Agnostic Atheists

[endlessvoid2018]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist? Obviously, the term Agnostic isn't really mutually exclusive.
I certainly have seen a lot more people who claim to be an Agnostic Atheist, as opposed to an Agnostic Theist.
I have had a whole slew of different thoughts since my deconstruction from Christianity around three months ago.
My first landing on Agnostic, then Deism, then Agnostic Theist, next was a bit of Pantheism/Pandeism, now
I'm basically back to being Agnostic again. However, I sort of feel ever since then, that I am really starting to believe
that there possibly isn't any god or gods. But obviously, I cannot know that for sure as I cannot prove anything.
I don't believe in the God of Abrahamic faiths at all. But I am having a hard time getting past the concept of there not
being any kind of god or higher power at all, whether in the non religious sense or other.
Possibly due to my indoctrination at a young age? I was baptized in the Catholic church as an infant,
and went to church at a young age. So basically it was engraved into me the belief that God exists.
I have found the most peace recently though however falling on Agnostic beliefs, and basically living my life
non-religious. Essentially neutral. I still have some kind of lingering notions however that something may exist
beyond this life, even if it's not a god or a deity. Perhaps I am spiritual and not religious?
Several people have told me my beliefs sound like I am in fact an Agnostic Atheist. Others have said that the
best stance I can take is being what I have been, an agnostic that doesn't practice religion.
Another person I spoke to said I can hold Atheist beliefs without identifying as an Atheist.
And for anyone who has gone from being a Christian to Atheist or Agnostic Atheist, how
long did it take for you to accept the fact that there may not be a god or that you no longer believed there was?

Any thoughts?

 

[Twilight Hue]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist? Obviously, the term Agnostic isn't really mutually exclusive.
I certainly have seen a lot more people who claim to be an Agnostic Atheist, as opposed to an Agnostic Theist.
I have had a whole slew of different thoughts since my deconstruction from Christianity around three months ago.
My first landing on Agnostic, then Deism, then Agnostic Theist, next was a bit of Pantheism/Pandeism, now
I'm basically back to being Agnostic again. However, I sort of feel ever since then, that I am really starting to believe
that there possibly isn't any god or gods. But obviously, I cannot know that for sure as I cannot prove anything.
I don't believe in the God of Abrahamic faiths at all. But I am having a hard time getting past the concept of there not
being any kind of god or higher power at all, whether in the non religious sense or other.
Possibly due to my indoctrination at a young age? I was baptized in the Catholic church as an infant,
and went to church at a young age. So basically it was engraved into me the belief that God exists.
I have found the most peace recently though however falling on Agnostic beliefs, and basically living my life
non-religious. Essentially neutral. I still have some kind of lingering notions however that something may exist
beyond this life, even if it's not a god or a deity. Perhaps I am spiritual and not religious?
Several people have told me my beliefs sound like I am in fact an Agnostic Atheist. Others have said that the
best stance I can take is being what I have been, an agnostic that doesn't practice religion.
Another person I spoke to said I can hold Atheist beliefs without identifying as an Atheist.
And for anyone who has gone from being a Christian to Atheist or Agnostic Atheist, how
long did it take for you to accept the fact that there may not be a god or that you no longer believed there was?

Any thoughts?

If your an Agnostic. , your definitely not an Atheist.

 

[Heyo]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist? Obviously, the term Agnostic isn't really mutually exclusive.

That depends on the definition you are using. "Agnostic" and "atheist" have both a philosophical and a colloquial meaning.
The philosophy of an Atheist is that there are no gods. An atheist simply doesn't believe the claim that there are gods.
The colloquial meaning of agnostic is someone who doesn't know whereas an Agnostic holds the position that about the existence or nature of gods nothing is known (or can't be known) and judgement should be withheld in such cases.
Agnosticism and Atheism are mutually exclusive while agnosticism and atheism are not.
(Note that I've used the capitalised spelling for the philosophies and lower case for the colloquial meaning.)

And for anyone who has gone from being a Christian to Atheist or Agnostic Atheist, how
long did it take for you to accept the fact that there may not be a god or that you no longer believed there was?

Can't help you there as I never believed in any gods (though I was a "cultural" Christian). But it took some time to find the optimal label for my belief. I called myself an agnostic atheist but now I've upgraded to Agnostic and atheist.

