Are religious people atheists to other religions

[johnsweeting]

I read that there are about 10,000 religions (The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia) out there in the world but this number can be disputed depending how to count but let's say that this number is correct for discussion purposes.

If you are a christian (or any other religion) are you then considered an atheist to all the other 9,999 religions because all of these have different holy figures and many of them say that "if you don't follow our religion you will end up in hell". If you're not considered an atheist to these religions, do you believe in these religions as well.

Therefore, I will conclude my thought with a joke:

Do you know what the difference is between an atheist and a religious person...The atheist think that 10,000 are bullcrap.....the religious person think that 9,999 are bullcrap.

Therefore the number between us (atheists) and religious people is only 1 out of 10,000.....Not that much....

(Needless to say that all of them think that their own religion is the "correct one").

Edit: The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia, identifies 10,000 distinct religions, of which 150 have 1 million or more followers. Within Christianity (counted as just one religion), 33,830 different denominations are counted. This would include denominations as large as Catholicism and as small as Shakers.

 

[Shermana]

The meaning of the term "Atheism" is a bit muddy, Socrates was accused of Atheism, but he was definitely a Supernaturalist of sorts, at least of what we know. The term "Atheism" doesn't necessarily imply being against all gods, but in modern usage of the word, it has that connotation. Nonetheless, by the ancient definition of the word, one would in fact be an "Atheist" by disagreeing with any particular god's existence, or even further, refusing to worship or accept dominion from that "god" even by acknowledging it.

And then there's the whole issue of the meaning of the term "god".

 

[ArtieE]

Do you know what the difference is between an atheist and a religious person...The atheist think that 950 are bullcrap.....the religious person think that 949 are bullcrap.

Therefore the number between us (atheists) and religious people is only 1 out of 950.....Not that much....

An atheist is a person who doesn't believe in deities. A Christian is also a person who doesn't believe in deities for the same reason an atheist doesn't, because they don't exist, but a Christian for some unfathomable reason has made a single exception from the rule and claim that although he doesn't believe in deities one actually exists. Where's the logic?

 

[Quintessence]

The meaning of the term "Atheism" is a bit muddy, Socrates was accused of Atheism, but he was definitely a Supernaturalist of sorts, at least of what we know. The term "Atheism" doesn't necessarily imply being against all gods, but in modern usage of the word, it has that connotation. Nonetheless, by the ancient definition of the word, one would in fact be an "Atheist" by disagreeing with any particular god's existence, or even further, refusing to worship or accept dominion from that "god" even by acknowledging it.

And then there's the whole issue of the meaning of the term "god".

Yeeeaaah. This is why I find the terms "atheist" and "theist" almost completely worthless. Telling me you don't believe in "god" (or that you do believe in "god") is meaningless unless you tell me how you are defining "god." Therefore I essentially agree with the problem the OP presents. We're all theists and we're all atheists; we may not use the word "god" for some particular concept, but we all believe in some god-concepts and disbelieve in others.

 

[Road Warrior]

Therefore, I will conclude my thought with a joke:

Do you know what the difference is between an atheist and a religious person...The atheist think that 10,000 are bullcrap.....the religious person think that 9,999 are bullcrap.

Richard Dawkins, and others, replayed that joke by saying “We are all atheists about most of the gods that societies have ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.”

However, the divide between believing in (take your pick) one god or a million and believing in no god(s) at all is a huge one. Saying it is only one small step is misleading at best.

 

[ArtieE]

However, the divide between believing in (take your pick) one god or a million and believing in no god(s) at all is a huge one. Saying it is only one small step is misleading at best.

Sort of like saying you don't believe in leprechauns except the only one that actually exists?

 

[Quintessence]

However, the divide between believing in (take your pick) one god or a million and believing in no god(s) at all is a huge one. Saying it is only one small step is misleading at best.

Yup. For me to reject my gods would be the equivalent of deciding to disbelieve in all of reality, the universe, and everything since my gods are the universe/reality itself.

Nice room with padded walls, here I come! :bonk:

 

[Road Warrior]

Sort of like saying you don't believe in leprechauns except the only one that actually exists?

No, it's more like saying one believes in one or more unicorns or none at all. Regardless of the number, the difference between Zero and any other number is a huge difference. Much more different that between one and a million since it isn't the actual number that matters, but the difference between belief and disbelief.

 

[gnomon]

I read that there are about 10,000 religions (The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia) out there in the world but this number can be disputed depending how to count but let's say that this number is correct for discussion purposes.

If you are a christian (or any other religion) are you then considered an atheist to all the other 9,999 religions because all of these have different holy figures and many of them say that "if you don't follow our religion you will end up in hell". If you're not considered an atheist to these religions, do you believe in these religions as well.

Therefore, I will conclude my thought with a joke:

Do you know what the difference is between an atheist and a religious person...The atheist think that 10,000 are bullcrap.....the religious person think that 9,999 are bullcrap.

