A recent decision I made about my spirituality

[Rainbow Mage]

After much consideration, I've decided not to call myself a Buddhist anymore. Not because I disrespect Lord Buddha, never. I love Lord Buddha. But because the dharma is so much more then just the Buddha's teachings, and the more I learn about other dharmic religions, I wonder if I should limit myself to just Buddhism, or the title of Buddhist. Lord Buddha's teachings will always remain with me and continue to guide me in my life.

 

[enchanted_one1975]

I learned long ago that one doesn't need to rush into a label. A label is for you to identify yourself to others. Their opinion doesn't really matter anyway. What matters is where your heart lies along your path. When the time is right the appropriate label will find you.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Well I didn't rush into the label of Buddhist. I have been a Buddhist for nearly 3 years, and it's become a part of me. I just have been thinking about some things lately, and expounding my idea of dharma. Being here on RF and speaking with people of other dharmic paths has helped me do that.

 

[GURSIKH]

hi Yosef ,


in one previous post of yours , you mentioned about studying SRI Guru Granth sahib ,

your views abt SGGS ?

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Yes I've been reading it. It seems very well. My question is this though, what does the Sikh believe about God exactly? Do they believe God is one as Muslims, or do they believe God is both one and many?

 

[GURSIKH]

Yes I've been reading it. It seems very well. My question is this though, what does the Sikh believe about God exactly? Do they believe God is one as Muslims, or do they believe God is both one and many?

following By Guru Nanak may help you !

ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਨੈਨ ਨਨ ਨੈਨ ਹਹਿ ਤੋਹਿ ਕਉ ਸਹਸ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਨਨਾ ਏਕ ਤਹੀ ॥
You have thousands of eyes, and yet You have no eyes. You have thousands of forms, and yet You do not have even one.

ਸਹਸ ਪਦ ਬਿਮਲ ਨਨ ਏਕ ਪਦ ਗੰਧ ਬਿਨੁ ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਗੰਧ ਇਵ ਚਲਤ ਮੋਹੀ ॥੨॥
You have thousands of Lotus Feet, and yet You do not have even one foot. You have no nose, but you have thousands of noses. This Play of Yours entrances me. ||2||

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸੋਇ ॥
Amongst all is the Light-You are that Light.

ਤਿਸ ਦੈ ਚਾਨਣਿ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਚਾਨਣੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
By this Illumination, that Light is radiant within all.

ਗੁਰ ਸਾਖੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
Through the Guru's Teachings, the Light shines forth.

ਜੋ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸੁ ਆਰਤੀ ਹੋਇ ॥੩॥
That which is pleasing to Him is the lamp-lit worship service. ||3||

ਹਰਿ ਚਰਣ ਕਵਲ ਮਕਰੰਦ ਲੋਭਿਤ ਮਨੋ ਅਨਦਿਨ ਮੋਹਿ ਆਹੀ ਪਿਆਸਾ ॥
My mind is enticed by the honey-sweet Lotus Feet of the Lord. Day and night, I thirst for them.

ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਜਲੁ ਦੇਹਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਾਰਿੰਗ ਕਉ ਹੋਇ ਜਾ ਤੇ ਤੇਰੈ ਨਾਇ ਵਾਸਾ ॥੪॥੩॥
Bestow the Water of Your Mercy upon Nanak, the thirsty song-bird, so that he may come to dwell in Your Name. ||4||3||

 

[Rainbow Mage]

So basically the idea is somewhat akin to Monism and the Hindu view of the devas? That Brahman is in the devas, and the devas are in Brahman?

 

[GURSIKH]

So basically the idea is somewhat akin to Monism and the Hindu view of the devas?

Deva worship is prohibited in Sikhi , only ONE BRAHM

That Brahman is in the devas, and the devas are in Brahman?

THE BRAHM is not confined to Devas , as quoted above already

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸੋਇ ॥
Amongst all is the Light-You are that Light.

ਤਿਸ ਦੈ ਚਾਨਣਿ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਚਾਨਣੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
By this Illumination, that Light is radiant within all.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

So basically Sikhism is Monotheistic? Then is there any view about the devas in Sikhism?

 

[GURSIKH]

So basically Sikhism is Monotheistic? Then is there any view about the devas in Sikhism?

