Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

[SavedByTheLord]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

The following proves that God Almighty is the Creator of all things.

Suppose that you had never seen a modern cell phone or knew of its existence. You find such a device. An examination of its incredible uses and how intricately it was made would prove the existence of the intelligent makers of that phone. Now consider a large modern city. There are very many cell phones in it and a huge host of other things and activities that make that city and its inhabitants function. An analysis of that city proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made, run, and function in that city. This is even more sure than just the cell phone. Now look at all of civilization. It consists of very many cell phones, many cities, and many other things. An analysis of that civilization proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made that civilization. This is even more sure than in the city example. Finally look at all living things in the world. The intricacies of living things (DNA, RNA, proteins, enzymes, organs, reproduction, the interconnected food chain etc) and their irreducible mutual complexity is way beyond anything that man has made and by an enormous amount. All people have done so far is try to understand how living things work and even now are just scratching the surface. Thus, an examination of all living things and how they interact with the rest of the creation proves the existence of Almighty God the Creator of all things. And this surety is way beyond than even the civilization example. So, here is yet another irrefutable proof that God Almighty, the Creator exists and the He created all things.

Thus, the enormity of the following less winded statement as found in the Bible should be clearly apparent to all the world.

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: - Rom 1:19-20

Since this wisdom, written about 2000 years ago, comes from the word of God, it proves the Bible is the true word of God. There are many things which prove the Bible is the true word of God. Now the Bible predicted that knowledge shall be increased in the last days. But with all the great advances in biology, the passage in Romans 19-20 has not only withstood the scrutiny of science but has been immensely verified by it.

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. – Daniel 12:4

This proof uses mathematical induction. Thus, the proof is irrefutable.
n = intelligently designed objects.
n=1 is just one cell phon, an intelligently designed object
n=k is many cell phones and all other intelligently designed objects.
n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

I have my doubts but let's give it a look.

The following proves that God Almighty is the Creator of all things.

Suppose that you had never seen a modern cell phone or knew of its existence.

Whoa! Right away you start with a "suppose"? Induction does not work that way.

You find such a device. An examination of its incredible uses and how intricately it was made would prove the existence of the intelligent makers of that phone. Now consider a large modern city. There are very many cell phones in it and a huge host of other things and activities that make that city and its inhabitants function. An analysis of that city proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made, run, and function in that city. This is even more sure than just the cell phone. Now look at all of civilization. It consists of very many cell phones, many cities, and many other things. An analysis of that civilization proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made that civilization. This is even more sure than in the city example. Finally look at all living things in the world. The intricacies of living things (DNA, RNA, proteins, enzymes, organs, reproduction, the interconnected food chain etc) and their irreducible mutual complexity is way beyond anything that man has made and by an enormous amount. All people have done so far is try to understand how living things work and even now are just scratching the surface. Thus, an examination of all living things and how they interact with the rest of the creation proves the existence of Almighty God the Creator of all things. And this surety is way beyond than even the civilization example. So, here is yet another irrefutable proof that God Almighty, the Creator exists and the He created all things.

Sorry, this is not induction. This is just an argument from ignorance.

Thus, the enormity of the following less winded statement as found in the Bible should be clearly apparent to all the world.

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: - Rom 1:19-20

Since this wisdom, written about 2000 years ago, comes from the word of God, it proves the Bible is the true word of God. There are many things which prove the Bible is the true word of God. Now the Bible predicted that knowledge shall be increased in the last days. But with all the great advances in biology, the passage in Romans 19-20 has not only withstood the scrutiny of science but has been immensely verified by it.

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. – Daniel 12:4

This proof uses mathematical induction. Thus, the proof is irrefutable.
n = intelligently designed objects.
n=1 is just one cell phon, an intelligently designed object
n=k is many cell phones and all other intelligently designed objects.
n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

Is that it? A very poorly formed argument based upon a logical fallacy?

You need to clean this up a lot and get rid of your logical fallacy. Sorry, but you failed. Everyone else will probably point out the same flaws.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

The following proves that God Almighty is the Creator of all things.