Therefore the number between us (atheists) and religious people is only 1 out of 10,000.....Not that much....

(Needless to say that all of them think that their own religion is the "correct one").

Edit: The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia, identifies 10,000 distinct religions, of which 150 have 1 million or more followers. Within Christianity (counted as just one religion), 33,830 different denominations are counted. This would include denominations as large as Catholicism and as small as Shakers.

No, they are not considered atheists. Some religious believers see others as deluded. Others just see them as worshiping the same thing by another name. Others have no problem melding the views on a god into their religion no matter what those views are.

Atheist and theist are just aspects in regards to a specific religious question.

 

[arthra]

The early Christians we're probably considered "atheists" for not paying obeisence and offering sacrifices to the Emperor... Buddhists were likely considered "atheists" by the Brahmin priests because they ignored the venerable Vedas and refused to participate in the Vedic sacrifices...

There is a word in Sanscrit that sounds like the Greek word "Gnostic" but means denying the gods and heaven it's the word "Nastika"..

See:

Āstika and nāstika - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So this discussion has been going on for a looong time!

 

[ArtieE]

No, it's more like saying one believes in one or more unicorns or none at all. Regardless of the number, the difference between Zero and any other number is a huge difference. Much more different that between one and a million since it isn't the actual number that matters, but the difference between belief and disbelief.

But that would be illogical. Why believe in the existence of one or two unicorns but not ten or a hundred?

 

[Road Warrior]

Ummm, that's my point. The fact is, we don't know. We can't rule it out. Even Dawkins doesn't declare himself a "7" on his own scale.

 

[cablescavenger]

I read that there are about 10,000 religions (The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia) out there in the world but this number can be disputed depending how to count but let's say that this number is correct for discussion purposes.

If you are a christian (or any other religion) are you then considered an atheist to all the other 9,999 religions because all of these have different holy figures and many of them say that "if you don't follow our religion you will end up in hell". If you're not considered an atheist to these religions, do you believe in these religions as well.

Therefore, I will conclude my thought with a joke:

Do you know what the difference is between an atheist and a religious person...The atheist think that 10,000 are bullcrap.....the religious person think that 9,999 are bullcrap.

Therefore the number between us (atheists) and religious people is only 1 out of 10,000.....Not that much....

(Needless to say that all of them think that their own religion is the "correct one").

Edit: The 2001 edition of Barrett's World Christian Encyclopedia, identifies 10,000 distinct religions, of which 150 have 1 million or more followers. Within Christianity (counted as just one religion), 33,830 different denominations are counted. This would include denominations as large as Catholicism and as small as Shakers.

Christians were considered atheist by the Romans.

Splitters!!

 

[ChristineES]

I don't speak for all Christians, but to me, an atheist will believe in no God whatsoever. People of different faiths are still theists in my view, although I have heard about some people believing that different religions are "atheists" (which makes no sense to me...).

 

[Quintessence]

I don't speak for all Christians, but to me, an atheist will believe in no God whatsoever. People of different faiths are still theists in my view, although I have heard about some people believing that different religions are "atheists" (which makes no sense to me...).

Personally, the only way the term atheist makes any sense to me at all is if it is relative to a specific religion's god-concept. Nobody rejects every single god-concept. They may not call a particular concept "god" in their own vocabulary, but someone else considers it a god-concept. Far as I'm concerned, that's still believing in a god-concept; the label isn't what's important.

 

[BruceDLimber]

If you are a christian (or any other religion) are you then considered an atheist to all the other 9,999 religions because all of these have different holy figures and many of them say that "if you don't follow our religion you will end up in hell?"

Definitely not!

I'm a Baha'i, and the Baha'i Faith explicitly reconizes ALL the great religions in its scriptures!

I quote:

"There can be no doubt whatever that the peoples of the world, of whatever race or religion, derive their inspiration from one heavenly Source, and are the subjects of one God. The difference between the ordinances under which they abide should be attributed to the varying requirements and exigencies of the age in which they were revealed. All of them, except a few which are the outcome of human perversity, were ordained of God, and are a reflection of His Will and Purpose. Arise and, armed with the power of faith, shatter to pieces the gods of your vain imaginings, the sowers of dissension amongst you. Cleave unto that which draweth you together and uniteth you."

—(Gleanings, CXI, pp. 217-8)


Best!

Bruce

 

[E. Nato Difficile]

Personally, the only way the term atheist makes any sense to me at all is if it is relative to a specific religion's god-concept. Nobody rejects every single god-concept. They may not call a particular concept "god" in their own vocabulary, but someone else considers it a god-concept. Far as I'm concerned, that's still believing in a god-concept; the label isn't what's important.