Ya Sikhi is Monotheistic , MUL MANTRA very first line of SGGS ,
Ek OnkarThere is But One God
SatnaamThe Name Is Truth
KartapurkhThe Creater
NirbhauNo Fear
NirwairNo Hatre
AkalmoorathEternal Form
AajuniBeyond Birth & Death
SebhaghSelf Existent
GurparsadBy Gurus grace
! Jap !Chant And Meditate
Aad suchTruth in the Primal Beginning (Even before the birth of the universes, time etc. )
Jugad suchTruth Throughout the Ages (Existed through the ages)
Haibee suchTruth Here And Now
Nanak hosi bee suchO Nanak, the Truth shall exist for infinit


hope you will enjoy listening Mul Mantra
[youtube]f3zUYK4YU8M[/youtube]
YouTube - ♥ ♥ ♥ MUL MANTRA-Snatam Kaur-SOMOS UNO...WE ARE ONE ♥ ♥ ♥


Deeds of Deva such as Krisnhna ,Rama ,Shiva .... respected but not equated to LORD .

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Well thanks for a little lesson in Sikhism. I appreciate it. One more question. Are the devas viewed as lesser spirits then, or as people that were later deified?

 

[GURSIKH]

Well thanks for a little lesson in Sikhism. I appreciate it. One more question. Are the devas viewed as lesser spirits then, or as people that were later deified?

Sikhi view of Devas



ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਨ ਭੇਦ ਲਹਯੋ ਤਿਹਿ ਸਿੱਧ ਸਮਾਧਿ ਸਭੈ ਕਰਿ ਹਾਰੇ ॥ ਸਿੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਬੇਦ ਸਭੈ ਬਹੁ ਭਾਂਤਿ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਬਿਚਾਰ ਬੀਚਾਰੇ ॥
बेद कतेब न भेद लहयो तिहि सि्ध समाधि सभै करि हारे ॥ सिम्रित शासत्र बेद सभै बहु भांति पुरान बिचार बीचारे ॥
The Vedas and Ketebs could not comprehend His Mystery and the adepts have been defeated in practising contemplation; various thought have been mentioned about God in Vedas, Shastras, Puranas and smrities;


ਆਦਿ ਅਨਾਦਿ ਅਗਾਧਿ ਸਦਾ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਸਿੱਧ ਸ੍ਵਰੂਪ ਸਭੋ ਪਹਿਚਾਨਯੋ ॥ ਗੰਧ੍ਰਬ ਜੱਛ ਮਹੀਧਰ ਨਾਗਨ ਭੂੰਮ ਅਕਾਸ਼ ਚਹੂੰ ਚਕ ਜਾਨਯੋ ॥
आदि अनादि अगाधि सदा प्रभ सि्ध स्वरूप सभो पहिचानयो ॥ गंध्रब ज्छ महीधर नागन भूम अकाश चहूं चक जानयो ॥
All know that Lord as beginningless, unfathomable and adept-incarnate; the Gandharvas, Yakshas, men, Nagas consider him on the earth, sky and all the four directions;


ਕਹੂੰ ਲੈ ਠੋਕ ਬਧੇ ਉਰ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਕਾਹੂੰ ਮਹੇਸ਼ ਕੌ ਏਸ ਬਖਾਨਯੋ ॥ ਕਾਹੂੰ ਕਹਯੋ ਹਰਿ ਮੰਦਰ ਮੈ ਹਰਿ ਕਾਹੂੰ ਮਸੀਤ ਕੈ ਬੀਚ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਨਯੋ ॥
कहूं लै ठोक बधे उर ठाकुर काहूं महेश कौ एस बखानयो ॥ काहूं कहयो हरि मंदर मै हरि काहूं मसीत कै बीच प्रमानयो ॥
Someone has tied the stone-idol around his neck and someone has accepted Shiva as the Lord; someone considers the Lord within the temple or the mosque;

ਕਾਹੂੰ ਨੇ ਰਾਮ ਕਹਯੋ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨਾ ਕਹੁ ਕਾਹੂੰ ਮਨੈ ਅਵਤਾਰਨ ਮਾਨਯੋ ॥ ਫੋਕਟ ਧਰਮ ਬਿਸਾਰ ਸਭੈ ਕਰਤਾਰ ਹੀ ਕਉ ਕਰਤਾ ਜੀਅ ਜਾਨਯੋ ॥੧੨॥
काहूं ने राम कहयो क्रिशना कहु काहूं मनै अवतारन मानयो ॥ फोकट धरम बिसार सभै करतार ही कउ करता जीअ जानयो ॥१२॥
Someone calls him Ram or Krishna and someone believes in His incarnations, but my mind has forsaken all useless actions and has accepted only the One Creator.12.

