Another Abortion Debate

[leroy]

My answer is simple, common sense. The apple is a part of the tree.

Is the worm that lives inside the apple also part of the apple? Or is it a different organism?

I'd like to invite others to weigh in on the topic of whether an unborn child is a part of its mother.

By the same logic, the fetus can also make the same argument, from the point of view of the fetus the mother (part of her) is also inside his body and he is sharing the environment (womb) with her mother.

The fetus has its own DNA (different from the mother) this means that by definition it´s a different organism.

You position goes against “common sense” for example, what happens when a doctor has to take the fetus out of the mother due to a medical procedure, and the put it back inside the womb?........does the baby becomes a new organisms outside the womb, and then it becomes part of the mother? How does that work?

We the “pro choicers” have the benefit of the doubt , unless you show conclusively and beyond reasonable doubt that the fetus is part of the mother, we should play safe , treat the fetus as an independent human, and don’t abort.

--- and about the law---
According to the law, if you hit a pregnant woman multiple times and you end up killing the fetus you will get a greater punishment than if the fetus doesn’t die. Is this law absurd? (by your logic YES this law is absurd)

If a father forces her daughter to abort, that is also a serious crime, (and I am assuming that you agree with this laws)…. but if he forces her daughter to have a haircut, that wouldn’t be considered a crime, why? By your logic the fetus is part of the woman just like it´s her hair, so by your logic none of those should be considered serious crimes.

So my point is that by denying that the fetus is an independent human , you would have to agree in changing a bunch of laws that ironically are laws intended to protect the woman (and the fetus) you would have to conclude that these type of laws are absurd.

 

[Dogknox20]

I have noticed that people that agree or disagree with anything have already been born.

Hello Dan From Smithville I hope all is well..
I reply.. If I freely engaged in an activity that I knew had the possibility of creating a helpless human life, I am responsible for creating that life and I owe the baby/Mother whatever assistance she needs to survive.
Killing the baby is a form of birth control! Costs the tax payer billions of dollars!

Abortion was introduced to control the "Black Population" what happed to Black Lives matter?!

 

[Windwalker]

Abortion was introduced to control the "Black Population" what happed to Black Lives matter?!

Waaa??? Source?

 

[Valjean]

Good to meet you...
WHY.. Why do you say it's the mothers body.... God made her in such a way as to deliver children; it's not a contrary thing to have a baby!? Can't be to protect the mother health.. NEVER has a baby killed the mother! Aborted does NOT save the mother’s life.

This isn't true. Pregnancy and, especially, childbirth, have been major causes of death ever since we began walking upright. Modern medicine has greatly reduced maternal death, but it still remains a health hazard to women. Miscarriage - Wikipedia
IF... "If my daughter was raped the baby should be aborted!" HOW...[/quote]Huh?

lewisnotmiller

how often does a rape lead to conception!? What... 1% of the time?! No excuse or need to have abortion as a means of birth control! Even then it's not the babies fault!

No, It's more like 5%. Pregnancy from rape - Wikipedia {ain't Wiki cool?)

They pass out condoms "FREE" what happed to them... You are paying for the Abortions by your tax dollars.... Billions of dollars spent killing the innocent! Some woman have had up to ten abortions on your dime!

So you recomment all fertile men and women carry condoms? Even if they did, do you expect people would use them assiduously?
A more practical approach would be to use IUDs or hormonal implants, dontcha think?

In re: costs, I think the long term cost of subsidized housing, food stamps, Welfare payments, Medicaid, poor health, high crime and imprisonment would greatly exceed the cost of prevention. Abortion may seem penny foolish, but it's definately pound wise.

 

[Dogknox20]

I would say an unborn child is a part of its mother, although I find it difficult to accept comparisons to an appendix or hair follicles. It's the result of a natural process, not some abnormal growth. It is what it is. At some point, it might eventually be considered separate from the mother, but I don't know where that point would be.

I don't believe abortion is murder, and I think it should remain legal as a practical societal matter. But I can't think of it as just a simple medical procedure either.

