Are we just Christians in denial?

[nnmartin]

On another website I was told that I was a Christian in denial.

I state my views as follows with the Christian 'equivalent' in brackets.

An Eternal Source/The One (God) - This is deistic. - the highest power

Earth Goddess (Jesus) - An outreach of the source.

I don't believe we can have 'personal ' contact with the Goddess more just a general spiritual communion with her.

So the Christian will tell me that due to the lack of theology in Paganism I am just trying to be different and will one day wake up and see the light.

Can't say I buy this idea as I disagree with many of the rules of the Christian church.

any views on this?

 

[Cassiopia]

I think your views are your views, and from the threads you have started here it seem you are genuinely trying to examine your beliefs and find your own path. Perhaps in the end it will be some form of Christianity. Perhaps it will be something altogether different.
All you can do is be honest with yourself and I wouldn't worry too much about how other people label your beliefs.

 

[sol_mas]

What Cassiopia said.

And, it's ultimately your path; you'll have to decide if its the right one, regardless of what you or someone else calls it.

-sm

 

[Sylvan]

So the Christian will tell me that due to the lack of theology in Paganism I am just trying to be different and will one day wake up and see the light.

I would say this person has their heads stuck so far up their own ***** that whatever they think of you or anyone elses beliefs is pointless arrogant noise. Interesting in so far as "behold the behavior of this ignorant programmed person" but otherwise :sleep:

Just because some people have traditionally valued ridiculous exercises in philological speculation to justify their far more ridiculous beliefs doesn't mean one needs a "theology" to have a "real religion". That's absurd. This person, out of fear or habit, is looking for a way to get you back to their side and think they can intellectually bully you into doing so using this ridiculous claim. One does not need a theology if one makes no definitive claims about the nature of reality, gods or spirits. I think of pagan religions as working hypotheses. Because we make no definitive claims we need no theology to defend them, or obligation to "prove them" to anyone but ourselves if we so desire. Most of us are not trying to convert anyone so the motivation to create one is to defend ourselves in these kind of discussions. Which to my mind, in the 21st century, should be unnecessary.

 

[blackout]

To some christians EVERYONE is either a christian or in denial.

*yawns*

 

[nnmartin]

Just because some people have traditionally valued ridiculous exercises in philological speculation to justify their far more ridiculous beliefs doesn't mean one needs a "theology" to have a "real religion".

true that!

I read the Bible cover to cover recently plus read a whole load of Christian books - even tried church a few times and talked to quite a few Christians - I just can't buy it - too man made for me! The Bible is a good read and quite inspirational but as literature/philosophy only for me. It has just too many fundamental flaws for me to believe in it.

I've always felt a strong spiritual connection to the Earth and I have discovered that my ideas of the Gods etc.. seem to tally with the general Pagan belief system.

 

[nnmartin]

it seem you are genuinely trying to examine your beliefs and find your own path. Perhaps in the end it will be some form of Christianity.

I've finally laid that idea to rest now.

Christianity is not for me.


thanks for the responses , by the way - the post about the weed was meant to be a joke!

 

[doppelganger]

Nope. Christians are just pagans in denial.

 

[Quintessence]

Some Pagans are probably Christians in denial. Some Christians are probably Pagans in denial. Some are none of the above. As others have noted, which one you are is up to you to sort out.

But the notion of "waking up and seeing the light" really irritates me. It's arrogant and condescending. We're all just human beings trying to figure out our paths in life and claims like this imply there's some absolute truth out there that everyone is supposed to find. Nonsense. I suppose if believing that everyone else is misguided/wrong helps to make you more secure in your own faith, go for it, but I find that kind of sad. In my experience, those who are truly secure in their beliefs aren't threatened by the idea of someone else thinking differently than them.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

People well-practiced in denial tend to think others are as well.

 

[Tom Terrific]

Some Pagans are probably Christians in denial. Some Christians are probably Pagans in denial. Some are none of the above.

I tend to agree.

I used to ask myself this question. Here are some of my thoughts, for what they're worth to you.

All spiritual paths lead to the same ultimate end. The closer they approach that end, the more they will tend to look like each other. Someone once asked Jesus which of God's commandments was the greatest commandment; he responded that the greatest commandment was to love God with all your heart, soul, mind, etc., and added that there was a second commandment "like unto it": to love one's neighbor as oneself. On these two commands, he said, "hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Think about that. Many Pagans would agree.

But simply because two religions teach the same ultimate truth does not mean they are the same religion. A religion is not simply a body of theology. I would even say that a religion is not primarily a body of theology. A religion is a pathway, a discipline, a course to be sailed. It is something we *do*, not simply something we *think*. A Christian is someone who disciples himself to Christ. A Pagan is someone who disciples himself to any of a myriad of deities -- if his religion is authentic, that is. If it's just a social club, a hobby or part of one's persona, then it isn't about spirituality. What your "religion" is is really a question of who you disciple yourself to, and, secondarily, the method given you that forms the structure of your discipleship. Theology is a part of that, but only because it's part of the structure given you to form your approach to the divine.

I am a Pagan because I worship the Goddess, which is to say, I devote myself to Her and entrust Her with my self, to lead me and guide me, to care for me and love me. I open myself to Her completely; that, I believe, is the essence of worship. But many of the truths of Christianity are also Her truths -- because both paths are authentic, or can be depending on who's practicing them. Both paths will ultimately lead you to the same end (although orthodox Christianity denies this).

Follow your heart, wherever it leads you, and don't be ashamed or apologize to anyone for what you decide -- especially yourself.