 

[Dao Hao Now]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist? Obviously, the term Agnostic isn't really mutually exclusive.
I certainly have seen a lot more people who claim to be an Agnostic Atheist, as opposed to an Agnostic Theist.
I have had a whole slew of different thoughts since my deconstruction from Christianity around three months ago.
My first landing on Agnostic, then Deism, then Agnostic Theist, next was a bit of Pantheism/Pandeism, now
I'm basically back to being Agnostic again. However, I sort of feel ever since then, that I am really starting to believe
that there possibly isn't any god or gods. But obviously, I cannot know that for sure as I cannot prove anything.
I don't believe in the God of Abrahamic faiths at all. But I am having a hard time getting past the concept of there not
being any kind of god or higher power at all, whether in the non religious sense or other.
Possibly due to my indoctrination at a young age? I was baptized in the Catholic church as an infant,
and went to church at a young age. So basically it was engraved into me the belief that God exists.
I have found the most peace recently though however falling on Agnostic beliefs, and basically living my life
non-religious. Essentially neutral. I still have some kind of lingering notions however that something may exist
beyond this life, even if it's not a god or a deity. Perhaps I am spiritual and not religious?
Several people have told me my beliefs sound like I am in fact an Agnostic Atheist. Others have said that the
best stance I can take is being what I have been, an agnostic that doesn't practice religion.
Another person I spoke to said I can hold Atheist beliefs without identifying as an Atheist.
And for anyone who has gone from being a Christian to Atheist or Agnostic Atheist, how
long did it take for you to accept the fact that there may not be a god or that you no longer believed there was?

Any thoughts?

Similar to you, I was born to a nominally Catholic family.
My grandmother was devout, and would come over every Friday to fry fish.
I was baptized and did the holy communion et. al.
I remember vaguely not really being convinced, and by about 8 years old consciously figuring out that there was probably not a god.
I remember the conversation my older sister and I had while visiting family for Christmas.
We were confirming that Santa Claus wasn’t real and the dominoes kept on falling all the way up to god.
I remember telling some friends at school and the backlash and vitriol I received from many of them; being told I was going to hell etc.
I remember some of those “friends” treating me differently afterwards and some no longer playing with me. (I suspect in retrospect, that this may have been under instruction from their parents?)
I learned to be careful of who I would talk to about it and how I would respond if asked by people I didn’t know well. (There is a surprising amount of them that would do this in some parts of the country)(USA)
I would tell them I went to the Catholic church, which was true, being taken by my parents.
I would leave out any information about what I actually thought because I had noticed how people would react from before.
I hadn’t heard of the word “atheist” at the time.
As I grew into my teens, and was no longer dragged to church by my parents, (my grandmother having died by then)
I would say something like… “oh, I’m not very religious” or “I really don’t go to church”.
Unfortunately, this often seemed like an open invitation to them to sell me on their particular flavor of religion.
I was probably in my twenties when I first heard the word “atheist”.
I still can be selective about how I describe my self to people in face to face real world situations, due to very real discrimination/bigotry/prejudice…. call it what you will.
The word “atheist” (as you may well have noticed on some threads on this forum) carries a certain amount of baggage; often from misunderstanding (often willfully) what the term actually means.
What best describes my position on religion is agnostic atheist; agnostic because I am honest enough to acknowledge that I have no way of knowing for certain, and atheist because as result of not seeing any reason to find it reasonable to determine that there are any gods and multiple reasons to find it reasonable to determine that gods don’t exist….I simply don’t believe they do, a la Santa, the tooth fairy, Easter bunny, and all the other dominoes.
I learned about skeptical and critical thinking, I simply can’t believe otherwise.

In short atheism doesn’t require certainty.
It’s simply a matter of not holding a belief that gods exist.
If you’re convinced (believe) god/s exist….you’re a theist;
at that point you would determine which of the plethora of gods on offer you are convinced of, and from there which of the particular style of worshipping you are most comfortable with determines which religion/denomination/etc. you would identify as.
If you’re not convinced (don’t believe) god/s exist….you’re an atheist; simple as that.

agnostic/gnostic concerns the certainty (purported knowledge) portion of it.
I fail to see how anyone can honestly claim “knowledge” of whether or not god/s exist; yet some do. If so they would be labeled “gnostic”.
If you are more honest (in my opinion) and concede that you can’t “know” for certain that god/s exist you would go with “agnostic”; this would pertain to both theist and atheist positions.

Do be aware that in the general population
“agnostic” doesn’t seem to draw the same negative reaction as does “atheist”.
You can honestly say you’re agnostic about it and leave it at that, if it’s a situation where you may receive unwanted backlash.

Sorry for the long post.
I hope it is of some help.

 

[Twilight Hue]

That depends on the definition you are using. "Agnostic" and "atheist" have both a philosophical and a colloquial meaning.
The philosophy of an Atheist is that there are no gods. An atheist simply doesn't believe the claim that there are gods.
The colloquial meaning of agnostic is someone who doesn't know whereas an Agnostic holds the position that about the existence or nature of gods nothing is known (or can't be known) and judgement should be withheld in such cases.
Agnosticism and Atheism are mutually exclusive while agnosticism and atheism are not.
(Note that I've used the capitalised spelling for the philosophies and lower case for the colloquial meaning.)