I reject any god-concept. And I don't reject it if no one presents it as such. Does a vegetarian have to catalog every conceivable species of animal he won't eat before calling himself a vegetarian?

And I think it's obvious that, for example, a Christian rejects the gods of the ancient Greeks on the same basis as an atheist rejects the Christian god. The Christian may like to read the Greek epics as literature, he just doesn't believe the characters are real and/or divine.

-Nato

 

[Quintessence]

I reject any god-concept. And I don't reject it if no one presents it as such.

This still doesn't make much sense to me. It probably never will, because I really can't comprehend the rationality of wholesale dismissal of any god-concept. Dismissal of my god-concept has the following implications:

1) Disbelief in the universe/reality
2) Belief that you are the highest/greatest power in existence (extreme hubris and narcissism)
3) Inability to experience awe, a sense of sacredness, happiness, or joy

This is why I say as far as I'm concerned, if we don't hit all of these three points you believe in some sort of god-concept even if we don't use the label 'god' for it. There are simply too many ways of thinking about god for it to make any sense to say we disbelieve in all of them. It may not play a significant role in our life and we may not think about it as "god," but that doesn't mean it isn't there or that you don't "believe" in it so long as it doesn't have that "god" label on it.

I don't know. Is it really that "god" label that atheists are taking issue with? I try to understand, but as is demonstrated above, atheism in my theology has extremely absurd implications and makes it hard for me to get a grasp of their position unless it's relative to a specific religion or god-concept. I like to ask them "specifically, what god-concepts do you have issue with" for this reason. >_<;

 

[E. Nato Difficile]

This still doesn't make much sense to me. It probably never will, because I really can't comprehend the rationality of wholesale dismissal of any god-concept. Dismissal of my god-concept has the following implications:

1) Disbelief in the universe/reality
2) Belief that you are the highest/greatest power in existence (extreme hubris and narcissism)
3) Inability to experience awe, a sense of sacredness, happiness, or joy

1) I have every reason to believe that the universe is real.
2) I believe that the universe has been around for a lot longer than Homo Sap has been around to perceive it, and will be around long after we're gone. If that's not humility, I don't know what is.
3) Again, I don't think the universe was put here for humans to admire. Nevertheless, I'm second to nobody in terms of the sense of awe I have for this staggering cosmos. The development of life on Earth, the vastness of space, the cataclysms of nature, and the extreme unlikeliness of it all, are sources of infinite wonder for me.

This is why I say as far as I'm concerned, if we don't hit all of these three points you believe in some sort of god-concept even if we don't use the label 'god' for it. There are simply too many ways of thinking about god for it to make any sense to say we disbelieve in all of them. It may not play a significant role in our life and we may not think about it as "god," but that doesn't mean it isn't there or that you don't "believe" in it so long as it doesn't have that "god" label on it.

I don't know. Is it really that "god" label that atheists are taking issue with? I try to understand, but as is demonstrated above, atheism in my theology has extremely absurd implications and makes it hard for me to get a grasp of their position. I like to ask them "specifically, what god-concepts do you have issue with" for this reason. >_<;

Obviously it's that "god" label I take issue with.

And it's good that atheism seems absurd to you, because it's an absurd universe. Humans have all kinds of ingenious ways to make sense of it all, some more honest than others. To believe we make sense of things merely by putting a label like "god" on them demonstrates more hubris than I could muster.

-Nato

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

This still doesn't make much sense to me. It probably never will, because I really can't comprehend the rationality of wholesale dismissal of any god-concept. Dismissal of my god-concept has the following implications:

1) Disbelief in the universe/reality
2) Belief that you are the highest/greatest power in existence (extreme hubris and narcissism)
3) Inability to experience awe, a sense of sacredness, happiness, or joy

This is why I say as far as I'm concerned, if we don't hit all of these three points you believe in some sort of god-concept even if we don't use the label 'god' for it. There are simply too many ways of thinking about god for it to make any sense to say we disbelieve in all of them. It may not play a significant role in our life and we may not think about it as "god," but that doesn't mean it isn't there or that you don't "believe" in it so long as it doesn't have that "god" label on it.

I don't know. Is it really that "god" label that atheists are taking issue with? I try to understand, but as is demonstrated above, atheism in my theology has extremely absurd implications and makes it hard for me to get a grasp of their position unless it's relative to a specific religion or god-concept. I like to ask them "specifically, what god-concepts do you have issue with" for this reason. >_<;

Sometimes people take issue with the underlying claims in a god-concept, but yes, sometimes it just comes down to the label.

I mean, I know there are some people out there who will say things like "the sun is my god"; when I say that I don't believe in any gods, I'm not saying that I don't believe that the sun exists; I'm saying that I don't consider the sun to be a god.

If the label "god" can apply to anything, then it's meaningless. Conversely, if it does have meaning, then this implies that there are criteria we can look at to say "yes, this is a god" or "no, this isn't a god."