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Are Churchs of God or of Man's Invention

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
Acts 2:47 *Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 2:47 indicates if you are not added to the church Christ is building then you are in the wrong one.

Ephesians 4:4 *There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 *One Lord, one faith, one baptism,


That is what God says and man's religion's states there are hundreds of churches, more than one baptism with many hopes with more than one spirit. Is God wrong or is man wrong? What to you think and can you prove it from scripture or are we our own God when we go by our private opinions with little or no scripture? Or w we walk in God's word that would be paramount to walking by correct faith?

Tomlane
 

ChristineES

Tiggerism
Premium Member
I believe that the Church is the body of the followers of Yeshua (Jesus), no matter the denominations they attend to or what building they worship in.
 

Bishadi

Active Member
Acts 2:47 *Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 2:47 indicates if you are not added to the church Christ is building then you are in the wrong one.
kind of like the evolution of knowledge.

That unless each are contributing to the truth of life, then they taking from everyone else.

Ephesians 4:4 *There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 *One Lord, one faith, one baptism,


just like there is only ONE tree of life

and only ONE way it all works

That is what God says and man's religion's states there are hundreds of churches, more than one baptism with many hopes with more than one spirit. Is God wrong or is man wrong? What to you think and can you prove it from scripture or are we our own God when we go by our private opinions with little or no scripture? Or w we walk in God's word that would be paramount to walking by correct faith?

Tomlane

the faiths all share be honest, no false witness, don't act of self over compassion for others. These can be found equally in most all beliefs.

Truth and being absolutely honest should be the first premise of all of mankind; equally.

From there, the pursuit of truth (the understanding of God (existence)) allows the church (knowledge) to evolve. As by now all should know we are of the same 'tree of life'............

And the easiest method of leveling the playing field is by 'honesty' and with that, the mention that 'all words are the creation of mankind.'

Then from there, build the foundations for the children (tomorrow/our future/our very lives).

my opinion
 

Karl R

Active Member
Acts 2:47 indicates if you are not added to the church Christ is building then you are in the wrong one.
First, this verse doesn't say what you claim it's saying. It says the Lord added to the church. It doesn't discuss the whether any particular church is "right" or "wrong".

Second, this describes a period of time when all of the christians were located in one place, they met in houses, they had no traditions, and they had no professional clergy. The meaning of the word "church" has changed considerably from the time this was written.

are we our own God when we go by our private opinions with little or no scripture.
The passage from Acts describes a time before the gospels or the letters were written. They had no scripture whatsoever. Are you claiming they were their own god?

Or w we walk in God's word that would be paramount to walking by correct faith?
Given that you're reinterpreting those passages to mean things they don't actually say, I hope (for your sake as well as mine) that there's a bit more flexibility than your claiming.
 

ayani

member
that's an excellent question. and from what i've seen, heard, and read Scripturally, i would conclude that it's generally men who create churches, denominations, and schisms.

looking back over much of Christian history, it's interesting to see how often new churches were formed on the basis of squabbles over human leadership, authority, or titles. or over points of theology so arguably minute that Scripture doesn't even go into detail concerning them.

it is also true that many churches respect the traditions of men within their church rather than look to the Gospels to see what the Lord has to say regarding a certain issue. simply because something is traditional or appeals to people, doesn't mean that it's Christian (as in Christ-taught and demonstrated).

the head of every believer should be the Son of God- we are called to believe on Him, and be His disciples in the world. He is risen, knowable, eternal, and exalted above all men. for this reason, i personally have trouble with those churches that insist on recognizing human authority or a specific line of succession in order to be fully or correctly Christian. it is His grace and our recognition and love Christ which make us Christian- no human being can do that for us.

Christians are called to honor the Son, obey His words, share His Good News, and reflect Him for the honor and glory of God the Father. we are called to love God with all our heart and soul and might, and love our neighbor as ourselves.

it's not a bad thing that there are many churches- and unity does not have to mean uniformity. a church is supposed to be a gathering of believers. many Christians and also non-Christians would be wise to bring to mind Jesus' own words and attitude in Mark 9:38-40.

Acts 2:47 *Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 2:47 indicates if you are not added to the church Christ is building then you are in the wrong one.

Ephesians 4:4 *There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 *One Lord, one faith, one baptism,


That is what God says and man's religion's states there are hundreds of churches, more than one baptism with many hopes with more than one spirit. Is God wrong or is man wrong? What to you think and can you prove it from scripture or are we our own God when we go by our private opinions with little or no scripture? Or w we walk in God's word that would be paramount to walking by correct faith?

Tomlane
 

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
Ayani I agree with all that you replied with except for your last statement:

it's not a bad thing that there are many churches- and unity does not have to mean uniformity. a church is supposed to be a gathering of believers. many Christians and also non-Christians would be wise to bring to mind Jesus' own words and attitude in Mark 9:38-40.