Stevicus Think about this.... You don't believe abortion is murder!
Have you ever heard of "Partial birth abortion"?
A full term baby.. a baby in the ninth month is turned around so the feet come out first... If the head comes out; it is a Baby until the head comes out it is NOT human! They turn the baby around so all is out except the head then they stick a syringe into the back of the babies head suck out the spinal fluid they sell this fluid!

The global Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF) Management market size is projected to reach USD 945.8 million by 2027, from USD 785.1 million in 2020, at a CAGR of 2.7% during 2021-2027.

Your tax dollars are paying "Planed Parent hood" they to add value to there industry by selling the dead baby parts!!

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Hello Dan From Smithville I hope all is well..
I reply.. If I freely engaged in an activity that I knew had the possibility of creating a helpless human life, I am responsible for creating that life and I owe the baby/Mother whatever assistance she needs to survive.
Killing the baby is a form of birth control! Costs the tax payer billions of dollars!

Abortion was introduced to control the "Black Population" what happed to Black Lives matter?!

Hello to you and all the people that are alive to read this and agree or disagree with it. No offense to the never were is meant, but I cannot know your views.

I am not pro-abortion. Only pro-facts, pro-logic and pro-reason.

 

[Dogknox20]

This isn't true. Pregnancy and, especially, childbirth, have been major causes of death ever since we began walking upright. Modern medicine has greatly reduced maternal death, but it still remains a health hazard to women. Huh?

lewisnotmiller how often does a rape lead to conception!? What... 1% of the time?! No excuse or need to have abortion as a means of birth control! Even then it's not the babies fault!

No, It's more like 5%. Pregnancy from rape - Wikipedia {ain't Wiki cool?)
So you recomment all fertile men and women carry condoms? Even if they did, do you expect people would use them assiduously?
A more practical approach would be to use IUDs or hormonal implants, dontcha think?

In re: costs, I think the long term cost of subsidized housing, food stamps, Welfare payments, Medicaid, poor health, high crime and imprisonment would greatly exceed the cost of prevention. Abortion may seem penny foolish, but it's definately pound wise.[/QUOTE]
Valjean I have to ask "What planet are you from!?"
When woman were dying there was NO abortion! Abortion started in the 1980 not the 1800s! Birth does NOT kill woman!

You said.. I think the long term cost of subsidized housing, food stamps, Welfare payments, Medicaid, poor health, high crime and imprisonment would greatly exceed the cost of prevention. Abortion may seem penny foolish, but it's definitely pound wise.

I reply.. You are assuming a lot! What if they aborted Beethoven?! You are assuming the child would NOT contribute to society?!
FACT: The country needs workers... So they import labor from outside the Country because we are killing our on self generated labor! Apparently Spain has a higher death rate then birth rate they will cease to exist in one generation!

Woman have the right to their bodies.... Then woman should accept the responsibility to their actions! OR do you also believe woman are weak and can't control their actions?!

 

[Dogknox20]

Waaa??? Source?

Planned Parenthood traces its roots back to a nurse named Margaret Sanger. Sanger believed in eugenics — an inherently racist and ableist ideology that labeled certain people unfit to have children. Eugenics is the theory that society can be improved through planned breeding for “desirable traits” like intelligence and industriousness.

Eugenics is the practice or advocacy of improving the human species by selectively mating people with specific desirable hereditary traits. It aims to reduce human suffering by “breeding out” disease, disabilities and so-called undesirable characteristics from the human population.

 

[Valjean]

No, It's more like 5%. Pregnancy from rape - Wikipedia {ain't Wiki cool?)
So you recomment all fertile men and women carry condoms? Even if they did, do you expect people would use them assiduously?
A more practical approach would be to use IUDs or hormonal implants, dontcha think?

In re: costs, I think the long term cost of subsidized housing, food stamps, Welfare payments, Medicaid, poor health, high crime and imprisonment would greatly exceed the cost of prevention. Abortion may seem penny foolish, but it's definately pound wise.

