• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Are madrassas injecting hatred and breeding terrorists?

Status
Not open for further replies.
RAYYAN

RAYYAN

Proud Muslim
outhouse said:
I don't know. I see it as yes and no. For the most part peaceful, but it was originally spread by the sword, and many followers today have a huge problem interpreting this poorly turning it into violence.

I think for me, it is safe to say it wants to be peaceful, but with no central organization or control, many are running wild perverting its teaching.
Click to expand...
If you say Islam is a violent religion you have to show me where in the Quran you see that, if you say Muslims are violent I can agree with you. and the thing about Islam was spread by the sword, I can't really understand that, How is that possible? if I hold a sword on the neck of a person and force him to accept Islam, Is he really a Muslim! or I am just cheating myself? Islam was not spread by the sword
 
outhouse

outhouse

Atheistically
RAYYAN said:
If you say Islam is a violent religion you have to show me where in the Quran you see that,
Click to expand...

I know there are roughly 90% peaceful verses. The rest not so much.

I do agree the people perverting the core message is the problem. I understand the violent verses are not central or core teachings. But they are there.


RAYYAN said:
and the thing about Islam was spread by the sword, I can't really understand that, How is that possible?
Click to expand...

Without war, it would not have spread like it did. People at war, with this belief, took over that whole area and demanded conversion.

Even witnessed a documentary posted by a muslim on "nat geo" PBS that opened with a how a peaceful religion was spread by the sword.
 
RAYYAN

RAYYAN

Proud Muslim
outhouse said:
I know there are roughly 90% peaceful verses. The rest not so much.

I do agree the people perverting the core message is the problem. I understand the violent verses are not central or core teachings. But they are there.
Click to expand...
Well, We can analyze those 10% to see if they are really violent. list them



outhouse said:
Without war, it would not have spread like it did. People at war, with this belief, took over that whole area and demanded conversion.

Even witnessed a documentary posted by a muslim on "nat geo" PBS that opened with a how a peaceful religion was spread by the sword.
Click to expand...
Again, How can a person force another to accept Islam! it is a personal convection not a matter of choice
 
outhouse

outhouse

Atheistically
RAYYAN said:
Well, We can analyze those 10% to see if they are really violent. list them
Click to expand...

It wont matter. Good muslims like you don't have a problem interpreting them correctly. But you know muslism fight over how to interpret, and sadly there is no "one way is right"
 
oldbadger

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
RAYYAN said:
there is no such verse I am aware of
Click to expand...
Are there not several verses that incite the believers to violence against infidels? Just one......
  1. The Quran's Verses of Violence - The Religion of Peace
    Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Timequran/023-violence.htm
    Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".
Having said that, the worst terror attacks in Britain over the last 40 years, The bombing of the Government cabinet in Brighton, the mortar attack on our Prime Minister's official home in Whitehall, the Guildford bombing (I heard it), the Brighton Bombing, the hungerford massacre, the Dunblaine massacre..... none of these atrocities were perpetrated by Muslims.

But we are having difficulties with Muslim schools straying away from our standard education programme and treatment of children, and this is going to be addressed strongly. We're not going to sit back and wait for any more trouble..... :)
 
morphesium

morphesium

Active Member
oldbadger said:
Yes...... to all your post, not just the above.

I notice that juvenile marriage has entered the thread, and that some members push culture as the cause of this, over religion. That is what they were trying to do on the education-pressure thread last year, but that has been shown to be a false flag, in the UK, anyway.
Click to expand...

Thank you.


Those (juvenile marriage) posts did show me how sinister and mean people can be because of religion while claiming that they keep morally high(est) standards. They are a shame, not just for Muslims, but for mankind itself.



oldbadger said:
I once worked with a British-born Muslim of Pakistani descent. When his daughter was about 8yrs he flew to Pakistan and arranged her future marriage. On his return he boasted of the deal he had made and how much money he would gain from giving his daughter's hand in marriage to a very rich Pakistani man's son, who would then have the opportunity of coming to the UK. He supported his actions (when criticised by colleagues) on the basis that it was his duty to Islam to increase the Muslim congregation in his area, (Wembley).
Click to expand...


It shows how deep rooted brainwashing is. I believe that government/people should take the situation more seriously. Give them time, and they will spread terror anywhere and everywhere.


I happened to know two Muslims, who won’t listen to music, saying it’s forbidden. Their mobile phones are full of Arabic prayers or preachings (are they?), but there isn’t a single movie clip or song or anything for entertainment. They say that they have deep desire to listen to good songs, but if they resist listening/hearing, they could listen to much more beautiful songs, songs with unimaginable beauty after they die.