ਜੌ ਕਹੌ ਰਾਮ ਅਜੋਨਿ ਅਜੈ ਅਤਿ ਕਾਹੇ ਕੌ ਕੌਸ਼ਲ ਕੁੱਖ ਜਯੋ ਜੂ ॥ ਕਾਲ ਹੂੰ ਕਾਲ ਕਹੈ ਜਿਹਿ ਕੌ ਕਿਹਿ ਕਾਰਣ ਕਾਲ ਤੇ ਦੀਨ ਭਯੋ ਜੂ ॥
जौ कहौ राम अजोनि अजै अति काहे कौ कौशल कु्ख जयो जू ॥ काल हूं काल कहै जिहि कौ किहि कारण काल ते दीन भयो जू ॥
If we consider Ram, the Lord as Unborn, then how did he take brith from the womb of Kaushalya ? He, who is said to be the KAL (destroyer) of KAL (death), then why did none become subjugated himself before KAL?

ਕਯੋਂ ਕਹੁ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨਿਧ ਹੈ ਕਿਹ ਕਾਜ ਤੇ ਬੱਧਕ ਬਾਣ ਲਗਾਯੋ ॥ ਅਉਰ ਕੁਲੀਨ ਉਧਾਰਤ ਜੋ ਕਿਹ ਤੇ ਅਪਨੋ ਕੁਲ ਨਾਸੁ ਕਰਾਯੋ ॥
कयों कहु क्रिशन क्रिपानिध है किह काज ते ब्धक बाण लगायो ॥ अउर कुलीन उधारत जो किह ते अपनो कुल नासु करायो ॥
Krishna himself is considered the treasure of Grace, then why did the hunter shot his arrow at him ? He has been described as redeeming the clans of others then he caused the destruction of his own clan;

ਆਦਿ ਅਜੋਨਿ ਕਹਾਇ ਕਹੋ ਕਿਮ ਦੇਵਕਿ ਕੇ ਜਠਰੰਤਰ ਆਯੋ ॥ ਤਾਤ ਨ ਮਾਤ ਕਹੈ ਜਿਹ ਕੋ ਤਿਹ ਕਯੋਂ ਬਸੁਦੇਵਹਿ ਬਾਪੁ ਕਹਾਯੋ ॥੧੪॥
आदि अजोनि कहाइ कहो किम देवकि के जठरंतर आयो ॥ तात न मात कहै जिह को तिह कयों बसुदेवहि बापु कहायो ॥१४॥
He is said to be unborn and beginningless, then how did he come into the womb of Devaki ? He , who is considered without any father or mother, then why did he cause Vasudev to be called his father?14.

ਕਾਹੇ ਕੋ ਏਸ਼ ਮਹੇਸ਼ਹਿ ਭਾਖਤ ਕਾਹਿ ਦਿਜੇਸ਼ ਕੋ ਏਸ ਬਖਾਨਯੋ ॥ ਹੈ ਨ ਰਘ੍ਵੇਸ਼ ਜਦ੍ਵੇਸ਼ ਰਮਾਪਤਿ ਤੈ ਜਿਨ ਕੌ ਬਿਸ੍ਵਨਾਥ ਪਛਾਨਯੋ ॥
काहे को एश महेशहि भाखत काहि दिजेश को एस बखानयो ॥ है न रघ्वेश जद्वेश रमापति तै जिन कौ बिस्वनाथ पछानयो ॥
Why do you consider Shiva or Brahma as the Lord ? There is none amongst Ram, Krishna and Vishnu, who may be considered as the Lord of the Universe by you;

ਏਕ ਕੋ ਛਾਡਿ ਅਨੇਕ ਭਜੈ ਸੁਕਦੇਵ ਪਰਾਸਰ ਬਯਾਸ ਝੁਠਾਨਯੋ ॥ ਫੋਕਟ ਧਰਮ ਸਜੇ ਸਭ ਹੀ ਹਮ ਏਕ ਹੀ ਕੌ ਬਿਧ ਨੈਕ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਨਯੋ ॥੧੫॥
एक को छाडि अनेक भजै सुकदेव परासर बयास झुठानयो ॥ फोकट धरम सजे सभ ही हम एक ही कौ बिध नैक प्रमानयो ॥१५॥
Relinquishing the One Lord, you remember many gods and goddesses; in this way you prove Shukdev, Prashar etc. as liars; all the so-called religions are hollow; I only accept the One Lord as the Providence.15.