Suppose that you had never seen a modern cell phone or knew of its existence. You find such a device. An examination of its incredible uses and how intricately it was made would prove the existence of the intelligent makers of that phone. Now consider a large modern city. There are very many cell phones in it and a huge host of other things and activities that make that city and its inhabitants function. An analysis of that city proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made, run, and function in that city. This is even more sure than just the cell phone. Now look at all of civilization. It consists of very many cell phones, many cities, and many other things. An analysis of that civilization proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made that civilization. This is even more sure than in the city example. Finally look at all living things in the world. The intricacies of living things (DNA, RNA, proteins, enzymes, organs, reproduction, the interconnected food chain etc) and their irreducible mutual complexity is way beyond anything that man has made and by an enormous amount. All people have done so far is try to understand how living things work and even now are just scratching the surface. Thus, an examination of all living things and how they interact with the rest of the creation proves the existence of Almighty God the Creator of all things. And this surety is way beyond than even the civilization example. So, here is yet another irrefutable proof that God Almighty, the Creator exists and the He created all things.

Except your example uses only things we already know are man made.

Consider, a tree - by some order of magnitude - can be considered more complex even than a mobile phone, and yet your analogy doesn't propose that an individual may happen upon a tree and assume it was man-made. So, obviously, there must be something else - other than complexity - by which we determine an object to be man-made. In the case of your examples, we know cell phones and cities are man-made not because of some inherent quality of the object itself, but because we observe these things being made and can find no examples of them occurring in nature.

So, let's imagine instead an individual is walking in a forest and finds a cell phone. They assume, by the cell phone's composition, that it must be man-made. The individual continues walking in the forest and finds a tree, and from the branches of that tree they can see cell phones growing like fruit. Now, would it STILL be reasonable to assume the cell phone is man-made, or would it not be more reasonable to conclude that the cell phone may well have grown from this tree by some natural process?

See, your analogy fails because it has nothing to compare itself to. It assumes man-made objects are man-made, but makes no mention of how the distinction between a man-made and a non-man-made object is to be determined. It's simply a flimsy, poorly constructed false comparison.

For further illustration, consider if I were to hand you two objects, and I tell you (we will assume I am being absolutely truthful and you are somehow aware that what I am saying is true) that one of the objects is man-made and the other is not man-made. Without knowing exactly how either object was made, what function they serve, or what they are made out of, how could you possibly determine which is which?

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Except your example uses only things we already know are man made.

Consider, a tree - by some order of magnitude - can be considered more complex even than a mobile phone, and yet your analogy doesn't propose that an individual may happen upon a tree and assume it was man-made. So, obviously, there must be something else - other than complexity - by which we determine an object to be man-made. In the case of your examples, we know cell phones and cities are man-made not because of some inherent quality of the object itself, but because we observe these things being made and can find no examples of them occurring in nature.

So, let's imagine instead an individual is walking in a forest and finds a cell phone. They assume, by the cell phone's composition, that it must be man-made. The individual continues walking in the forest and finds a tree, and from the branches of that tree they can see cell phones growing like fruit. Now, would it STILL be reasonable to assume the cell phone is man-made, or would it not be more reasonable to conclude that the cell phone may well have grown from this tree by some natural process?

See, your analogy fails because it has nothing to compare itself to. It assumes man-made objects are man-made, but makes no mention of how the distinction between a man-made and a non-man-made object is to be determined. It's simply a flimsy, poorly constructed false comparison.

For further illustration, consider if I were to hand you two objects, and I tell you (we will assume I am being absolutely truthful and you are somehow aware that what I am saying is true) that one of the objects is man-made and the other is not man-made. Without knowing exactly how either object was made, what function they serve, or what they are made out of, how could you possibly determine which is which?

So are you okay with the proof right up unto living things?

 

[dybmh]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

OK, let's take a look

This proof uses mathematical induction. Thus, the proof is irrefutable.
n = intelligently designed objects.
n=1 is just one cell phon, an intelligently designed object
n=k is many cell phones and all other intelligently designed objects.
n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

The biggest problem, as I see it, is that n>0 -> C>=0 doesn't prove that God created all things.

The consequent would need to be C=1. Nothing else will work. Must be 1 and only 1. Deut 6:4.

​

If C>=0, then C could be 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 or 100 or 1000 or 10000.... See the problem? C>=0 permits polytheism.​

​

Techincally, if C>=0, then C could be 1/2 or 1/4 or 1/8 or 1/16 or 1/32 or 1/64 .... and now there are partial gods?​

​

And if C>=0, then C could be 0. That means there is no God.​

The next big problem is, you're using logical implication. Evaluating using the symbol " -> " has a specific meaning. It means "Assume it's true unless it is proven false." This comes from the logical defintion of " -> " which is a "truth-table". There's no need for math to make that sort of claim. It's the weakest standard for truth that exists. It doesn't actually prove anything. It's extreme optimism nothing more.