Valjean

I have to ask "What planet are you from!?"
When woman were dying there was NO abortion! Abortion started in the 1980 not the 1800s! Birth does NOT kill woman!

"Spontaneous Abortion" is the medical term for "miscarriage."
Women die in childbirth, not as often as they did in pre-abortion, pre-modern obstetrics days, but they do die. That's simply a fact.
Read the Wiki link.

You said.

. I think the long term cost of subsidized housing, food stamps, Welfare payments, Medicaid, poor health, high crime and imprisonment would greatly exceed the cost of prevention. Abortion may seem penny foolish, but it's definitely pound wise.

I reply.. You are assuming a lot! What if they aborted Beethoven?! You are assuming the child would NOT contribute to society?!

I'm assuming nothing. Just google the stats on Food Stamps, subsidized housing, Welfare, Medicaid, health impacts, poverty, crime and imprisonment demographics.
Beethoven? For every aborted social contributor there are a hundred socially deleterious persons born into poverty.

FACT: The country needs workers... So they import labor from outside the Country because we are killing our on self generated labor! Apparently Spain has a higher death rate then birth rate they will cease to exist in one generation!

Here in the US, aren't we spending millions actively trying to exclude able-bodied immigrants?
The greatest threat to humanity today is our very numbers. Environmental devastation, global warming, species extinction -- all direct results of our overpopulation.

Woman have the right to their bodies.... Then woman should accept the responsibility to their actions! OR do you also believe woman are weak and can't control their actions?!

Men and women are what they are. We're often slaves to our passions. Abortion is a way to ameliorate the results of our natural impulsiveness and foolishness.

 

[Dogknox20]

"Spontaneous Abortion" is the medical term for "miscarriage."
Women die in childbirth, not as often as they did in pre-abortion, pre-modern obstetrics days, but they do die. That's simply a fact.
Read the Wiki link.

I'm assuming nothing. Just google the stats on Food Stamps, subsidized housing, Welfare, Medicaid, health impacts, poverty, crime and imprisonment demographics.
Beethoven? For every aborted social contributor there are a hundred socially deleterious persons born into poverty.
Here in the US, aren't we spending millions actively trying to exclude able-bodied immigrants?
The greatest threat to humanity today is our very numbers. Environmental devastation, global warming, species extinction -- all direct results of our overpopulation.
Men and women are what they are. We're often slaves to our passions. Abortion is a way to ameliorate the results of our natural impulsiveness and foolishness.

I reply "Your simple FACTS" have nothing to do with the Abortion debate! Yes ""miscarriage" you twist the FACTS!

Your words... The greatest threat to humanity today is our very numbers. Environmental devastation, global warming, species extinction -- all direct results of our overpopulation.
I reply: You have been brain washed! The greatest threat to humanity is NOT humanity!

In India there are NO girls they have been aborted! The balance of nature has been altered! Hitler and those like him are a greater threat! Killing man is the worst of all evils!

Your words... Men and women are what they are. We're often slaves to our passions.
I reply: So you admit Abortion is a convenience! Not to protect woman's health!
Have you ever heard of "Partial birth abortion"?
A full term baby.. a baby in the ninth month is turned around so the feet come out first... If the head comes out; it is a Baby until the head comes out it is NOT human! They turn the baby around so all is out except the head then they stick a syringe into the back of the babies head suck out the spinal fluid they sell this fluid!

The global Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF) Management market size is projected to reach USD 945.8 million by 2027, from USD 785.1 million in 2020, at a CAGR of 2.7% during 2021-2027.

Your tax dollars are paying "Planed Parent hood" they add value to there industry by selling the dead baby parts! Some woman have had over ten abortions on your tax dollar it is a very costly form of birth control!

 

[Willamena]

Define "part of."

An unborn child is a genetically separate organism contained within and nourished by the mother, as is a fœtus or even the original zygote (It's technically a parasite, in this regard).
If part of means contained, attached or something like that, then a baby is part of its mother. If it means a genetically distinct organism, then it's not.