ਕੋਊ ਦਿਜੇਸ਼ ਕੋ ਮਾਨਤ ਹੈ ਅਰੁ ਕੋਊ ਮਹੇਸ਼ ਕੋ ਏਸ਼ ਬਤੈ ਹੈ ॥ ਕੋਊ ਕਹੈ ਬਿਸ਼ਨੋ ਬਿਸ਼ਨਾਇਕ ਜਾਹਿ ਭਜੇ ਅਘ ਓਘ ਕਟੈ ਹੈ ॥
कोऊ दिजेश को मानत है अरु कोऊ महेश को एश बतै है ॥ कोऊ कहै बिशनो बिशनाइक जाहि भजे अघ ओघ कटै है ॥
Someone tells Brahma as the Lord-God and someone tells the same thing about Shiva; someone considers Vishnu as the hero of the universe and says that only on remembering him, all the sins will be destroyed;

ਬਾਰ ਹਜ਼ਾਰ ਬਿਚਾਰ ਅਰੇ ਜੜ ਅੰਤ ਸਮੈ ਸਭ ਹੀ ਤਜਿ ਜੈ ਹੈ ॥ ਤਾਹੀ ਕੋ ਧਯਾਨ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਨਿ ਹੀਏ ਜੋਊ ਥੇ ਅਬ ਹੈ ਅਰੁ ਆਗੈ ਊ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਹੈ ॥੧੬॥
बार हज़ार बिचार अरे जड़ अंत समै सभ ही तजि जै है ॥ ताही को धयान प्रमानि हीए जोऊ थे अब है अरु आगै ऊ ह्वै है ॥१६॥
O fool ! think about it a thousand times, all of them will leave you at the time of death, therefore, you should only meditate on Him, who was in past ,who is there in the present and who will also be there in future.16.

 

[Zadok]

following By Guru Nanak may help you !

ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਨੈਨ ਨਨ ਨੈਨ ਹਹਿ ਤੋਹਿ ਕਉ ਸਹਸ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਨਨਾ ਏਕ ਤਹੀ ॥
You have thousands of eyes, and yet You have no eyes. You have thousands of forms, and yet You do not have even one.

ਸਹਸ ਪਦ ਬਿਮਲ ਨਨ ਏਕ ਪਦ ਗੰਧ ਬਿਨੁ ਸਹਸ ਤਵ ਗੰਧ ਇਵ ਚਲਤ ਮੋਹੀ ॥੨॥
You have thousands of Lotus Feet, and yet You do not have even one foot. You have no nose, but you have thousands of noses. This Play of Yours entrances me. ||2||

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸੋਇ ॥
Amongst all is the Light-You are that Light.

ਤਿਸ ਦੈ ਚਾਨਣਿ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਚਾਨਣੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
By this Illumination, that Light is radiant within all.

ਗੁਰ ਸਾਖੀ ਜੋਤਿ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਹੋਇ ॥
Through the Guru's Teachings, the Light shines forth.

ਜੋ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸੁ ਆਰਤੀ ਹੋਇ ॥੩॥
That which is pleasing to Him is the lamp-lit worship service. ||3||

ਹਰਿ ਚਰਣ ਕਵਲ ਮਕਰੰਦ ਲੋਭਿਤ ਮਨੋ ਅਨਦਿਨ ਮੋਹਿ ਆਹੀ ਪਿਆਸਾ ॥
My mind is enticed by the honey-sweet Lotus Feet of the Lord. Day and night, I thirst for them.

ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਜਲੁ ਦੇਹਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਾਰਿੰਗ ਕਉ ਹੋਇ ਜਾ ਤੇ ਤੇਰੈ ਨਾਇ ਵਾਸਾ ॥੪॥੩॥
Bestow the Water of Your Mercy upon Nanak, the thirsty song-bird, so that he may come to dwell in Your Name. ||4||3||

I ask this not as criticism but of logic. Should not truth and the understanding of it be logical and not contradictory?

Zadok

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I think sometimes when people try to describe the divine Zadok, it's so overwhelming that sometimes they accidentally contradict, but don't really see other way in which they can describe it. Indeed, it is hard for a human to describe the divine. I have done it myself on occassion trying to describe divinity.

 

[GURSIKH]

I ask this not as criticism but of logic. Should not truth and the understanding of it be logical and not contradictory?

Zadok

Hi Zadok ,

to you it seems illogical contradictory description of truth ,to me its most beautiful n accurate description of TRUTH .

blessings !!

 

[BruceDLimber]

Greetings!

I would humbly suggest you examine ALL the great religions, decide where the truth lies, and follow that!

Best regards, and I wish you good hunting!

Bruce

 

[Madhuri]

So basically the idea is somewhat akin to Monism and the Hindu view of the devas? That Brahman is in the devas, and the devas are in Brahman?

I am not sure that this is an accurate view of Hindu monism. You will of course need a monist to confirm but generally speaking, devas are considered to be souls equal to you and I but at a different level on their spiritual journey. However, the manifestations or expansions of God such as the various Vishnus, Rama, Krishna, their female consrots/aspects are perhaps what you are refering to. Ie/ The Avatars. Is that what you meant?

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Madhuri the Upanishads seem to describe the devas as being in Brahman, unless I've misunderstood something

 

[nathanielfirst]

do the minor Devas then exist, really, in Sikh? or is it, that they are considered stories or metaphors? Not really real?