For example: The same proof can be made like this: "Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all". Guess what? That's a true statement using implication. This is because it can't be proven false.

I hope this helps,

 

[SavedByTheLord]

OK, let's take a look



The biggest problem, as I see it, is that n>0 -> C>=0 doesn't prove that God created all things.

The consequent would need to be C=1. Nothing else will work. Must be 1 and only 1. Deut 6:4.

If C>=0, then C could be 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 or 100 or 1000 or 10000.... See the problem? C>=0 permits polytheism.

Techincally, if C>=0, then C could be 1/2 or 1/4 or 1/8 or 1/16 or 1/32 or 1/64 .... and now there are partial gods?

The next big problem is, you're using logical implication. Evaluating using the symbol " -> " has a specific meaning. It means "Assume it's true unless it is proven false." This comes from the logical defintion of " -> " which is a "truth-table". There's no need for math to make that sort of claim. It's the weakest standard for truth that exists. It doesn't actually prove anything. It's extreme optimism nothing more.

For example: The same proof can be made like this: "Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all". Guess what? That's a true statement using implication. This is because it can't be proven false.

I hope this helps,

Sorry integers only.

Sow the blue unicorn proof.

 

[dybmh]

Sorry integers only.

Still, same problem, C>=0 permits 1,2,3,4,5,6,10,100,1000,10000, infinite gods. C>=0 permits polytheism.

Also, I missed it originally and editted my post. Maybe you didn't see it. C>=0 permits no God at all. C could be 0.

Show the blue unicorn proof.

Sure!

?? Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all ??

Proposition "P" = Blue-Unicorns
Proposition "Q" = God is creator of all

Truth table for implication:

P | Q | P -> Q
T | T | True
T | F | False
F | T | True
F | F | True

Blue-Unicorns = F
God is creator of all = T

P = F
Q = T

P -> Q = True

P | Q | P -> Q
T | T | True
T | F | False
F | T | True <-------------- Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all
F | F | True

Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all = True.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Still, same problem, C>=0 permits 1,2,3,4,5,6,10,100,1000,10000, infinite gods. C>=0 permits polytheism.

Also, I missed it originally and editted my post. Maybe you didn't see it. C>=0 permits no God at all. C could be 0.



Sure!

?? Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all ??

Proposition "P" = Blue-Unicorns
Proposition "Q" = God is creator of all

Truth table for implication:

P | Q | P -> Q
T | T | True
T | F | False
F | T | True
F | F | True

Blue-Unicorns = F
God is creator of all = T

P = F
Q = T

P -> Q = True

P | Q | P -> Q
T | T | True
T | F | False
F | T | True <-------------- Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all
F | F | True

Blue-Unicorns -> God is creator of all = True.

And the relationship between Blue-unicorns and God is the Creator of all is what?

 

[dybmh]

And the relationship between Blue-unicorns and God is the Creator of all is what?

Implication does not have the tools for evaluating relevance. I know; it's stupid. That requires a different framework. Like I said, implication is the lowest standard for truth that exists. It doesn't actually prove anything.

If want to **prove** it for the purpose of persuasion, it needs to be a stronger standard for truth. The proof will need to be much more complicated and C must be forced to 1.

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

"C = 1" means "God crreated all things"

"C>=0" means "Maybe God created all things, or maybe multiple gods created all things, or maybe no God/gods exist at all"

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Implication does not have the tools for evaluating relevance. I know; it's stupid. That requires a different framework. Like I said, implication is the lowest standard for truth that exists. It doesn't actually prove anything.

If want to **prove** it for the purpose of persuasion, it needs to be a stronger standard for truth. The proof will need to be much more complicated and C must be forced to 1.



"C = 1" means "God crreated all things"

"C>=0" means "Maybe God created all things, or maybe multiple gods created all things, or maybe no God/gods exist at all"

It was not implication that I used but mathematical induction.
The other used the law of non-contradiction.

 

[dybmh]

@SavedByTheLord

Here, maybe this will help a little bit?