Consider: If a farmer grafts a peach or plumb shoot onto an apple tree, will the resulting branch and fruit be 'part of' the apple tree, even though they're genetically different?

Genetics is not a determinant of "a part of," although things may be determined to be a part of genetics.

 

[Valjean]

I reply "Your simple FACTS" have nothing to do with the Abortion debate! Yes ""miscarriage" you twist the FACTS!

What facts am I twisting, please?
You claimed childbirth didn't kill. I responded with facts.
You intimated that the cost of abortion outweighed the social and material costs of unwed motherhood and unwanted children. It does not.

Your words...

The greatest threat to humanity today is our very numbers. Environmental devastation, global warming, species extinction -- all direct results of our overpopulation.
I reply: You have been brain washed! The greatest threat to humanity is NOT humanity!

Sorry, but the greatest threat, to the entire planet, is climate change; and the greatest cause of human poverty and premature death is exceeding the carrying capacity of a region. This is not brain washing, it's fact.

What's your take on the Greatest Threat?

In India there are NO girls they have been aborted! The balance of nature has been altered! Hitler and those like him are a greater threat! Killing man is the worst of all evils!

Sorry, Dog, but you're raving.

How is India's population increasing, without "girls;?" test tube babies?
Where do all the current headlines about rape and abuse come from?
Google a street scene from India. Are those all transvestites?

Your words...

Men and women are what they are. We're often slaves to our passions.
I reply: So you admit Abortion is a convenience! Not to protect woman's health!

It's both -- and more.

Have you ever heard of "Partial birth abortion"?

How could I not have heard of it? It features prominently in anti-abortion propaganda.

A full term baby.. a baby in the ninth month is turned around so the feet come out first... If the head comes out; it is a Baby until the head comes out it is NOT human! They turn the baby around so all is out except the head then they stick a syringe into the back of the babies head suck out the spinal fluid they sell this fluid!

My question: How common is it, and why is it done? This is not an everyday procedure, and virtually noöne 'approves' of it.
Fact-Checking Trump's Statements On 'Partial-Birth' Abortion

The global Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF) Management market size is projected to reach USD 945.8 million by 2027, from USD 785.1 million in 2020, at a CAGR of 2.7% during 2021-2027.

Your tax dollars are paying "Planed Parent hood" they add value to there industry by selling the dead baby parts! Some woman have had over ten abortions on your tax dollar it is a very costly form of birth control!

Planned Parenthood is not an industry. It's an underfunded health clinic. A small part of their business involves abortions.
"Baby Parts" can be either incinerated as waste, or used for medical procedures or research. They are not sold for profit.
Almost all medical institutions that generate biological waste "sell" useful tissues or body parts for research or transplant, by the way.

 

[Valjean]

Planned Parenthood traces its roots back to a nurse named Margaret Sanger. Sanger believed in eugenics — an inherently racist and ableist ideology that labeled certain people unfit to have children. Eugenics is the theory that society can be improved through planned breeding for “desirable traits” like intelligence and industriousness.

Eugenics is the practice or advocacy of improving the human species by selectively mating people with specific desirable hereditary traits. It aims to reduce human suffering by “breeding out” disease, disabilities and so-called undesirable characteristics from the human population.

But eugenics -- selective breeding -- works, doesn't it? Farmers have used it for thousands of years.
The misapplication or bad implementation of a procedure doesn't negate its potential effectiveness.

The interstate Highway system traces its roots back to Adolph Hitler, and Hitler believed in exterminating non-aryans. Therefore, our interstate highway system is evil! -- Your reasoning right back at you.

 

[Valjean]

Genetics is not a determinant of "a part of," although things may be determined to be a part of genetics.

This is why everything hinges on definitions.
Send some anaomynous fœtal tissue, and a specimen from the mother, to a DNA or tissue lab, and they'd report they came from two, separate, distinct, different organisms.

