A few points

[siti]

the idea that a fish transitions into a reptile there is still no evidence apart from sketchy comparison between fossils.

Sorry to be the one to break the bad news to you, but you are part fish...or at least there is something very fishy about your body plan...

Take the recurrent laryngeal nerve for example...it takes a seemingly unnecessarily circuitous route from the brain, down into the chest, looping around the aorta and then back up to the larynx to control swallowing and speech. It follows the same path - which is respectively much shorter or longer in everything from fish to giraffes. The pattern makes perfect sense if you're fish-like and your brain, heart and larynx are all close together at one end of your body but not so much if you're a giraffe and the nerve has to detour 15 feet down your neck and then back up again (Mind you big dinosaurs would have had an even longer RLN). A wise designer would, of course, have made different pathways for this nerve to suit the body shape of fish, reptiles and mammals respectively. Evolution can't do that...the nerve has to stay connected in the embryos of all succeeding generations of offspring in order to function. So through the course of evolution from the common ancestors of fish, reptiles and mammals, the neurons of the RLN just got longer or shorter as required to make up the distance necessary for the detour.

Anyway, this is but one example...the reality is, we all carry the evidence of evolution around with us in our cells and in our bodies. We ourselves are "intermediate" and "links" in the process of evolution...and so is every other living organism. We are living fossils - which is much easier to believe about some RFers than others.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

It is literally impossible to instill a graduate level understanding of evolution in a forum post. If you have doubts, start checking out some books from reputable experts on the subject. Follow their arguments and see the evidence that they provide? If you have already done so and this is your takeaway from that research, then so be it. You are not convinced.

And yet, as a group, we will run this thread up to 200 pages repeating all the corrections to this well-worn, erroneous nonsense.

 

[The Hammer]

---> ignore-list

You're boring

 

[ratiocinator]

Link?

To what? You showed beyond any doubt that you know exactly nothing about the subject.

The fact that humans are primates can be seen on the Wiki page:

Human - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Domain: Eukaryota​

Kingdom: Animalia​

Phylum: Chordata​

Class: Mammalia​

Order: Primates​

Suborder: Haplorhini​

Infraorder: Simiiformes​

Family: Hominidae​

Subfamily: Homininae​

Tribe: Hominini​

Genus: Homo​

Species: H. sapiens​

Nobody can educate you in an entire subject on a forum. You need to do your own homework using reputable sources, not dishonest creationist propaganda sites.

 

[Heyo]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

As has been pointed out by many, your knowledge seems to be lacking. And, as I suspect, it's not only evolutionary biology but science in total. Are you homeschooled?
If that is so I have a standing invitation to science illiterates: Why the Theory of Evolution is True. Part 1: What is Science?.
If you want to learn I promise you that you will understand evolutionary biology in about a year of study. (Most of us spent much more time on our education.)

 

[exchemist]

What do you mean when you say "missing link?" It's not a technical, biological term. Every organism is a link between its parent and offspring.
There are hundreds of thousands of non-private fossils in museums, universities, anthro. labs, &al, available for research. More are found every day.

"The originals?" What are the originals? I don't follow.
Lucy exists. It's not a "missing link." She's in the Paleoanthropology Laboratory of the National Museum of Ethiopia. She's been extensively studied, and if an anthropologist today wants to examine her, she need only go to Addis-Ababa and apply at the museum.
There are many other fossils of her species, as well. She's hardly unique.


Every stage could be called intermediate. A "species" isn't a completed design, just a form, picked from a long series of gradually changing forms+, that biologists have arbitrarily chosen to name.

Humans are primates. We conform to the biological definition of primate. More specifically, we're great apes, conforming to that definition, as well. The genetic, anatomical, and fossil history is clear.

There are no "stages," as you're using the term. Evolution has no goal, or completed designs. Every individual in the sequence is a fully developed, functioning organism; a completed design, if you will. Every individual is a 'stage' in a continuing sequence of evolutionary changes.

