Abolition of Alcohol

[stvdv]

I see that Abolition is possible and desirable, I have not said it will be imposed on others that do not think or wish to act in that way.

"Abolition of Alcohol" seems to me abolition of alcohol, meaning it is prohibited, esp. as seen from the context of the OP in which you describe that recreational alcohol(drug) is not good, and you rather see it gone, meaning none can have it anymore

I do agree that when many don't use it, soon it will be the "New Normal"
We have seen that this can be reached within 1 year, if Governments push it a little

 

[Windwalker]

Well I have changed myself, so let's start on the world.

I met a very newly 'born-again' Christian at the lake who shared with me how Jesus has healed him of all his anxieties. Poof. Gone. Of course I understood his zeal to promote his beliefs by claims of miraculous, instantaneous healing. The process of actual healing lacks in such a view. It takes time, I reassured him his journey was not over.

In other words, when we think we've arrived, it's only just the beginning. The world doesn't need fixing. We do. It begins inside and impacts others through demonstration, not through force.

The OP is no found to stop any person's choices. What the OP will do is initiate the conversations that are needed.

The conversations that are needed to moving us as a global society to ban alcohol for everyone? That's still taking away people's choice for themselves. It's imposing a belief upon them that they don't want for themselves.

Should we partake of alcohol when many suffer from its use, are we indirectly responsible by not taking a stance against the supply of a substance that we know destroyers people lives and families?

We have plenty of programs and education to let people know the dangers of alcohol abuse. There are laws that make the abuse of it illegal in many instances, such as driving, drunk and disorderly charges, and so forth. There is public awareness being offered, and more education is always a good idea to keep the public aware of the risks and dangers, warning labels, and such.

I see taking a stand to promote moderation the correct choice. Prohibition laws do not work, and they only make the problems worse. Heal the society that caused drug abuse, not blame the substance itself! That's what needs to be fixed. Fund better education standards, pass laws that raise the living wage, do things to help people not want to abuse the drug in the first place.

You're not looking at the true enemy here. You're blaming the substance, not the root causes behind why we might abuse it.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Alcohol and recreational drugs have been part of human existence and both are open to abuse,America tried to ban it and made a lot of people rich,al Capone as an example so no it will not be abolished by anyone,there’s plenty of advice out there and should always be a matter of choice IMO.

Yes it has to be a choice.

The choice needs to be made in view of all the available evidence. We need goos science on this issue and not science that has a given agenda.

Regards Tony

 

[stvdv]

Though there may be a time in the future where the majority will vote, who knows?

My guess is if it did, it would go undercover again, but many millions would give it away.

Regards Tony

Spirituality is all about Self Control, Awareness etc. So, have all choices available and be strong enough yourself to not take what you deem not good

You mention Islam. In this context a good example that it's not good to impose
I have heard Imams say "women should cover up, otherwise we men can't control themselves"
This is a perfect example that it should not be banned or abolished, make people aware like with smoking

That way people can choose what is best for themselves, when to stop or not to stop

 

[Wildstar]

This to me is an important topic and will eventually be a topic discussed around the world because of the dire consequences this drug of choice inflicts upon the individual, the family, the community, the Nation and on to the entire body of humanity.

I unfortunately live in a Nation that pride themselves on getting drunk, and that mentality is expanding as the world is locked down.

I long for the day when the business of Alcohol is seen for what it has become, a killer of humanity.

So this OP shows my stance, that alcoholic beverages are not needed they are a drug of choice and all recreational drugs need to be Abolished. America tried, so what will it take?

What is your stance, what is your view?

Regards Tony

Simple solution, though requires authoritarianism to implement. Yearly mental health checks. If someone is showing signs of an alcohol addiction, full mandatory rehab, plus regular monitoring, paid for by the state.

Really, nearly all problems can be solved by implementing authoritarian practices of governance.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

"Abolition of Alcohol" seems to me abolition of alcohol, meaning it is prohibited, esp. as seen from the context of the OP in which you describe that recreational alcohol(drug) is not good, and you rather see it gone, meaning none can have it anymore

I do agree that when many don't use it, soon it will be the "New Normal"
We have seen that this can be reached within 1 year, if Governments push it a little

The heading was a draw card
Good marketing strategy ha ha.

The OP is a question posed about the likelihood that can again happen.

Consider some of Isalm, maybe some other faiths, and Bahai do it from a law they choose to follow.

So this OP is all about choice and this OP is to explore why we would choose to abstain, if there was no law, or if we may again consider that a law is needed.

Regards Tony

 

[Suave]

This to me is an important topic and will eventually be a topic discussed around the world because of the dire consequences this drug of choice inflicts upon the individual, the family, the community, the Nation and on to the entire body of humanity.

I unfortunately live in a Nation that pride themselves on getting drunk, and that mentality is expanding as the world is locked down.

I long for the day when the business of Alcohol is seen for what it has become, a killer of humanity.

So this OP shows my stance, that alcoholic beverages are not needed they are a drug of choice and all recreational drugs need to be Abolished. America tried, so what will it take?

What is your stance, what is your view?

Regards Tony

Abolition (edit) *Prohibition* has already been tried, that didn't turn out so well. The war on drugs has also been a complete failure.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Spirituality is all about Self Control, Awareness etc. So, have all choices available and be strong enough yourself to not take what you deem not good

You mention Islam. In this context a good example that it's not good to impose
I have heard Imams say "women should cover up, otherwise we men can't control themselves"
This is a perfect example that it should not be banned or abolished, make people aware like with smoking

That way people can choose what is best for themselves, when to stop or not to stop

That is a good example how we can take a law from.God and impose our own views on it.