A fœtus is an entirely different organism from its host, but it can also be thought of as "part of" its host. How these facts play into the abortion debate is a matter of opinion.

 

[Willamena]

I think that, obviously, the unborn child is part of the mother. It is also, obviously, part of the father as well.
And children certainly aren't legally autonomous, being dependent on their parents (or guardians) until they reach adulthood, even though they may be capable of taking independent ("autonomous") action even while still in the womb.
However, I don't understand the sense in which you are using the word "integral" to describe various parts of a woman's body. Do you mean "necessary to make whole or complete", "included as part of the whole rather than supplied separately", or "having or containing all parts that are necessary to be complete"?

For example, if I were to say you are an integral part of the team, it would imply that the team cannot function without you; you are necessary to complete the whole team. Legally we would use "integral part" to denote the part that is necessary for some function to be performed. For example, a location, or piece of land that is part of a larger area, can be the integral part (of land) for some group to meet and carry out some activity.

I meant wholeness, as in a completeness of constituent parts, but without the implication of necessity. After all, not all women become mothers.

 

[Willamena]

Is the worm that lives inside the apple also part of the apple? Or is it a different organism?


By the same logic, the fetus can also make the same argument, from the point of view of the fetus the mother (part of her) is also inside his body and he is sharing the environment (womb) with her mother.

The fetus has its own DNA (different from the mother) this means that by definition it´s a different organism.

You position goes against “common sense” for example, what happens when a doctor has to take the fetus out of the mother due to a medical procedure, and the put it back inside the womb?........does the baby becomes a new organisms outside the womb, and then it becomes part of the mother? How does that work?

We the “pro choicers” have the benefit of the doubt , unless you show conclusively and beyond reasonable doubt that the fetus is part of the mother, we should play safe , treat the fetus as an independent human, and don’t abort.

If a person had a heart valve installed, that valve would be a part of them.

--- and about the law---
According to the law, if you hit a pregnant woman multiple times and you end up killing the fetus you will get a greater punishment than if the fetus doesn’t die. Is this law absurd? (by your logic YES this law is absurd)

If a father forces her daughter to abort, that is also a serious crime, (and I am assuming that you agree with this laws)…. but if he forces her daughter to have a haircut, that wouldn’t be considered a crime, why? By your logic the fetus is part of the woman just like it´s her hair, so by your logic none of those should be considered serious crimes.

So my point is that by denying that the fetus is an independent human , you would have to agree in changing a bunch of laws that ironically are laws intended to protect the woman (and the fetus) you would have to conclude that these type of laws are absurd.

The only significant legal issue regarding abortion, the imperative, is that is that the State, in a democracy, not legislate on the matter. People have different opinions, left and right, up and down--none of them right, none of them wrong--and there are plenty of stupid laws on the books. But the existence of laws demanding that medical procedures be either done or not done on individuals is (what I find) an absurdity.

 

[Koldo]

--- and about the law---
According to the law, if you hit a pregnant woman multiple times and you end up killing the fetus you will get a greater punishment than if the fetus doesn’t die. Is this law absurd? (by your logic YES this law is absurd)

If a father forces her daughter to abort, that is also a serious crime, (and I am assuming that you agree with this laws)…. but if he forces her daughter to have a haircut, that wouldn’t be considered a crime, why? By your logic the fetus is part of the woman just like it´s her hair, so by your logic none of those should be considered serious crimes.

So my point is that by denying that the fetus is an independent human , you would have to agree in changing a bunch of laws that ironically are laws intended to protect the woman (and the fetus) you would have to conclude that these type of laws are absurd.

I am not anti-abortion as a whole but i agree with you on this.

 

[Stevicus]

Stevicus Think about this.... You don't believe abortion is murder!
Have you ever heard of "Partial birth abortion"?
A full term baby.. a baby in the ninth month is turned around so the feet come out first... If the head comes out; it is a Baby until the head comes out it is NOT human! They turn the baby around so all is out except the head then they stick a syringe into the back of the babies head suck out the spinal fluid they sell this fluid!