LOL! -- I've heard this objection from hundreds of different creationist sources. It's ridiculous, and shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how evolution works, and what it is.
Every stage in the adaptive sequence is fully functional. Every individual is complete, fully functional organism. There are no partially completed organisms.

Analogy: Latin "evolved" into French; different, mutually incomprehensible languages, yet no parent ever gave birth to a child who spoke a different language, nor was there ever a "partial language." There was just a long sequence of tiny changes, and a complete, functioning language at every point in the sequence.

And again, human vs primate makes no sense. It's like dog vs canine.

You don't understand the first thing about it! How are you seeing holes?
Where are you seeing cover-ups? Who would cover anything up; who would a cover-up benefit?

Argument from incredulity - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I like your language analogy. Anyone with any brains ought to be able to grasp that.

 

[Subduction Zone]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

There are no "stages" as you propose them. Your posts are almost always pure nonsense since you have no education in the sciences and refuse to learn from your errors.

What you are proposing is orthogenetics, or orthogenesis. That is the long refuted idea of their being goals in evolution. There are none in that sense. You are a result not a goal:

Orthogenesis - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

This supposed "dispute" only exists in the minds of scientific illiterate creationists.

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Every species that ever lived is a "full species". There's no such things as intermediates which are "half a species".
You might want to read up on how evolution works before trying to argue against it.
And be sure to read up from proper sources instead of the type of quacks you sported in that other thread.

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete.

There's no such thing. Every species is a "full" species.
There are no crockoducks. There are no "half wings". There are no "half anything".

That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart

A human IS a primate.
Your questions are all 110% based in ignorance and strawmen.

At this moment, you are in the category of "not even wrong".

or half a human digestive system and half primate.

No such thing.

I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

It doesn't need to survive because it doesn't exist because it doesn't work that way.

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

The only holes here, are in your knowledge of the basics of biology.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Well it depends on how you define evolution.

How about we define it like evolutionary biology does instead of dishonest creationist quacks?

I am taking about transitioning from one class to another, like reptiles to mammals or insects to reptiles.

This is where the real dispute is. If you want to say each animal / human has it's own genetic footprint and that's evolution then ok but the idea that a fish transitions into a reptile there is still no evidence apart from sketchy comparison between fossils. These fossils are the only apparent evidence of this yet many scientists dispute that these intermediate fossils show any evidence of containing more than one class of animal

You might want to look up Tiktaalik.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Link?

Google "phylogenetic tree"

 

[sayak83]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

Dear wordy. Firstly, welcome to the forum. The topic of evolution has been extensively discussed before and hence there is a impatience that you see from members here. The problem, pointed out by others here, is that you have been misled about the theory itself. If one understand what the theory is saying, then these questions themselves do not come up.
All fossils we are talking about here are available in public. But, like most archaeological artefacts they need to be handled with extreme care. Hence only trained scientists with PhD degree in the field get the permission to directly handle them as they have the requisite skills. Often citizen scientist groups, school and college student organizatios will also get permission if they are led by proper experts. There are also special tours organized when original fossils are exhibited for all to see
Museum unveils exhibition details for origins: Fossils from the cradle of humankind
All paleontologists are experts in anatomy. They have worked on the field for 10-20-30 years. Assuming that they have missed something as obvious as bones from different creatures is being specious. Its like saying that a team of NASA astronomers do not know how to adjust telescopes!

As noted by others, all animals are intermediate between past and future generations and are still fully formed and functional living things in their own right. They are all simultaneously intermediate to future forms and still 100% complete as they are. Think of the number line:-- 1,2,3,,,,,,100,....1000..... In this line, each number is a number in its own right and is intermediate between past and future numbers. However there is often development of an organ to fit the needs of a future generation that can be traced. For example, origianally most animals were simple enough that blood can flow through passive circulation. Then in some groups, the blood circulation system developed valves here and there to help the flow of blood. Over time in some future generations, the blood flow requirements had to increase and this need kept pace with more sophisticated centralized valves...and we had the evolution of the heart.....1 chambered heart, 2 chambered heart, 3 chambered hearts and 4 chambered hearts.
Is our heart a well-designed pump? The heart along animal evolution
All variants exist today, but the simplest emerged first and in a few lineages more sophisticated versions evolved as the needs grew.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Well it depends on how you define evolution. I am taking about transitioning from one class to another, like reptiles to mammals or insects to reptiles.