So that opens up a lot more issues to consider and many a quandary of faith.

Regards Tony

 

[England my lionheart]

Yes it has to be a choice.

The choice needs to be made in view of all the available evidence. We need goos science on this issue and not science that has a given agenda.

Regards Tony

As I already wrote,it’s an informed choice as is smoking and drugs

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Simple solution, though requires authoritarianism to implement. Yearly mental health checks. If someone is showing signs of an alcohol addiction, full mandatory rehab, plus regular monitoring, paid for by the state.

Really, nearly all problems can be solved by implementing authoritarian practices of governance.

That process to me lacks the humanity and compassion that is required to implement ant lasting change.

I think man tends to get way to bossy and judgemental, we need to first address the issues oursleves so we can help others consider the way they can implement change.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Abolition has already been tried, that didn't turn out so well. The war on drugs has also been a complete failure.

Yes it has, the future will need to come down very hard on the illegal drug trade, but that will not be until mankind as a whole has the motivation to do so, as it is a world wide epidemic.

Regards Tony

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

We've enough history available to us about what happens when you try to force people not to have the things that they want to have. Crime goes up. Murder goes up. Misery goes up. No good at all comes from it. It is eventually abandoned.

Shall we be insane, and do it again, and hope it turns out differently?

How about getting to the point where we can talk (person to person, parent to child, husband to wife -- or husband, or whatever) honestly about how anything can be used appropriately or abused?

Keep your "abolition" notions away from me.

(PS: if I could abolish anything, it would be religion. It's still among the more dangerous things that humans use and abuse.)

 

[stvdv]

That is a good example how we can take a law from.God and impose our own views on it.

Yes, the moment people blame others for their own shortcomings those things (twisting verses) happen
And it happens more with fanatics I have seen. They love to impose on others (I have seen it in raw food fanatics, religious)

The problem is, that when someone is not Spiritual advanced (has no Self Control), those imposed rules are impossible for them to follow. And imposed rules, esp. when linked to Hell when not followed, creates crazy stress in those people, and they will do stupid things. So, some rules are okay, but some are disastrous. Simple rules are good (don't kill, hurt others). But don't touch peoples food or drink, they might kill you

 

[stvdv]

The OP is a question posed about the likelihood that can again happen.

Thinking of "the New Normal" it can be very much possible to happen again

Consider some of Isalm, maybe some other faiths, and Bahai do it from a law they choose to follow.

No problem if they do it for themselves
Sai Baba also advises to abstain from alcohol ... no ban though. And a sip is never problematic (unless you sip 24/7)

So this OP is all about choice and this OP is to explore why we would choose to abstain, if there was no law, or if we may again consider that a law is needed.

Aha, that would have been a good line in the OP, I did not get this from the OP. That feels totally different from how you phrased the OP

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Alcohol is a thing of nature -- it happens all the time through extraordinarily ordinary processes as the sugars in food breaks down under the influence of yeast.

Elephants (and lots of other animals enjoy a good tipple of breadfruit or amarulla fruit that has fermented on the ground -- or in their stomachs.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

We've enough history available to us about what happens when you try to force people not to have the things that they want to have. Crime goes up. Murder goes up. Misery goes up. No good at all comes from it. It is eventually abandoned.

Shall we be insane, and do it again, and hope it turns out differently?

How about getting to the point where we can talk (person to person, parent to child, husband to wife -- or husband, or whatever) honestly about how anything can be used appropriately or abused?

Keep your "abolition" notions away from me.

(PS: if I could abolish anything, it would be religion. It's still among the more dangerous things that humans use and abuse.)

You havw some great views on consultation, I see that is indeed a path forward.

In fact the OP states my own personal strong view on alcohol, but is asking how others see the topic, the topic is not apposing that view on to others, but it does ask for people to consider a bigger view with the choices they want to maintain.

Much like having consultation with the entire human family.

Regards Tony

 

[stvdv]

So why would an intelligent person want to dull the capacity of their mind?

Maybe people who have too much pain, and see no other way to get out of it, at this moment

When people had a toothache a century ago, they drank alcohol against the pain; I don't blame them

I rather don't dull my mind, hence I don't take alcohol for that purpose (unless it's medicinal added)

And people who drink too much, for sure are not aware of the havoc they create thereby

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Thinking of "the New Normal" it can be very much possible to happen again


No problem if they do it for themselves
Sai Baba also advises to abstain from alcohol ... no ban though. And a sip is never problematic (unless you sip 24/7)

Aha, that would have been a good line in the OP, I did not get this from the OP. That feels totally different from how you phrased the OP

I will add it as per your observations.

Regards Tony

 

[Vinayaka]

That is a very good point, they have done it with cigarettes.

The statistics with alcohol would be so much worse, but big money is behind this industry, there is no compassion, just profit.

Regards Tony

I've never understood how alcohol industry ducked that. Seems to me booze is at least as harmful as cigarettes. Lobbying?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Alcohol is a thing of nature -- it happens all the time through extraordinarily ordinary processes as the sugars in food breaks down under the influence of yeast.

Elephants (and lots of other animals enjoy a good tipple of breadfruit or amarulla fruit that has fermented on the ground -- or in their stomachs.

Yes there are many many ways to justify alcohol and maybe just as many ways to show how bad it is.

In the end it comes down to why we would choose to to partake of it, or choose not to based on all the evidence that is available.

We need good scientific research that has no agenda but to explore those aspects.

Some may be available now, but the world is so skeptical, that even good science is now rejected by many people.

Regards Tony