The global Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF) Management market size is projected to reach USD 945.8 million by 2027, from USD 785.1 million in 2020, at a CAGR of 2.7% during 2021-2027.

Your tax dollars are paying "Planed Parent hood" they to add value to there industry by selling the dead baby parts!!

I don't believe "murder" would be the term I would use.

 

[Dogknox20]

What facts am I twisting, please?
You claimed childbirth didn't kill. I responded with facts.
You intimated that the cost of abortion outweighed the social and material costs of unwed motherhood and unwanted children. It does not.
Sorry, but the greatest threat, to the entire planet, is climate change; and the greatest cause of human poverty and premature death is exceeding the carrying capacity of a region. This is not brain washing, it's fact.

What's your take on the Greatest Threat?
Sorry, Dog, but you're raving.

How is India's population increasing, without "girls;?" test tube babies?
Where do all the current headlines about rape and abuse come from?
Google a street scene from India. Are those all transvestites?

It's both -- and more.
How could I not have heard of it? It features prominently in anti-abortion propaganda.

My question: How common is it, and why is it done? This is not an everyday procedure, and virtually noöne 'approves' of it.
Fact-Checking Trump's Statements On 'Partial-Birth' Abortion

The global Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF) Management market size is projected to reach USD 945.8 million by 2027, from USD 785.1 million in 2020, at a CAGR of 2.7% during 2021-2027.
Planned Parenthood is not an industry. It's an underfunded health clinic. A small part of their business involves abortions.
"Baby Parts" can be either incinerated as waste, or used for medical procedures or research. They are not sold for profit.
Almost all medical institutions that generate biological waste "sell" useful tissues or body parts for research or transplant, by the way.

You said... Sorry, but the greatest threat, to the entire planet, is climate change; and the greatest cause of human poverty and premature death is exceeding the carrying capacity of a region. This is not brain washing, it's fact.

What's your take on the Greatest Threat?

I reply: Climate Change is not people caused! The Ice Pack is slipring into the ocean because there is volcanic heat coming up under the Ice causing a cushion of water to make it slip!

&

Earth wobble
Using satellite data on how water moves around Earth, NASA scientists have been able to find out exactly how and why does the Earth wobble.

When the Earth rotates on its spin axis — an imaginary line that passes through the North and South Poles — it drifts and wobbles. These spin-axis movements are called “polar motion” in scientific parlance.

NASA scientists have computed that the measurements for the 20th century show that the spin axis drifted about 4 inches (10 centimeters) per year. Over the course of a century, that becomes more than 11 yards (10 meters).
NASA scientists have broadly categorized three processes that are responsible for this drifting if the earth. The three processes are: contemporary mass loss, glacial rebound, and mantle convection. [Surviving the poleshift, Facebook, vecernji, net, GeoSpacialWorld]

&

NASA Study Solves Two Mysteries About Wobbling Earth
New data on how water moves around Earth answer old questions about the planet's rotation.

Using satellite data on how water moves around Earth, NASA scientists have solved two mysteries about wobbles in the planet's rotation -- one new and one more than a century old. The research may help improve our knowledge of past and future climate.

Although a desktop globe always spins smoothly around the axis running through its north and south poles, a real planet wobbles. Earth's spin axis drifts slowly around the poles; the farthest away it has wobbled since observations began is 37 feet (12 meters). These wobbles don't affect our daily life, but they must be taken into account to get accurate results from GPS, Earth-observing satellites and observatories on the ground.