Material conditional - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

In order to show relevance, you'd need to do something like this:

The standard model theory for relevance logics is the Routley-Meyer ternary-relational semantics developed by Richard Routley and Robert Meyer. A Routley–Meyer frame F for a propositional language is a quadruple (W,R,*,0), where W is a non-empty set, R is a ternary relation on W, and * is a function from W to W, and 0 ∈ W. A Routley-Meyer model M is a Routley-Meyer frame F together with a valuation, ⊩, that assigns a truth value to each atomic proposition relative to each point a ∈ W​

Relevance logic - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I don't think it can be done because, if I understand, and I'm not a pro at this stuff, God would need to be a member of set W. That's impossible to show.

 

[dybmh]

It was not implication that I used but mathematical induction.

This is what you said:

n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

n>0 -> C>=0

-> is the logical notation for implication.

Induction would be using the equal sign.

---

Mathematical Induction is a technique of proving a statement, theorem or formula which is thought to be true, for each and every natural number n. By generalizing this in form of a principle which we would use to prove any mathematical statement is ‘Principle of Mathematical Induction‘.

For example: 13 +23 + 33 + ….. +n3 = (n(n+1) / 2)2, the statement is considered here as true for all the values of natural numbers.

Principle of Mathematical Induction | Introduction, Steps and Examples

Learn the principle of mathematical induction with solved examples from BYJU'S. Understand the concepts of Mathematical Induction Principle in detail here.

byjus.com

---

The other used the law of non-contradiction.

If you are intending to say: "It must be either true or false, it can't be both or that would be a contradiction". That's included in logical implication. If it cannot be proven false, it MUST be true. There is no "middle" option. That's the law of the excluded middle.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

So are you okay with the proof right up unto living things?

I have no idea what this question means or has to do with what I wrote.

Could your respond directly to what I wrote, please?

 

[SavedByTheLord]

I have no idea what this question means or has to do with what I wrote.

Could your respond directly to what I wrote, please?

Except your example uses only things we already know are man made.

Consider, a tree - by some order of magnitude - can be considered more complex even than a mobile phone, and yet your analogy doesn't propose that an individual may happen upon a tree and assume it was man-made. So, obviously, there must be something else - other than complexity - by which we determine an object to be man-made. In the case of your examples, we know cell phones and cities are man-made not because of some inherent quality of the object itself, but because we observe these things being made and can find no examples of them occurring in nature.

So, let's imagine instead an individual is walking in a forest and finds a cell phone. They assume, by the cell phone's composition, that it must be man-made. The individual continues walking in the forest and finds a tree, and from the branches of that tree they can see cell phones growing like fruit. Now, would it STILL be reasonable to assume the cell phone is man-made, or would it not be more reasonable to conclude that the cell phone may well have grown from this tree by some natural process?

See, your analogy fails because it has nothing to compare itself to. It assumes man-made objects are man-made, but makes no mention of how the distinction between a man-made and a non-man-made object is to be determined. It's simply a flimsy, poorly constructed false comparison.

For further illustration, consider if I were to hand you two objects, and I tell you (we will assume I am being absolutely truthful and you are somehow aware that what I am saying is true) that one of the objects is man-made and the other is not man-made. Without knowing exactly how either object was made, what function they serve, or what they are made out of, how could you possibly determine which is which?

I see your point but to keep with the MI proof, I stuck the just intelligently objects.
The cell phone has all the characteristics of a intelligently designed object. It has smootness, symmetry, functionality that if a person who never used one could easily discover. It also intricate.
And of course over 1 billion cells phones and trillions of other man made objects are intelligently created.

Now I stayed away from non-living, non-man made objects for 2 reasons. It is a bit harder to prove that they are intelligently designed and they are not needed for the proof.
The tree falls on the intelligently designed living things category. Its design characteristics dwarf the cell phone. So who made tree and did the tree make the cell phone or other objects.

Simple observation rules out both. And who made the intelligent creators of civilization?
Obviously an intelligent Creator whose intelligence and power dwarfs all of the above.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

The following proves that God Almighty is the Creator of all things.