I once even asked one of them about suicidal bombings - that it kills innocent victims, even children, and this was his reply – “Those kids go to heaven directly. They will be like pearls in heaven. In fact, after they die, those kids will thank the bomber for his act that gave him/her direct entry to heaven”. For him, genetics, theory of evolution and all scientific achievements made no sense at all. I felt bad, really bad. I couldn't convince him anything. I felt like - one of us is an alien.


It is the nature of Science to correct itself or to make it more right. It has saved more lives than any religion did. It has served us more than any religion did. Because of this and since we owe much to science, I believe that the government and people should consider religious teachings that go against the well established scientific rules and principles equivalent to blasphemy itself.



oldbadger said:
Charities are advertising on television for funds to aid children brides, and their pleas make strong mention of the girls who die in childbirth because of their young age. The UK web shows a few charities which are devoted to helping this situation, but I don't know how they can, honestly.
Click to expand...

Neither do I. There are good guys everywhere. I only hope the good people in Saudi Arabia (the epitome of Muslim world) could influence the religious heads to take action so as to stop child marriages and check terrorism that is occurring on account of their religion in other parts of the world.

Hoping for a change
Best regards.

 
DawudTalut

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Peace be on all.

[3:150] O ye who believe! if you obey those who have disbelieved, they will cause you to turn back on your heels, and you will become losers.

[3:151] Nay, Allah is your Protector, and He is the Best of helpers.

[3:152] We shall strike terror into the hearts of those that have disbelieved because they associate partners with Allah for which He has sent down no authority. Their abode is the Fire; and evil is the habitation of the wrongdoers.

The Holy Quran Arabic text with Translation in English text and Search Engine - Al Islam Online

The Holy Quran
 
RAYYAN

RAYYAN

Proud Muslim
oldbadger said:
Are there not several verses that incite the believers to violence against infidels? Just one......
  1. The Quran's Verses of Violence - The Religion of Peace
    Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Timequran/023-violence.htm
    Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".
Having said that, the worst terror attacks in Britain over the last 40 years, The bombing of the Government cabinet in Brighton, the mortar attack on our Prime Minister's official home in Whitehall, the Guildford bombing (I heard it), the Brighton Bombing, the hungerford massacre, the Dunblaine massacre..... none of these atrocities were perpetrated by Muslims.

But we are having difficulties with Muslim schools straying away from our standard education programme and treatment of children, and this is going to be addressed strongly. We're not going to sit back and wait for any more trouble..... :)
Click to expand...
Quran 3:151 is talking about battle of Badr during the fighting, God promised the believers that He will insteel fear in the hearts of the enemy, so where is the violence here?

also note that on this battle, the people of Quraish came out and attacked the Muslims
 
Last edited:
C

Christian20

Member
Smart_Guy said:
I understand. Sorry if I misunderstood you.

It is the misunderstanding and misuse of what the Prophet's heritage. The same heritage that says those details also say that Muhammad and mother Aisha, or probably in this context we should care about mother Aisha only, loved each other for real. She played games with him, joked and laughed with him, never looked at another man, had him hugged when he was dying, and finally cried for him when he died. I'm saying this not to justify marriage of little girls, which I still don't approve of, I'm just saying it to clarify that their relationship was not as bad as some people could think because of that marriage. We do not know what was the mental and physical maturity at that time, for example, or we do not know for sure if that information was correct too. Or maybe the case was different with the Prophet, who knows.

I got off-topic, sorry about that.

My message to Muslims is to not follow anything blindly. We need to connect things together, to compare life then and now, to be considerate, to adopt...

Best regards.
Click to expand...

Ahh that's okay!!
And yes i understand but in my opinion it is just not right. A child deserves to be a child. Children need to enjoy life and feel free and have no worries. Even if her mental and physical was mature enough she still deserves to be a child. And turning her into a housewife is not right. And you said "we do not know if that information was correct too" but it's written in the Quran, so that could be that other things might not be correct, right?

Yes i agree we all should just accept each other. Eventhough the Quran might say that Muslims can't befriend an unbeliever, that should ring a bell that it's impossible for God to not want his childeren to be friends and love eachother.
I really hope that one day we all can!:)

God bless!
 
S

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
Christian20 said:
Ahh that's okay!!
And yes i understand but in my opinion it is just not right. A child deserves to be a child. Children need to enjoy life and feel free and have no worries. Even if her mental and physical was mature enough she still deserves to be a child. And turning her into a housewife is not right. And you said "we do not know if that information was correct too" but it's written in the Quran, so that could be that other things might not be correct, right?

Yes i agree we all should just accept each other. Eventhough the Quran might say that Muslims can't befriend an unbeliever, that should ring a bell that it's impossible for God to not want his childeren to be friends and love eachother.
I really hope that one day we all can!:)

God bless!
Click to expand...

