Animals...

[Truth_Faith13]

Because they have a physical disability. It's purely physical, like children aren't grown up enough.

It is not that they do not have the capability, if something were to cure them from this "disease", to reason. Which is not true for, well, a raven.

Do you understand what I'm trying to say, because I'm not sure my English is good enough.

I think we need to get out terms correct here - someone with a physical disability may still have full understaning and mental capacity therefore would be able to enter the debate. Eg people in weelchairs etc.

I think your trying to state people with mental disabilities, though there are still people in this catergory who can tell you what they like dislike. They just may have to adjust the way they do it!

 

[lombas]

Could you enter a debate with someone who doesnt speak english (or whatever you native tongue is)? yet they are human beings! we just dont understand them! I think animals can talk, they are just meant to talk among themselves!

Hi laws.

It's true what you say, but I'd have to answer the same thing I did on the question about children. In my everyday life, I speak Flemish (Dutch, if you please), which most of you wouldn't understand, at least not on an intellectual level, just like I cannot discuss something in Mandarin, Thai or Croatian.

You see, there is a difference between being able to enter a rational debate and actually discuss something. To be able to really discuss something actively, it is indeed true that some premises need to be fulfilled, like understand each others language or body language.

I do not understand Mandarin, but I do know that I can enter a rational debate with someone who speaks that language if I learned it.

But, like I said, even if you could speak ravenish, then still you wouldn't be able to reason with such an animal. Therefore, it cannot "defend" itself, ie claim rights that are needed to establish the rules of such a rational debate (argumentation ethics).

I think that it is said animals are under human beings - therefore should not be able to enter a debate with us, but whether they can enter a debate shouldnt determine whether they have souls, go to heaven etc.

No, of course not.

 

[lombas]

I think we need to get out terms correct here - someone with a physical disability may still have full understaning and mental capacity therefore would be able to enter the debate. Eg people in weelchairs etc.

I think your trying to state people with mental disabilities, though there are still people in this catergory who can tell you what they like dislike. They just may have to adjust the way they do it!

I know, I misinterpreted it in the first place.

 

[Aqualung]

Sorry, immoral.

Don't know why I said "amoral". In my language, it's practically the same (amoreel - immoreel).

No need to appologize, I just didn't know which you meant. Thanks for clearifying.

 

[Truth_Faith13]

Just wanted to thankyou for replying to this thread everyone! Nice to see we all care about animals in one way or another!!!

 

[GoldenDragon]

If there is one belief I oppose with my religion(Catholicism) it would be that animals do have souls that will go to paradise after they die. I believe God cares for all of His creations not just humans but animals, plants and such and so I don't think He'd leave them out of the "afterlife deal".
Plus I think it'd just seem kind of I don't know awkward, strange, looking for another word... being in a paradise(usuaully the Garden of Eden) without seeing a bird singing in the tree top, or fish in the waters or our dogs and cats being at our sides. Can you imagine a place with ONLY humans and nothing else here on Earth?? Can you honestly say you'd be happy there??

As for using them as food I don't see a problem with using animals as food but I have a problem with the way they are being killed now a days and the stuff being injected into them to make them more "productive". I don't know about the Catholic laws of respecting animals destined to be butchered but I know the kosher law requires that the animal be butchered by one quick slice through the neck with a perfectly sharpened, even, blade with no nicks, so the animal quickly goes unconcious.

It doesn't sound so nice but its way more humane than the methods used in farm factories and such today.

 

[kateyes]

I have always felt it was remarkly short sighted(human centric) to assume animals are a lower class of life than humans. Animals communicate within thier species, they have a family (pack, flock, herd) hierarchy, generally care for thier young and generally seem more respectful of thier surroundings. They do not waste and abuse thier environment. I think it is silly to assume because we cannot speak thier language(so to speak) to assume they have no ability to problem solve, nor logical thinking abilities. In many cases the early criteria used to determine they differences between man and animals have been found to be inaccurate. IE: the use of tools was an early distinction--but otters use rocks to crack open shell fish, monkeys use sticks to attract termites from thier holes, eagles will drop shell fish from heights to crack the shells, these and many many more actions would indicate both the ability to use tools and logic abilities in make the corellations between the actions and the results.

Do animals have souls and go to heaven--since I view them as equal children of God with humans--I would say of course they do.

 

[Makhsihed]

Kemetic belief is that everything, from humans to dogs to trees and rocks, has a ka, a spirit. Only humans (in Kemetic belief) have a ba, however; an eternal core, a soul. The ka goes to the afterlife; the ba either rejoins with Netjer (the All) or reincarnates (depending on your interpretation of things) or joins with the ka and goes to the afterlife as well (again, depending on interpretation and time period of Egypt you're talking about).

Nonhuman spirits are called netjeri. The kau of animals and such does go onto the afterlife, to the Field of Reeds, which is not much different than this world.

 

[Truth_Faith13]

Kemetic belief is that everything, from humans to dogs to trees and rocks, has a ka, a spirit. Only humans (in Kemetic belief) have a ba, however; an eternal core, a soul. The ka goes to the afterlife; the ba either rejoins with Netjer (the All) or reincarnates (depending on your interpretation of things) or joins with the ka and goes to the afterlife as well (again, depending on interpretation and time period of Egypt you're talking about).

Nonhuman spirits are called netjeri. The kau of animals and such does go onto the afterlife, to the Field of Reeds, which is not much different than this world.

Hi there,

I have never heard of your faith - could you give me a brief discription of what it is, where it comes form?

 

[ChickenProphet]

I believe they have a soul like we do. They get reincarnated like we do and pass on to the afterlife. I believe we should respect animals to the highest and not cause them unnecessary harm. Normally animals do not attack humans unless they're starving to death or we do something to provoke them.
Of course we can eat them, it's natural for us to. I'd prefer the animal to have have been in a field eating it's natural food and kept in a nice environment, instead of being stuck in a cage and fed swill, corn etc.

 

[Gentoo]

Hi there,

I have never heard of your faith - could you give me a brief discription of what it is, where it comes form?

Here, if you haven't seen it yet: http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50205&page=3

Post number 23

 

[Quiddity]

If there is one belief I oppose with my religion(Catholicism) it would be that animals do have souls....

Then make that zero. The Catholic Church does indeed see animals with souls. Not only that, but plants too!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I believe animals have souls the same as people, and are here to learn as well. I also believe the souls of man and animal are the same, and can live on this earth as man or beast.

Man is, however, negligent of this reality and imagines that sensibility is 374 peculiar to mankind,

I am curious as to what the "374 peculiar" means.

 

[morning-star]

I believe they have a soul like we do. They get reincarnated like we do and pass on to the afterlife. I believe we should respect animals to the highest and not cause them unnecessary harm. Normally animals do not attack humans unless they're starving to death or we do something to provoke them.
Of course we can eat them, it's natural for us to. I'd prefer the animal to have have been in a field eating it's natural food and kept in a nice environment, instead of being stuck in a cage and fed swill, corn etc.

I agree with this 100% ( chicken.p you said something good for once ) any one that harms an aminal should be shot...wildlife keeps the balance of things and without it we would die. we are destorying there homes and our home (the earth) we can live in harmony with animals, it's just finding that balance. animals have sptirts like we do, they also have personalitys, and emotions like we do. they can also communicate to us in ways many ways(thruogh enrgy and mind etc.).