Are Classrooms Necessary?

[PureX]

Two of the most amazing young people I've ever become aware of were home-schooled. And according them, it was an excellent method of gaining an education. Both of them completed their GED requirements by the age of 15 and both of them had multiple interests and participation in groups with other kids, through those interests.

To be fair, however, they also had two parents who were highly supportive, very creative, and totally involved in the raising of their kids. It was clearly a holistic endeavor where "school" was an ongoing, all-the-time, daily process that involved mixing individual creative activities with standard info.-in/testing-out curriculum. And I think the amazing results that were achieved were probably unique to these individuals, and to the very loving and supportive family unit they created for themselves. Not everyone would be nearly so fortunate.

So I guess the answer is that we shouldn't be looking at it as a one-size-fits-all solution. Some kids would thrive in a home-school environment, while others would be destroyed by their idiotic, over-bearing parents. Some would thrive in a collective school setting while others will be destroyed by the over-reliance of regiment, the bullying, the general neglect, or whatever else.

Our kids deserve better than this. But of course we all must serve the rich, and we just can't take the time or spend the money giving our children what they deserve in terms of an education because the rich just aren't rich enough, yet.

 

[Nakosis]

Children need interaction with peers, schooling in groups gives that interaction. The social benefits of this are long term

Not all children live in an environment conducive to learning, getting away from the strife of home life for a few hours per day, and unto a controlled learning environment, a great benefit.

It has been recorded in several countries during the current lockdowns that domestic violence has increased dramatically. Avoiding violence is yet another good reason for getting out of the house and into a school.

And, as a parent with 3 kids, admittedly only doing 1 hour official education via tv and contacting their respective teachers by email regarding what they can study on line. I can assure you, a home environment is not the place to be schooled, there are far to many distractions.

They could skype in, everyone accounted for. Assignments can be done directly, interactively. I'm not talking about studying online, I'm talking about an interactive class online. The education would be able to monitor audio and video of what was going on at home in realtime. The technology is already here. Just implementation will big a big hurdle.

 

[Rival]

You're making claims you can't possibly support with evidence.

People of all ages will interact in the future as they always have. They just won't do it while crowed into confined spaces.

Take a look at the effect of online dating. People are meeting others who live near them and have a much better chance of matching up than they ever did. It's a huge part of today's social scene.

Except it's not.

Fewer people are in relationships now. Fewer people are having regular sex. Fewer people are marrying and having children. I mean people under 30; people who usually do this kind of thing really well are just not doing it anymore. The rise of the 'incel' movement is not from nowhere. A lot of people have choice overload where, because of online dating, they fail to commit and settle because they are convinced they can meet someone better in a few clicks

People simply are not interacting the way they used to. Kids are not going out and even when many of them do, they are still on their phones or tablets.

 

[exchemist]

Yes, many of my classes were unimaginably dull and depressing, but that mainly depended on the teacher. There were a few "interactive" teachers but not really many. Plenty of lively minds online, take the RF for example.

And plenty of sad madmen too, or perhaps you hadn't noticed those.

 

[ChristineM]

They could skype in, everyone accounted for. Assignments can be done directly, interactively. I'm not talking about studying online, I'm talking about an interactive class online. The education would be able to monitor audio and video of what was going on at home in realtime. The technology is already here. Just implementation will big a big hurdle.

Skype or similar does not address and of the real life problems I've listed.

 

[Nakosis]

Of course the education aspect is necessary; that's where kids learn constructive criticism best, as well as sharing ideas, learning to partner with people they don't like, being exposed to different views and so on.

Which all can now be done interactively online.

Isn't that what we are doing now?

 

[Nakosis]

And plenty of sad madmen too, or perhaps you hadn't noticed those.

Yes, madmen everywhere.

 

[Rival]

Which all can now be done interactively online.

Isn't that what we are doing now?

People don't learn well online. Have you seen how well debates on RF go? They're absolutely nothing like moderated classroom debates that teach actual debate skills and decorum. In order to fully engage, one needs to be able to see body language, hear tone of voice, and generally use the senses to fully appreciate the other person's argument and style, and therefore engage with it.

 

[Rational Agnostic]

No it would be a disaster and unimaginably dull and depressing for the students. We would breed a generation of badly educated social misfits. There is no substitute for learning with other lively minds. And in early days especially, a lot of what school does is teach children how to be civilised and caring members of society.

Hmmm. I was homeschooled/online schooled from 2nd grade through twelfth grade. But perhaps you're right. Maybe that explains why I am the way I am (a cautionary tale).

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Our kids deserve better than this. But of course we all must serve the rich, and we just can't take the time or spend the money giving our children what they deserve in terms of an education because the rich just aren't rich enough, yet.