In a paper published today in Science Advances, Surendra Adhikari and Erik Ivins of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, California, researched how the movement of water around the world contributes to Earth's rotational wobbles. Earlier studies have pinpointed many connections between processes on Earth's surface or interior and our planet's wandering ways. For example, Earth's mantle is still readjusting to the loss of ice on North America after the last ice age, and the reduced mass beneath that continent pulls the spin axis toward Canada at the rate of a few inches each year. But some motions are still puzzling. etc etc etc

&

1. NASA predicts moon 'wobble' and climate change will lead ...
   https://www.cnet.com/news/nasa-predicts-moon-wobble-and-climate-change...
   2021-07-16 · A slight alteration to the moon's orbit -- a wobble, if you will -- has raised both eyebrows and questions about what effect such a slight jiggle may have here on Earth
   etc

&

Ocean Currents and Climate
Scientists across the globe are trying to figure out why the ocean is becoming more violent and what, if anything, can be done about it. Ocean currents, including the ocean conveyor belt, play a key role in determining how the ocean distributes heat energy throughout the planet, thereby regulating and stabilizing climate patterns.
Mass flows of water, or currents, are essential to understanding how heat energy moves between the Earth’s water bodies, landmasses, and atmosphere. The ocean covers 71 percent of the planet and holds 97 percent of its water, making the ocean a key factor in the storage and transfer of heat energy across the globe. The movement of this heat through local and global ocean currents affects the regulation of local weather conditions and temperature extremes, stabilization of global climate patterns, cycling of gases, and delivery of nutrients and larva to marine ecosystems.
Ocean currents are located at the ocean surface and in deep water below 300 meters (984 feet). They can move water horizontally and vertically and occur on both local and global scales. The ocean has an interconnected current, or circulation, system powered by wind, tides, the Earth’s rotation (Coriolis effect), the sun (solar energy), and water density differences. The topography and shape of ocean basins and nearby landmasses also influence ocean currents. These forces and physical characteristics affect the size, shape, speed, and direction of ocean currents. etc


You asked...What's your take on the Greatest Threat?
I reply: The slippery slope! Abortion is a foot in the door.... Next "Woman can do what they want with their bodies" opens up legal prostitutions! Next is Euthanasia killing babies leads to killing the Old Sick and Infirm! FORCED Euthanasia! Increases in homosexual comes from no morals!
Then Socialism leading to forced birth control and movement of the populace! China is ahead of us but we are well on our way! Regulations on religion then complete outlawing of religion! Thus lowering of moral standards resulting Child marriage and Child prostitution Increases in homosexual unions comes from no morals! Large increases of unwarted babies left for the state to care for!
The fall of an empire—the end of a polity, a socioeconomic order, a dominant culture, or the intertwined whole—looks more like a cascading series of minor, individually unimportant failures than a dramatic ending that appears out of the blue.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Good to meet you...

You too!!

WHY.. Why do you say it's the mothers body.... God made her in such a way as to deliver children; it's not a contrary thing to have a baby!?

God also made her in such as way as to have free will, right?

Can't be to protect the mother health.. NEVER has a baby killed the mother! Aborted does NOT save the mother’s life.

I'm not sure why you'd say that. Giving birth to a baby is a physically traumatic experience on the body, and plenty of mothers have suffered or died, particularly before modern medicine was available to help at the levels it now can.
If you believe God made all women in such a way as to deliver babies, I have plenty of thoughts about his design practices.

IF... "If my daughter was raped the baby should be aborted!" HOW...

lewisnotmiller how often does a rape lead to conception!? What... 1% of the time?! No excuse or need to have abortion as a means of birth control! Even then it's not the babies fault!

In no way am I blaming a zygote for anything. I'm defending a woman's right to bodily autonomy. I have no idea why the rate of conception from rape is even part of the argument, as I'm certainly not arguing that abortion should be limited to rape cases.

They pass out condoms "FREE" what happed to them... You are paying for the Abortions by your tax dollars.... Billions of dollars spent killing the innocent! Some woman have had up to ten abortions on your dime!

You're worried about my ability to pay?
All health programs, unemployment benefits, and the like involve levels of wastage of my taxes. I would hope that we do what we can to avoid such waste, but a level is ever-present.
I don't make my moral decisions based on whether somebody, somewhere will rort a system put in place to provide assistance to the community. That seems a slippery slope. And frankly a strange way to view the world for a Christian, although I'm honestly not meaning that to sound as judgey as I guess it does.