Can't help you there as I never believed in any gods (though I was a "cultural" Christian). But it took some time to find the optimal label for my belief. I called myself an agnostic atheist but now I've upgraded to Agnostic and atheist.

I could never understand agnosticism as it suggests a possibility for a God to exist.


However what possibility could they even be talking about, much less point it out for that matter?

If somebody suggested there's a possibility for a God, such a person is definitely not an atheist.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If your an Agnostic. , your definitely not an Atheist.

Incorrect. Why on Earth do you think that.

An "ism" is about belief. Two people are asked: Do you believe in any gods? Answer "No" from both.

"gnostic" is about knowledge. The same two are asked if they know that there is not a God. Ones says no the the second says yes. They are both atheists. Neither one believes in a god. But the first one is open to the possibility of a god. The second says that gods do not exist. Those are soft atheists (agnostic atheists) and hard atheists (gnostic atheists). You should not try to put everyone in the same box.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I could never understand agnosticism as it suggests a possibility for a God to exist.


However what possibility could they even be talking about, much less point it out for that matter?

If somebody suggested there's a possibility for a God, such a person is definitely not an atheist.

It is a belief of countless people. Yes it is unevidenced, but then there is no evidence against a god either. Keeping an open mind is not unreasonable. I will say that the hard atheists are probably right, but we have no way to know for sure. If someone showed me reliable evidence for a god I could be convinced to change my mind. But since it is a very strong claim it would take vey strong evidence. Not just a vision. And I cannot say what it would be. But as Matt Dillahunty says at times "If there is a God, he would know what sort of evidence would be required to change my mind".

 

[Kfox]

If somebody suggested there's a possibility for a God, such a person is definitely not an atheist.

I disagree. As an atheist, I know what some people call God do exist; but I don’t call it God, I call it something else. I think too many people limit the concept of God to the Christian, Muslim, or Jewish God, the reality is there are many concepts of God that DO exist. Does Nature exist? Does the Sun exist? Because there are people who call these things God. Christians call Jesus God, Rastafarians call Hallie Selassie God, there are Hindus who call Kumari of Nepal God. I don’t call them God, I call them people like anyone else. I am even open to the possibility that what Muslims call Allah, or Christians call Yahwah were evolved beings from another planet who came to earth when mankind was primitive, and were believed to be Gods, and the story changed as time went on to include what many call God today.

My point is, because there is no consistent definition of what constitutes God, I will recognize what someone chooses to call God may be real, but I just don’t call it God thus I am atheist to all God claims.

 

[Heyo]

I disagree. As an atheist, I know what some people call God do exist; but I don’t call it God, I call it something else. I think too many people limit the concept of God to the Christian, Muslim, or Jewish God, the reality is there are many concepts of God that DO exist. Does Nature exist? Does the Sun exist? Because there are people who call these things God. Christians call Jesus God, Rastafarians call Hallie Selassie God, there are Hindus who call Kumari of Nepal God. I don’t call them God, I call them people like anyone else. I am even open to the possibility that what Muslims call Allah, or Christians call Yahwah were evolved beings from another planet who came to earth when mankind was primitive, and were believed to be Gods, and the story changed as time went on to include what many call God today.

My point is, because there is no consistent definition of what constitutes God, I will recognize what someone chooses to call God may be real, but I just don’t call it God thus I am atheist to all God claims.

That sounds pretty much like you could be (or become) an Agnostic.

Come to the dark side, we have cookies.

 

[Heyo]

It's already been described verbally but to those who haven't seen it, here's an instructional chart:

 

[Heyo]

If someone showed me reliable evidence for a god I could be convinced to change my mind. But since it is a very strong claim it would take vey strong evidence.

Didn't I do that already?

As a reminder to you and as something to think about for the newbies, my undeniable, well evidenced proof of god.

P1: Clapton is god.
P2: Clapton exists. (Evidence below.)
C: God exists.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Didn't I do that already?

As a reminder to you and as something to think about for the newbies, my undeniable, well evidenced proof of god.

P1: Clapton is god.
P2: Clapton exists. (Evidence below.)
C: God exists.

I can't find a flaw in the reasoning.

 

[endlessvoid2018]

Evidently, there are some people out there who lean more towards atheism, but probably don't call themselves as such or just consider themselves Agnostic. I am open to the possibility that there might be some kind of undefined, higher force in the universe, whether it's a "god," or something else. However, that doesn't necessarily I believe that there is one. I cannot say with 100% certainty, as I have no way of knowing.