This is where the real dispute is. If you want to say each animal / human has it's own genetic footprint and that's evolution then ok but the idea that a fish transitions into a reptile there is still no evidence apart from sketchy comparison between fossils. These fossils are the only apparent evidence of this yet many scientists dispute that these intermediate fossils show any evidence of containing more than one class of animal

They don't transition in the way you put it.

They change traits suitable to any givin environment.

That's why the Crocaduck, ergo Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron idiocy , shows the incredible ignorance and substantial lack of education present with creationists when it comes to evolution and taxonomy.

Each creature has its own clade and will always be in that clade. There is absolutely no transition from one clade to another.

Cladistics - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[SalixIncendium]

You're boring

I am, too, then.

After reading the OP, I was actually going to post something to help, but it became clear to me after reading post #4 that this was just going to be another of those evolution denier threads that we already have an abundance of, and I decided I didn't want to play.

 

[shunyadragon]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

No, there is not a lot of dispute on human primate evolution. The above is foolish speculation without any knowledge of the science involved.

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Your thinking too hard without an adequate knowledge of the sciences of evolution. The simple answer is no. It is not how evolution works..

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

Again foolish speculation as to how evolution takes, Basically all of the above is false and meaningless.

Hint evolution takes place in response to changes in the environment,

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

Speculation her foes to paranoia. One to many noids.

 

[shunyadragon]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

No, there is not a lot of dispute on human primate evolution. The above is foolish speculation without any knowledge of the science involved.

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Your thinking too hard without an adequate knowledge of the sciences of evolution. The simple answer is no. It is not how evolution works..

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

Again foolish speculation as to how evolution takes place in genetically diverse populations, Basically all of the above is false and meaningless.

Hint evolution takes place in response to changes in the environment,

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

Speculation here goes to paranoia. One too many noids.

Nobody can take you seriously until you acquire some reasonable knowledge in science and ask question relevant to the actual knowledge of science.

 

[shunyadragon]

Well it depends on how you define evolution. I am taking about transitioning from one class to another, like reptiles to mammals or insects to reptiles.

This is where the real dispute is. If you want to say each animal / human has it's own genetic footprint and that's evolution then ok but the idea that a fish transitions into a reptile there is still no evidence apart from sketchy comparison between fossils. These fossils are the only apparent evidence of this yet many scientists dispute that these intermediate fossils show any evidence of containing more than one class of animal

No the nonsense above is not remotely related to disputes in science. You cannot define evolution without any knowledge in the sciences of evolution.

There is a very detailed scientific understanding of the relationship between the evolution of reptiles and mammals, and birds evolving from reptiles. Simple internet searches will reveal an abundance of academic source down to the high school reading level.

Do you homework.

 

[Audie]

A few things regarding evolution.

As far as I can see there's still a lot of dispute as to whether any of these missing links contain any human bones but the fossils are owned privately making it impossible to analyze the originals. I wonder if they had the originals a different conclusion might be told there is even talk that some of these missing links contain a mismatch of bones from different species. Lucy the missing link is no longer regarded as having any human?

One thing I was thinking about is, when does an intermediate stage begin after the full new species is finished, is it right away or some time in the future?

Lets say a new species like primate to human is in an intermediate stage, say it's 50% complete. That means it could have half a human heart and half primate heart or half a human digestive system and half primate. I cant see how this species would survive as it would be too unbalanced to process food and all the other internal processes it would need to complete to survive.

There are so many holes and what appear cover ups in evolution that I really can't take it seriously.

You have no points.