I'm all for wealth disparity being so little an issue that every family has the choice for one person to stay at home. But staying home out of spite for the man won't put food in their bellies. Unless we add the rich to the menu, anyway.

 

[Nakosis]

Skype or similar does not address and of the real life problems I've listed.

Well there's more than Skype but I disagree, you're not seeing the broad scope of possibilities IMO.

So they are hopefully safe at school, they still have to go home. No one sees what happens behind closed doors. A temporary reprieve instead of a permanent solution is all you are looking for?

 

[ChristineM]

Well there's more than Skype but I disagree, you're not seeing the broad scope of possibilities IMO.

So they are hopefully safe at school, they still have to go home. No one sees what happens behind closed doors. A temporary reprieve instead of a permanent solution is all you are looking for?

I can see th economics,i can also see the disadvantages of social retardation and increased child abuse.

I thing what could be a 25 to 33% increased in child abuse a very good reason to scupper the home school idea

 

[joe1776]

Except it's not.

Fewer people are in relationships now. Fewer people are having regular sex. Fewer people are marrying and having children. I mean people under 30; people who usually do this kind of thing really well are just not doing it anymore.

Am I right in assuming that (a) In your opinion, all these changes for the worse and not for the better? And (b)They are all due to the Internet and have nothing to do with other societal factors?

The rise of the 'incel' movement is not from nowhere. A lot of people have choice overload where, because of online dating, they fail to commit and settle because they are convinced they can meet someone better in a few clicks

And you assume that having more choices is a general disadvantage for people seeking mates?

People simply are not interacting the way they used to. Kids are not going out and even when many of them do, they are still on their phones or tablets.

Should I just take your word that these are widespread problems or is there data to support the claims?

 

[Nakosis]

I can see th economics,i can also see the disadvantages of social retardation and increased child abuse.

I thing what could be a 25 to 33% increased in child abuse a very good reason to scupper the home school idea

Do you have a link to a study on this?
Parents and their children needing a break for each other? Do you think the current stay at home orders is increasing child abuse? It's certainly something we should address.

 

[joe1776]

People don't learn well online. Have you seen how well debates on RF go? They're absolutely nothing like moderated classroom debates that teach actual debate skills and decorum. In order to fully engage, one needs to be able to see body language, hear tone of voice, and generally use the senses to fully appreciate the other person's argument and style, and therefore engage with it.

Posters on RF don't know how to debate because it was never taught to them as part of their education. It could be taught online by experts giving video demonstrations.

 

[Rival]

Am I right in assuming that (a) In your opinion, all these changes for the worse and not for the better? And (b)They are all due to the Internet and have nothing to do with other societal factors?

They are worse because they create sexually frustrated people and failing marriages, unstable for children.

Of course there may be other societal factors; parents refusing to let their kids play outside is causing huge problems.

And you assume that having more choices is a general disadvantage for people seeking mates?

It is. As I already said, it leads to more casual hookups and less family-building and long term planning, because a new partner is just a click away if you really want it. Knowing that you can just find someone else online everytime you have a little tiff leads to just what you think it would - people not learning how to overcome relationship obstacles and instead just picking someone else.

Should I just take your word that these are widespread problems or is there data to support the claims?

7 Reasons Why Young People Are Having Less Sex

The Curious Ways Dating Apps Make It Harder to Find Love

Forever alone? More than half of young Americans don’t have a ‘steady partner,’ a record high

The data may seem counter-intuitive at a time when dating feels more accessible than ever as a result of the proliferation of apps. In 2017, four in 10 singles had met their most recent first date on the internet, more than those who met “through a friend” or “at a bar” combined, according to results from the Singles in America survey, a Match.com-sponsored survey of 5,000 people nationwide.

But the relative speed of finding a potential partner right at your fingertips apparently hasn’t translated to a higher overall percentage of young people in committed relationships. In fact, the data may illustrate that a greater number of people have multiple love interests, none of whom is a “steady partner.”

 

[ChristineM]

Do you have a link to a study on this?
Parents and their children needing a break for each other? Do you think the current stay at home orders is increasing child abuse? It's certainly something we should address.

Yes domestic abuse including child abuse has risen considerably since the lockdowns began...

Domestic abuse calls 'up 25% since lockdown'

UN chief decries 'horrifying' rise in domestic violence amid virus lockdown

Opinion | The Coronavirus Could Cause a Child Abuse Epidemic

 

[Rival]

Posters on RF don't know how to debate because it was never taught to them as part of their education. It could be taught online by experts giving video demonstrations.

It was taught to me. It was taught to Sunstone. It was taught to many people.

It's the fact that debating online lacks the human factor.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Kids need social interaction, not more screentime.

That. That alone. That is a must.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Also quite a few households are not happy places. Getting out to school gives children somewhere else safe and loving to go.

For some of us home wasn't happy and school was hell.