America isn't Christian

[adam45]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America.

Freemasons have created the USA,
the first president was a Freemason,
the seal of the USA is Masonic.

With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America.

Freemasons have created the USA,
the first president was a Freemason,
the seal of the USA is Masonic.

With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

Well America isn't a Christian nation, but it certainly has Christian influences that had defined this country. There is no denying that.

Problem is a number of Christians tend to think America is a Christian nation.

I can definitely agree Americans don't act Christian but I also think the country shouldn't be held and obligated to Christian standards overall.

It's peculiar however how a view of one sided political affiliation and choice of leaders among other bullet points can constitute your list of what a Christian is and isn't when so much clergy lacks such definition themselves.

 

[danieldemol]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

'Christianity is the most prevalent religion in the United States. Estimates from 2021 suggest that of the entire U.S. population (332 million) about 63% is Christian (210 million).[1]'
Source: Christianity in the United States - Wikipedia.

That makes the biggest influence over US government today Christian in my view.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America...

...With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

None of the above would prevent one from believing in Christianity in my view.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

Christian Zionism is a thing, and not all Christians are Bible based and/or sharing your interpretation of the Bible where they are Bible based in my view.

 

[HonestJoe]

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

That is literally true, though religious identify and influence on a nation and it's people is much wider than just the formal constitutional structures.

Most of the Europeans who travelled to the New World and established the communities that ultimately became the USA were Christians though, and most of the people who did the terrible things you listed (and great things you didn't) were Christians too.

And you don't get to disassociate the concept of Christianity from Americans, historic or modern, just because some of the most vocal ones in the US today happen to follow a form of Christianity the differs from your own. Of course, just because you're a Christian today doesn't mean you have any specific responsibility for the events of the past or even today either, just as I don't just because I'm European.

Maybe it would be better to address the actual problems in the world rather than just seeking to shift blame on to anyone who isn't you and yours?

 

[Frank Buffalo]

There’s always the question of how we define “Christian”, which these days can range from fundamentalist ones who believe in the bible word-for-word, to liberal Christians who have a vague sense that there’s an ethical god out there somewhere who had something to do with now-dead Jesus but whatever….

What’s of interest to me is that many people think this nation started out Christian from the Revolutionary War onward. But well-respected historians tell a different story:

As of 1776, just 12%-17% of the American colonists were churchgoers.Ref 1 American Christianity declined during the Revolutionary War period, and by the end of it, only one in 10 or 12—or even 20--Americans was a member of a church.Refs 2-4 Christian religiosity didn’t rise again until after the war was over, and the number of churches doubled by 1790. Ref 5 Numerically, therefore, Christianity’s direct influence on politics was negligible. Any religious zeal supporting the American war flagged during the late 1770s as the war continued.Ref 6

Ref 1 Waldman, Steven. Founding Faith: Providence, Politics, and the Birth of Religious Freedom in America. New York, NY: Random House; 2008:44.
Ref 2 Ahlstrom, Sidney. A Religious History:365.
Ref 3 Wacker, Grant. Religion in Nineteenth Century America. New York, NY & Oxford, UK: Oxford University Press; 2000:1
Ref 4 Wood, Gordon S. Empire of Liberty: A History of the Early Republic, 1789-1815. Oxford, UK: Oxford University Press; 2009:578
Ref 5 Ibid., 580.
Ref 6 Kidd, Thomas S. God of Liberty: Religious History of the American Revolution. New York, NY: Basic Books; 2010:107.

Furthermore, a number of the actual leaders of the Revolutionary War, such as Benjamin Franklin, were deistsRef 1—meaning they believed in a kind of mechanical clockwork universe, which some Prime Mover may have set in motion, but then pulled back from active management. Deists were not considered Christian, really. Meanwhile, Jefferson edited his own version of the bible, cutting out all the miracle stories, including the virgin birth and bodily resurrection of Jesus.Ref 2, Ref 3 George Washington, who was raised Anglican and continued to attend an Anglican church about once a month as an adult, apparently kept his actual beliefs unknown, but perhaps had leanings toward deism.Refs 4-6 John Adams was a Unitarian, a departure from traditional trinitarian Christian beliefs.Ref 7, Ref 8

Ref 1 Isaacson, Walter. Benjamin Franklin:87.
Ref 2 Waldman, Steven. Founding Faith:72.
Ref 3 Wacker, Grant. Religion in Nineteenth Century America:26.
Ref 4 Waldman, Steven. Founding Faith:57.
Ref 5 Chernow, Ron. Washington: A Life:131.
Ref 6 Wacker, Grant. Religion in Nineteenth Century America:26
Ref 7 Kidd, Thomas S. God of Liberty:231.
Ref 8 Waldman, Steven. Founding Faith:35.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

America is culturally Christian, and always has been, even though we have a secular government that protects minority religions. The three strands that made for the American ideology were Christianity, Deism, and the influence of the Enlightenment.

