Hello Religious Forums, I am an Atheist and a Communist looking to discuss religion.
I realize this is just asking for trouble, but I would like to understand religion better and to learn to respect people even if I disagree with them, especially on an issue as sensitive as religion.
As an Atheist, I find that the 'new atheists' such as Dawkins, Hitches etc. are extremely articulate but are deeply complacent, if not arrogant regarding the magnitude of the changes which atheism brings about. Their near universal silence on the history of communism speaks volumes in terms of the refusal to engage with religion on a philosophical and moral level, whilst instead hiding behind an appeal to science as the authority by which to determine the validity of religious belief. Whilst criticising Communism as a 'religion' (and they are not wholly wrong in this regard as it begins with dogmatic premises known as 'dialectical materialism'), they are not willing to really engage with the problem of subjective belief in scientific ideas, and the fact that even if scientific ideas are objectively true, they remain the product of human activity and their validity is limited by it by our limits of our perception and of science and technology to make discoveries. To do so would be to admit that science (and indeed Marxism) are based on a form of 'faith' and that we can not be sure if our beliefs are 100% true.
I generally accept scientific ideas, but Marxist philosophy pushes me towards a degree of skepticism because theories of evolution and the big bang do not rule out the existence of god entirely. this is the reverse of religious criticism of science such as intelligent design, as communists would say the big bang still leaves space for a 'creator' of sorts and is 'not atheist enough'. This caused headaches for Scientists in the USSR who struggled to reconcile an Atheist Party ideology with scientific evidence, in much the same way religions struggle with it.
Before anyone asks, I am not an apologist for communist atrocities and I realize that many people, particularly religious, have good reason to be hostile towards communists. Despite the end of the Cold War, anti-communist sentiments are widespread especially in the US who I could reasonably assume many people on this forum are from. I do however have some sense of collective guilt over it and this has made me seriously question my beliefs in a way that is fairly unusual for communists (who in the main remain in denial in one form or another). What I've found over time, is that trying to reconcile the realities of communism with it's theoretical underpinnings has made me think along the lines of the 'problem of evil' (if god/communism is all-benevolent, then why does evil exist?). This has also made me examine my own ethical ideas and put me into a position similar to the one proposed by Nietzsche in which the 'death of god' leads to a big nihilistic crisis of moral thought, which human beings have to consciously fill with their own ideas. Marx and Nietzsche have similar ethics as strongly anti-religious atheists, but would fundamentally disagree on politics and philosophy, so I'm using him more to illustrate the problem in it's most familiar guise.
I am not automatically 'anti-religious' as it depends on the effects of the belief, rather than the belief itself. Some communists (known derogatorily as the 'god-builders') recognized that religion represented a universal human desire for understanding existence which Marxists and atheists were also going to have to come to terms with. I sympathize with their position, but don't know a huge amount about it. They were around in the early 20th century and there was a conflict between them and Lenin which is of minor importance. they were purged (like just about everyone else) under Stalin and it hasn't re-appeared because communist orthodoxy didn't permit it and that orthodoxy is now in complete ruins.
my own belief system is broadly communist (because I accept it's basic philosophical premises even if it's politics is deeply troubling) and is therefore something of a mess which is why I want to talk to people who I would normally disagree with as it will help me figure stuff out.
I realize this is just asking for trouble, but I would like to understand religion better and to learn to respect people even if I disagree with them, especially on an issue as sensitive as religion.
As an Atheist, I find that the 'new atheists' such as Dawkins, Hitches etc. are extremely articulate but are deeply complacent, if not arrogant regarding the magnitude of the changes which atheism brings about. Their near universal silence on the history of communism speaks volumes in terms of the refusal to engage with religion on a philosophical and moral level, whilst instead hiding behind an appeal to science as the authority by which to determine the validity of religious belief. Whilst criticising Communism as a 'religion' (and they are not wholly wrong in this regard as it begins with dogmatic premises known as 'dialectical materialism'), they are not willing to really engage with the problem of subjective belief in scientific ideas, and the fact that even if scientific ideas are objectively true, they remain the product of human activity and their validity is limited by it by our limits of our perception and of science and technology to make discoveries. To do so would be to admit that science (and indeed Marxism) are based on a form of 'faith' and that we can not be sure if our beliefs are 100% true.
I generally accept scientific ideas, but Marxist philosophy pushes me towards a degree of skepticism because theories of evolution and the big bang do not rule out the existence of god entirely. this is the reverse of religious criticism of science such as intelligent design, as communists would say the big bang still leaves space for a 'creator' of sorts and is 'not atheist enough'. This caused headaches for Scientists in the USSR who struggled to reconcile an Atheist Party ideology with scientific evidence, in much the same way religions struggle with it.
Before anyone asks, I am not an apologist for communist atrocities and I realize that many people, particularly religious, have good reason to be hostile towards communists. Despite the end of the Cold War, anti-communist sentiments are widespread especially in the US who I could reasonably assume many people on this forum are from. I do however have some sense of collective guilt over it and this has made me seriously question my beliefs in a way that is fairly unusual for communists (who in the main remain in denial in one form or another). What I've found over time, is that trying to reconcile the realities of communism with it's theoretical underpinnings has made me think along the lines of the 'problem of evil' (if god/communism is all-benevolent, then why does evil exist?). This has also made me examine my own ethical ideas and put me into a position similar to the one proposed by Nietzsche in which the 'death of god' leads to a big nihilistic crisis of moral thought, which human beings have to consciously fill with their own ideas. Marx and Nietzsche have similar ethics as strongly anti-religious atheists, but would fundamentally disagree on politics and philosophy, so I'm using him more to illustrate the problem in it's most familiar guise.
I am not automatically 'anti-religious' as it depends on the effects of the belief, rather than the belief itself. Some communists (known derogatorily as the 'god-builders') recognized that religion represented a universal human desire for understanding existence which Marxists and atheists were also going to have to come to terms with. I sympathize with their position, but don't know a huge amount about it. They were around in the early 20th century and there was a conflict between them and Lenin which is of minor importance. they were purged (like just about everyone else) under Stalin and it hasn't re-appeared because communist orthodoxy didn't permit it and that orthodoxy is now in complete ruins.
my own belief system is broadly communist (because I accept it's basic philosophical premises even if it's politics is deeply troubling) and is therefore something of a mess which is why I want to talk to people who I would normally disagree with as it will help me figure stuff out.