Suppose that you had never seen a modern cell phone or knew of its existence. You find such a device. An examination of its incredible uses and how intricately it was made would prove the existence of the intelligent makers of that phone. Now consider a large modern city. There are very many cell phones in it and a huge host of other things and activities that make that city and its inhabitants function. An analysis of that city proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made, run, and function in that city. This is even more sure than just the cell phone. Now look at all of civilization. It consists of very many cell phones, many cities, and many other things. An analysis of that civilization proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made that civilization. This is even more sure than in the city example. Finally look at all living things in the world. The intricacies of living things (DNA, RNA, proteins, enzymes, organs, reproduction, the interconnected food chain etc) and their irreducible mutual complexity is way beyond anything that man has made and by an enormous amount. All people have done so far is try to understand how living things work and even now are just scratching the surface. Thus, an examination of all living things and how they interact with the rest of the creation proves the existence of Almighty God the Creator of all things. And this surety is way beyond than even the civilization example. So, here is yet another irrefutable proof that God Almighty, the Creator exists and the He created all things.

Thus, the enormity of the following less winded statement as found in the Bible should be clearly apparent to all the world.

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: - Rom 1:19-20

Since this wisdom, written about 2000 years ago, comes from the word of God, it proves the Bible is the true word of God. There are many things which prove the Bible is the true word of God. Now the Bible predicted that knowledge shall be increased in the last days. But with all the great advances in biology, the passage in Romans 19-20 has not only withstood the scrutiny of science but has been immensely verified by it.

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. – Daniel 12:4

This proof uses mathematical induction. Thus, the proof is irrefutable.
n = intelligently designed objects.
n=1 is just one cell phon, an intelligently designed object
n=k is many cell phones and all other intelligently designed objects.
n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

this is the second irrefutable proof that God created all things.

 

[dybmh]

this is the second irrefutable proof that God created all things.

You ignored what I wrote! Why is that? At the very least the last line needs to be adjusted.

C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

This ^^ says the number of intelligent creators could be 0. Zero. Zip. Nada. Nothing. Empty. Vacuous. Void. Missing in Action.

"C>=0" means "Maybe God created all things, or maybe multiple gods created all things, or maybe no God/gods exist at all"

This simple fact refutes your so-called irrefutable proof. What say you?

 

[SavedByTheLord]

You ignored what I wrote! Why is that? At the very least the last line needs to be adjusted.



This ^^ says the number of intelligent creators could be 0. Zero. Zip. Nada. Nothing. Empty. Vacuous. Void. Missing in Action.



This simple fact refutes your so-called irrefutable proof. What say you?

You are correct I did make an error. My mistake. It should say C>0. Thanks for pointing that out.
So with the correction in mind, can you refute it?

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

The following proves that God Almighty is the Creator of all things.

Suppose that you had never seen a modern cell phone or knew of its existence. You find such a device. An examination of its incredible uses and how intricately it was made would prove the existence of the intelligent makers of that phone. Now consider a large modern city. There are very many cell phones in it and a huge host of other things and activities that make that city and its inhabitants function. An analysis of that city proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made, run, and function in that city. This is even more sure than just the cell phone. Now look at all of civilization. It consists of very many cell phones, many cities, and many other things. An analysis of that civilization proves the existence of the intelligent beings that made that civilization. This is even more sure than in the city example. Finally look at all living things in the world. The intricacies of living things (DNA, RNA, proteins, enzymes, organs, reproduction, the interconnected food chain etc) and their irreducible mutual complexity is way beyond anything that man has made and by an enormous amount. All people have done so far is try to understand how living things work and even now are just scratching the surface. Thus, an examination of all living things and how they interact with the rest of the creation proves the existence of Almighty God the Creator of all things. And this surety is way beyond than even the civilization example. So, here is yet another irrefutable proof that God Almighty, the Creator exists and the He created all things.

Thus, the enormity of the following less winded statement as found in the Bible should be clearly apparent to all the world.

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: - Rom 1:19-20

Since this wisdom, written about 2000 years ago, comes from the word of God, it proves the Bible is the true word of God. There are many things which prove the Bible is the true word of God. Now the Bible predicted that knowledge shall be increased in the last days. But with all the great advances in biology, the passage in Romans 19-20 has not only withstood the scrutiny of science but has been immensely verified by it.

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. – Daniel 12:4

This proof uses mathematical induction. Thus, the proof is irrefutable.
n = intelligently designed objects.
n=1 is just one cell phon, an intelligently designed object
n=k is many cell phones and all other intelligently designed objects.
n>0 -> C>=0 where C is the number of intelligent creators.

The proof should have on the last line C>0.
My mistake.

 

[Revoltingest]

I like how irrefutable things are so often easily refuted.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I like how irrefutable things are so often easily refuted.

I can't refute that.