 

[Jimmy]

Unfortunately all nations are imperfect and the best we can strive for is to help where we can and live and let live.

 

[BrokenBread]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America.

Freemasons have created the USA,
the first president was a Freemason,
the seal of the USA is Masonic.

With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

Please go on ?
You believe over 14 million people in the last 4 years were willing to risk death from the elements, extortion, robbery, rape, murder, assault, human trafficking, arrest just for a chance to illegally set foot in this country above any other country on the planet for what reason ?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America.

Freemasons have created the USA,
the first president was a Freemason,
the seal of the USA is Masonic.

With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

Since when are theft, genocide or slavery not Christian?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

America is culturally Christian, and always has been, even though we have a secular government that protects minority religions. The three strands that made for the American ideology were Christianity, Deism, and the influence of the Enlightenment.

Also the influence of the English Civil War, IMO. It would have been modern history for the American Founding Fathers and been a strong example of the abuses that can happen when religion has influence over secular power.

IMO, the English Civil War was what prompted the American Founding Fathers to adopt a model of a secular - not Christian - government over a nation predominantly of Christians. They knew that there's no such thing as a "generic Christian" government, and that sectarianism in government breeds discrimination against Christian denominations that aren't in power.

 

[Jimmy]

Since when are theft, genocide or slavery not Christian?

Since “Jesus”

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Since “Jesus”

The question of whether Jesus would or wouldn't aporove of Christianity is a separate matter to the question of what Christianity is.

 

[Jimmy]

The question of whether Jesus would or wouldn't aporove of Christianity is a separate matter to the question of what Christianity is.

“Jesus” was the beginning of Christianity.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

“Jesus” was the beginning of Christianity.

That's hotly debated. A buttload of historians say that Jesus preached Judaism and had no intention of starting a new religion; that it was Paul who created the new faith.

 

[Jimmy]

That's hotly debated. A buttload of historians say that Jesus preached Judaism and had no intention of starting a new religion; that it was Paul who created the new faith.

“Jesus’” teachings were new and unlike anything the world ever seen and he intended his teachings for all humankind.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

“Jesus” was the beginning of Christianity.

Any religion is defined by community. What "Christianity" is is defined by what Christians accept or reject within their communities.

"Jesus" is only part of what Christianity is to the extent that Christians make him a part of Christianity.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

That's hotly debated. A buttload of historians say that Jesus preached Judaism and had no intention of starting a new religion; that it was Paul who created the new faith.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I wonder what these historians thought about scriptures like Matthew 28:19-20: "19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” I'm not sure if Jesus actually said this or not, but it is attributed to him in the Book of Matthew.

 

[Jimmy]

Any religion is defined by community. What "Christianity" is is defined by what Christians accept or reject within their communities.

"Jesus" is only part of what Christianity is to the extent that Christians make him a part of Christianity.

Forgiving, not judging, doing unto others…… and a few more is the core of Christianity which Jesus brought so I’d say that’s more than a part.

 

[stvdv]

I believe,

America isn't Christian,
and never was Christian.

How America's history started:
People from Europe came,
have stolen land,
have committed genocide,
have kidnapped millions of black people,
to make them slaves in America.

Freemasons have created the USA,
the first president was a Freemason,
the seal of the USA is Masonic.

With lies,
America has invaded other countries.
With malice,
America has dropped nuclear bombs,
With cunning,
America has financed the second world war.

America created Hollywood,
and with Hollywood immorality,
and with Hollywood fornication,
and with Hollywood idolatry.

Americas's so called Christians,
are Evangelicals,
people who do not,
follow the Bible,
people who support a Trump,
people who are fanatical Zionists.

Spot on most things

 

[IndigoChild5559]

“Jesus’” teachings were new and unlike anything the world ever seen and he intended his teachings for all humankind.

The things Jesus said about himself were unusual.

The things he taught about God and how we should live were nothing new. He basically taught second Temple Judaism. Many of his most famous sayings were simply quotes of others, such as the Torah, or Hillel.

Jesus never intended some kind of worldwide religion. He never left Palestine. He never preached to a crowd of Gentiles. He said he came for the lost house of Israel (sinful Jews). Nothing about that is bad.