That's kind of where I'm at currently. There is such a negative connotation with the word "atheist."

 

[Subduction Zone]

Evidently, there are some people out there who lean more towards atheism, but probably don't call themselves as such or just consider themselves Agnostic. I am open to the possibility that there might be some kind of undefined, higher force in the universe, whether it's a "god," or something else. However, that doesn't necessarily I believe that there is one. I cannot say with 100% certainty, as I have no way of knowing.

That's kind of where I'm at currently. There is such a negative connotation with the word "atheist."

I won't try to force an agnostic to claim to be an atheist. Technically most of them are atheists, but since there is an unfair bias against atheists I will let them choose to call themselves whatever they like. Bart Ehrman has admitted that he is an atheist at times, but he still prefers the label of agnostic. So that is how I refer to him.

 

[endlessvoid2018]

Love Bart Ehrman. I listen to him a lot. He does identify with being both Agnostic and an atheist. But since he's a scholar, he chooses to identify first with being Agnostic.

 

[SalixIncendium]

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[endlessvoid2018]

Since when is this a debate?

 

[McBell]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist? Obviously, the term Agnostic isn't really mutually exclusive.
I certainly have seen a lot more people who claim to be an Agnostic Atheist, as opposed to an Agnostic Theist.
I have had a whole slew of different thoughts since my deconstruction from Christianity around three months ago.
My first landing on Agnostic, then Deism, then Agnostic Theist, next was a bit of Pantheism/Pandeism, now
I'm basically back to being Agnostic again. However, I sort of feel ever since then, that I am really starting to believe
that there possibly isn't any god or gods. But obviously, I cannot know that for sure as I cannot prove anything.
I don't believe in the God of Abrahamic faiths at all. But I am having a hard time getting past the concept of there not
being any kind of god or higher power at all, whether in the non religious sense or other.
Possibly due to my indoctrination at a young age? I was baptized in the Catholic church as an infant,
and went to church at a young age. So basically it was engraved into me the belief that God exists.
I have found the most peace recently though however falling on Agnostic beliefs, and basically living my life
non-religious. Essentially neutral. I still have some kind of lingering notions however that something may exist
beyond this life, even if it's not a god or a deity. Perhaps I am spiritual and not religious?
Several people have told me my beliefs sound like I am in fact an Agnostic Atheist. Others have said that the
best stance I can take is being what I have been, an agnostic that doesn't practice religion.
Another person I spoke to said I can hold Atheist beliefs without identifying as an Atheist.
And for anyone who has gone from being a Christian to Atheist or Agnostic Atheist, how
long did it take for you to accept the fact that there may not be a god or that you no longer believed there was?

Any thoughts?

I was recently told that I am an apathetic agnostic atheist.
But if I go with that I will be shortening it to AAA

 

[Altfish]

If your an Agnostic. , your definitely not an Atheist.

Yes, that's how I've always interpreted the difference.
Agnostic basically means you don't believe in a God but you haven't completely dismissed the idea.
Atheist is someone who definitely does not believe in a God

 

[Whateverist]

I am curious to who out there is an Agnostic Atheist?

I used to think I was but then I realized my easy skepticism was directed at a borrowed, poorly understood notion of “what a god is”.

The thing I really hated about religious belief was the way they say “believe in __” instead of “believe that __ is true”. But then I realized there is much in human experience that is at first mirky, everything from intuition to quantum field theory (QFT). Sometimes you have to feel your way into new understanding; you can’t just look everything up on google and give it either a thumbs up or down. I believe God/gods is such domain.

There is a strong desire to keep things simple, cut and dry, perfectly clear. But you will never understand QFT if you insist on a simple model and the same thing goes for God/gods. Christians I know get mad if you refer to what God is instead who. For them God must be understood as person-like anything else is just disrespectful. But I think that exults humans not whatever it is we mean by God. I reject the notion that God is at all like a person or even a being in himself.

Maybe God is to humanity as the cells of our body are to what we mean when we say “I”. Every cell in out bodies is capable of surviving outside it provided we supply what is needed the way the environment of our bodies can. Every cell has the wherewithal to be what it is and to do what it needs to survive within the circumstance in which it has evolved but they also exist as a cog in the larger organism which we take ourselves to be. You won’t find anywhere in your body a single cell that is the source of your animacy and agency. Who you are arises from the body as a whole and if there is anything that corresponds to who/what God is, I think you will not find it in any one person (sorry Jesus) or any one wisdom tradition. All of those are just fingers pointing to the moon. You mustn’t confuse the word or icon with the moon.