First of all you sated its not a bad thing there are many churches. Yet verse 5 in Ephesians 4 states there is one faith and never does it say, the faith of your choice.

Also I believe God has made it very clear in his word that believers are to be unified and not divided as man's religions divide believers today and then they worship with unbelievers that are mixed in with them.

1 Corinthians 1:10 *¶Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

Romans 16:17 *¶Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
18 *For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.


Today, churches have different doctrines and cannot speak the same things as God has directed, thus that makes them anti Christ and not pro Christ. These churches are filled with tradition and false doctrines by confusing the church that is Christ's body with the Kingdom Christ was offering to Israel. Some think theses churches are a new Israel by injecting water baptism, and other ordinances with grace. God says we worship in spirit and not to have confidence in our flesh for worshiping the Lord as one does when obeying ordinances.

Philippians 3:3 *For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the
flesh.


In one sense you are very correct in stating there has to be many churches and God has said the same thing. Many churches instead of one constitutes Heresy for heresy means:Any opinions or doctrines at variance with the official or orthodox position.

So many churches certainly can't have the right doctrine or if they did there would only be one faith and not the faith of your choice, that brings forth the fruit of Heresy and heresy is a fruit of the flesh. Gal. 5:20

1 Corinthians 11:19 *For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Another misconception I believe most people have today is in thinking a church as a temple of God or part of the body of Christ. God says the believer is the church and our body is his holy temple.
1 Peter 2:5 *Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
6 *Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.


Believers are living stones and Christ is the chief corner stone and a stumbling block to those who are guilty of heresy. Thus those who walk in the unity of the spirit and the bond of peace are those who will be manifested or made known by God as stated in 1 Corinthians 11:19

Also I'm completely at a loss as to what you were referring to in Mark 9:38-40 so does that refer to this subject? I'm curious to know your thinking on that one. thanks.

Tomlane
 

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
No one can join the church Christ is building unless the Lord is the one who adds a person to it. Anyone who is born again {spiritually} That is immediately upon the Holy Spirit dwelling in a believers body, they are born again.

This is a spiritual operation of God.

Colossians 2:12 *Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

23 *Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Romans 8:9 *But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 *¶And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 *But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.


Man adds members by stating, join the church of your choice or people becomes members of a particular church or sect because their family raised them in it. All who have memberships in man's denominations loose their membership when they leave that particular church by joining another one, or upon their death and a few become so disillusioned from the hypocrisy found in many sects and denominations they remove themselves from religion and from God. I have seen this mostly in the charismatic movement, a relative newcomer to religion that began with Mother Rome. Please see the history of the Pentecostal church that got its beginning in California during the first of the last century around 1901 or 1902.

Since Christ adds the members to His Church means there are no unsaved in it and never will one be found in it. This is why the Lord has stated that the gates of hell will not prevail against His church. Matthew 16:18

This why through Paul, Christ has commanded believers not to fellowship with the unsaved, yet denominations completely ignore this command.

2 Corinthians 6:14 *Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

I hope that might answer your question.

Tomlane
 

Charity

Let's go racing boys !
I believe that when God spoke of the "church" he was referring to the believers as the church themselves not referring to a building....
 

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
Charity, Bingo! According to God's word you are 100% correct. Glad to see you read your bible.

Thanks, Tomlane :clap
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Tomlane,

Are Churchs of God or of Man's Invention

Am responding to this thread as it is in the general section and not christianity and that too taking all places of worship including churches, temples, synagogues etc.

Humans have developed the concept of god.
This concept of god is not of any person but it is the ENERGY that pervades all that we see and do not see including our own selves.
Merging of the individual energy with that of the universal energy is the goal of all religions devised by people who did merge and they did do in a particular WAY and so religions are just various ways or paths by which one can merge.
Prayer is one such way which has found a place in all religions and so humans have created places of worship in different religions.
When one prays, ones mind is focused on only one thought and a time comes when there is a gap or braek in the thoughts and that which when the merging takes place.
As many people visits the places of worship and with only one or no thoughts the place aquires a special vibration and this craetes a conducive environment for evryone to immediately get in that groove of one or no-thought very quickly.
That is the significance of all places of worship, be the churches or temples or any other.
Love & rgds
 

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
Zenzero, thank you for your opinion. I can appreciate and understand your reasoning.

One thing that doesn't fit in with your human mind and reasoning is that God's word, not religion as known today was inspired by God to men. The scriptures to an honest believer is given the spirit of error. {1 John 4:6 *We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.} The reason a believer is blessed with the spirit of error and truth is because a believer is given the mind of Christ. {1 Corinthians 2:16 *For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.} The reason our natural thinking can't get it right such as you have demonstrated in your reply is because God says {Romans 8:7 *Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.} Now so you won't think I'm insulting you by stating you were doing your thinking with a carnal mind is because God says we all have one in our natural state for we are all under sin. That is carnality. So that is why we all need to be born again from God. {1 Peter 1:23 *Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever}

To be born again one must accept Christ's free gift of eternal life.

