. If you do not like my offer than you can refuse it. If you do like the offer than please private message me, or email me at [email protected]

I would be happy to make arrangements for you to learn more about the Quan Yin method.

Again, this method is completely free, and doesn't require you to leave your religion or to join any organization or pay any dues. It is totally free to you.
 

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
I'm sorry if I seem confusing, I'm only giving the requirements to learn the Quan Yin Method of meditation given by Master Ching Hai.
You don't seem confusing at all, actually. Just substantially lacking a capacity for self reflection, which results in an unseemly arrogance that undercuts your "message." ;)

I am by no means trying to tell you how to seek the truth,

Pan up a few pages and read your earlier posts. You most certainly are "trying to tell [me and everyone else] how to seek the truth." I think you're now being dishonest. Which, BTW, will also sabotage your "evangel."
 

Ant0nio

Member
doppelgänger;1183239 said:
Plants may also have nervous systems and can feel something roughly analogous to "pain."

This is our growing understanding of "root apices."

http://ds9.botanik.uni-bonn.de/zellbio/AG-Baluska-Volkmann/plantneuro/pdf/NeuroPlantTZ-Biologia.pdf

Here is a question asked of the master about eating plants:

Q: Eating animals is killing living beings, but isn't eating vegetables a kind of killing, too?

M: Eating plants is also killing living things and will create some karmic hindrance, but the effect is very minimal. If one practices the Quan Yin Method for two and a half hours every day, one can get rid of this karmic effect. As we have to eat in order to survive, we choose food which has the least consciousness and suffers the least. Plants consist of 90% water, thus their level of consciousness is so low that it hardly feels any suffering. Furthermore, when we eat many vegetables we don't cut their roots, but rather we help their asexual reproduction by cutting branches and leaves. The end result can actually be beneficial to the plant. Therefore, horticulturists say that pruning vegetation helps them grow large and beautiful.

This is even more evident with fruit. When fruit ripens, it will attract people to eat it by its fragrant smell, beautiful color and delicious taste. It is in this way that fruit trees can achieve their purpose of propagating their seed over a wide area. If we do not pick and eat them, the fruit will become overripe and will fall to the ground to rot. Its seed will be shaded from sunlight by the tree above them and will die. So, eating vegetables and fruit is a natural tendency, which brings to them no suffering at all.
 

Ant0nio

Member
doppelgänger;1183252 said:
You don't seem confusing at all, actually. Just substantially lacking a capacity for self reflection, which results in an unseemly arrogance that undercuts your "message." ;)



Pan up a few pages and read your earlier posts. You most certainly are "trying to tell [me and everyone else] how to seek the truth." I think you're now being dishonest. Which, BTW, will also sabotage your "evangel."


When I say i'm not trying to tell you how to seek the truth, I'm saying that I'm not trying to force you how to seek the truth, only offering a way.
 

tomspug

Absorbant
We are in a constant state of killing. By merely living, you are slaughtering literally millions of organisms. Consumption of large quantities of food is a part of life as well, in the same way. It can't be helped. Choosing, by principle, to choose one food or another is no different from the choice of any omnivore in nature.

However, I whole-heartedly support the idea of choosing NOT to consume certain foods for your own health or for the well-being of society. I, personally, avoid all high-fructose corn syrup and certain preservatives.
 

doppelganger

Through the Looking Glass
This is even more evident with fruit. When fruit ripens, it will attract people to eat it by its fragrant smell, beautiful color and delicious taste. It is in this way that fruit trees can achieve their purpose of propagating their seed over a wide area. If we do not pick and eat them, the fruit will become overripe and will fall to the ground to rot.
There's a similar symbiotic relationship between humans and our domesticated food animals, who are given shelter and fed well, and bred for their preferable food attributes.
 

Magic Man

Reaper of Conversation
If it is a plant, it's allowed. If it is an animal it isn't allowed. Please forgive my mistake, plants do breathe oxygen. As for the sponge, I still wouldn't eat it.

All right, then, maybe you could explain this now obvious double standard.
 

Storm

ThrUU the Looking Glass
The double standard is based on the ultimately anthro-centric assumption that animals are a higher form of life. Personally, I think it's bs.

Because plants can't express pain in a way we understand, we assume they don't feel it.
 

Magic Man

Reaper of Conversation
The double standard is based on the ultimately anthro-centric assumption that animals are a higher form of life. Personally, I think it's bs.

Because plants can't express pain in a way we understand, we assume they don't feel it.

I know. I wanted to see what kind of reasons Antonio could give, other than "because they're plants".
 

Smoke

Done here.
doppelgänger;1183239 said:
Plants may also have nervous systems and can feel something roughly analogous to "pain."

This is our growing understanding of "root apices."

http://ds9.botanik.uni-bonn.de/zellbio/AG-Baluska-Volkmann/plantneuro/pdf/NeuroPlantTZ-Biologia.pdf
That subject interests me so much that I clicked on the link even though the prospect of reading a scientific paper in German gives me a shooting pain between the eyes. I can't tell you how relieved I am to see it's in English. (Or what passes for English in a scientific paper.) :D
 
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