The quote feature is kinda weird here, so I'll use the rainbow approach (I mean using colors :)). I'll color the part of your post and reply to it in the same color. A Christian member here taught me this trick :)

As far as I know no other details are mentioned like her being a housewife. What really happened could be nothing at all. Times from then and now are probably different. It is hard to even imagine, I believe. I also mentioned that they played with each other. In Islamic heritage, they once had a race and she won, then had a rematch then he won. Her explanation was because she gained weight :)

What I know is that it is not written in the Quran, but in Hadeeth. Hadeeth is not perfect and we do not it is protected like the Quran. There are actual controversies in the age of mother Aisha. Some even believe she was 16 at the time of marriage. But either ways, that marriage was not a problem as I explained before.

Further to the above paragraph, yup, in Hadeeth!

Actually, it is the complete opposite. Since you said you read the Quran, I thought you already knew about it. An example is verse 8 of chapter 60 (Al Mumtahinah) where it says that God does not forbid us from being friendly and just, to those who do not wish us harm, which generalizes all people no matter what their religions are. Prophet Muhammad also answered to invitations from Jews and had a Jewish neighbor he visited when he (the neighbor) got sick. God does want all people regardless to their beliefs to come to know each other. An example for that from the Quran is verse 13 of chapter 49 (Al Hujurat) that tell us that God created up of many different tribes and peoples for use to get acquainted to each other. Since you know Arabic, you can refer to that in its original form. This is actually what I'm doing here. I'm making friends from different religions and backgrounds :)

I say that Islam is not what you think it is. Please reconsider :)
 
C

Christian20

Member
Smart_Guy said:
The quote feature is kinda weird here, so I'll use the rainbow approach (I mean using colors :)). I'll color the part of your post and reply to it in the same color. A Christian member here taught me this trick :)

As far as I know no other details are mentioned like her being a housewife. What really happened could be nothing at all. Times from then and now are probably different. It is hard to even imagine, I believe. I also mentioned that they played with each other. In Islamic heritage, they once had a race and she won, then had a rematch then he won. Her explanation was because she gained weight :)

What I know is that it is not written in the Quran, but in Hadeeth. Hadeeth is not perfect and we do not it is protected like the Quran. There are actual controversies in the age of mother Aisha. Some even believe she was 16 at the time of marriage. But either ways, that marriage was not a problem as I explained before.

Further to the above paragraph, yup, in Hadeeth!

Actually, it is the complete opposite. Since you said you read the Quran, I thought you already knew about it. An example is verse 8 of chapter 60 (Al Mumtahinah) where it says that God does not forbid us from being friendly and just, to those who do not wish us harm, which generalizes all people no matter what their religions are. Prophet Muhammad also answered to invitations from Jews and had a Jewish neighbor he visited when he (the neighbor) got sick. God does want all people regardless to their beliefs to come to know each other. An example for that from the Quran is verse 13 of chapter 49 (Al Hujurat) that tell us that God created up of many different tribes and peoples for use to get acquainted to each other. Since you know Arabic, you can refer to that in its original form. This is actually what I'm doing here. I'm making friends from different religions and backgrounds :)

I say that Islam is not what you think it is. Please reconsider :)
Click to expand...

Yes i understood with the colors haha.
My point is eventhough they played and had fun and stuff they had seksual intimacy and that's just wrong in my eyes.
But i understand where you are comming from.

What i meant was this, maybe this can make you see what i mean. I have indeed looked up what they said and it is written there you can read for urself:
 
MD

MD

qualiaphile
Islam has a lot of violence in it. Anyone who denies this is either ignorant or a fool.

Muslims aren't generally violent because they're people and believe in social cohesion and cooperative ideas. They are human beings first. You can't reverse millions of years of evolution with a 1400 warlike faith.

I'm so glad I live in a free society where I can express my views. My religion originally comes from a country where they would be killed for saying anything against Islam. Even recently a Christian couple was burned alive in Pakistan for speaking out against a book of myths. All those who defend Islam, think about that for a second. They were literally beaten and burned alive for ALLEGEDLY speaking against a 'holy' book. Christians are routinely killed in that cess pool of a nation. Bahais are killed in Iran. Zoroastrians are killed in Iran. Yezidis are killed in Iraq. Christians are killed in Iraq. Every single Muslim country kills it's minorities. In fact the fundamentalism is so rampant that the Muslims are killing each other more so than ever before. We are on the cusp of a major Shi'a-Sunni war.

Are Muslims killed routinely in Christian countries? In fact they are protected by liberals more so than the natives.

Religion of peace, my ***.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top