Isaiah 64:6 *¶But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Galatians 3:24 *Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Galatians 3:11 *But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Galatians 2:16 *Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Romans 5:9 *Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Romans 5:15 *But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

Romans 5:16 *And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

Romans 5:18 *Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.


I sure do agree with you on one point that man has devised many religions and all have been either based on the bible or the general vein of philosophy that is derived from the bible such as the Mormonism, Scientology, Jehovah Witnesses and all the other cults you can think of that have own ways that all comes from the bible including the Koran. But the bible is the only one that has life to it that it proves itself and it goes beyond religion but for those who are born again, it is real for them when one is born again they experience a weight taken from them when their sins are forgiven and the joy they have from having a living relationship with God. But you can't know that or experience it until you put your complete trust in God's plan for you and every being on the earth. Then one's trust is what draws God to a man and he becomes born again and all just from believing God only.

I hope the above may be a help.

Tomlane
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Tomlane,
Thank you for your response.
However, please understand that Jesus was born only 2000 years ago while human beings appeared on earth much long before him and conceived the god concept thereafter.
The intention is not to hurt your sensitivities but just to bring about certain awareness besides accpet Jesus as an elder brother.
Love & rgds
 

Tomlane

Saved_Sinner
Thank you for your honest reply and I appreciate that very much as I will do the same in kind.

Zenzero, I have no idea how familiar you are with scripture and I don't even know if you accept God's word as being given to men from God or not. If not then going further with this a waste of time for the both of us. However if you are searching then God will show you his truth and you will know it in your heart. The following scriptures are proof that Jesus Christ is Jehovah or that part of God that has always been who is called the Son of God. His coming was foretold many years before he came. His coming and being born of a virgin was part of the proof God gave as proof to unbelieving Israel that Christ was their promised Messiah. When God came in the flesh He knew He would be rejected by Israel and God used that rejection to bring grace to both Jew and gentile without the works of the law to establish a relationship with both. Christ who was and is God was still alive but resurrected from hell back life to from his three days in the deepest parts of hell. Christ has the keys to hell and the power over death and he proved that by having the Father raise him from hell back to life. This same saving power will be used to redeemed all that have put their trust in Christ and will be raised from the grave one day.

Another name Christ has is Emanuel, meaning God with us.

Matthew 1:23 *Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

John 1:1 *¶In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 *The same was in the beginning with God.
3 *All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 *In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 *¶And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
6 *There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
7 *The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
8 *He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
9 *That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
10 *He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 *He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12 *But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 *Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
14 *And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
15 *¶John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
16 *And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.



Christ also referred to Himself as the I am That means he has no beginning.

Luke 22:67 *Art thou the Christ? tell us. And he said unto them, If I tell you, ye will not believe:
68 *And if I also ask you, ye will not answer me, nor let me go.
69 *Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.
70 *Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.
71 *And they said, What need we any further witness? for we ourselves have heard of his own mouth.


Zenzero, will you be a believer or an unbeliever like the unbelievers of old? And if an unbeliever that makes God a liar.

1 John 5:10 *¶He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

Matthew 22:31 *But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
32 *I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
33 *And when the multitude heard this, they were astonished at his doctrine.
34 *¶But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together.
35 *Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
36 *Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 *Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 *This is the first and great commandment.
39 *And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 *On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
41 *¶While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them,
42 *Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The Son of David.
43 *He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
44 *The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
45 *If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?
46 *And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.


Thanks again for your comments, Tomlane
 

rusra02

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Jesus made it clear there would be many who would falsely claim to follow him: "Not everyone saying to me , 'Lord, Lord' , will enter into the kingdom...Many will say to me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expell demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name? ' And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew you. Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness."
Matthew 7:21-23
In verses 15-18, Jesus made it clear how to identify which religion is true. By the fruit the tree bears.

What is true religion's fruitage or works?
  • They base their teachings on the Bible (2 Timothy 3:16,17)
  • They worship only Jehovah, as Jesus did (Matthew 4:10)
  • They show genuine, unselfish love for all (John 13:35) True christians do not kill one others because of national or ethnic differences (1 John 3:10-12)
  • They accept Jesus Christ as God's means of salvation (Acts 4:12)
  • They are no part of the world (John 18:36)
  • They preach God's kingdom as mankind's only hope (Matthew 24:14, Daniel 2:44)
Which religion produces these good works and others? As for the others, the Bible
says "They publicly declare they know God, but they disown him by their works, because they are detestable and disobedient, and not approved for good work of any sort. (Titus 1:16)
 
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