Are we responsible for the sins of our gr.-gr.-grandparents

[ThePainefulTruth]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

 

[RRex]

To me this is sadistic vengeance.

I don't believe in it. Why should the innocent suffer for someone else's sins?

I question the benevolence of such an entity.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Definitely seems like a ploy to me. Sort of a "hedging of bets" for minimizing routes out of adherence to religious doctrine. If the person doesn't care enough about themselves to behave, then threaten their children, and their children's children. Isn't this basic "Bad Guy 101"?

 

[George-ananda]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

Side point: It just makes me glad I have moved beyond the Old Testament in my beliefs.

 

[Tumah]

According to the Jewish interpretation, its speaking about when a child carries on the same sin as his great-great- grandfather. Then he is punished for it as well.
As opposed to that, Ex. 34:7 says that G-d does kindness for 2,000 generations (lit. thousands - therefore minimum of two thousand).

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

I sure do want to hear a Christian point of view. We are responsible for are our own actions not for our family's.

 

[LuisDantas]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

This is the sort of passage that makes me wonder if early Christians believed in a literal God at all.

A jealous God is a bit too fallible to fit the mainstream expectation of the Abrahamic God, IMO. And the idea that he would choose to enact vengeance for four or more generations is odd.

It makes more sense to think that "God" was understood to be some sort of reality of nature that, when ignored or disrespected, would cause damage lasting for generations.

 

[RRex]

If I may say, hopefully without being attacked too badly, the Bible reads more like it was written by very angry men than by a superior being.

Would such an entity be so extremely bitter, vengeful and misogynistic?



With respect,

RRex.

 

[McBell]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

Is not the original sin of Adam and Eve god punishing everyone for their sin?
What about the ******* not being allowed in congregation for seven (or ten depending upon the Bible version) generations?

 

[metis]

I sorta take it in that what we do that's harmful may affect the rest of our family and society, and that may go beyond just one generation. IOW, we do not live in a societal vacuum.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Is not the original sin of Adam and Eve god punishing everyone for their sin?

Yeah - I almost brought up Adam and Eve in my original reply to the thread - but lately I've been finding myself straying off topic a lot, so I culled my response a bit. As you stated - their "sins" supposedly leave the rest of humanity suffering for all of eternity following. "Divine justice" is apparently not of the "blind" variety.

 

[Covellite]

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Can this be interpreted any other way but that even the gr.- gr.- granchildren of a sinner are damned or punished for any of their thirty ancestors transgressions? Or is this, as it appears, simply one of many manipulations to instill fear in one's congregants to toe the line of blind faith.

The life of our ancestors influence our life in a geat way. The good part, it can be beneficial, if not it's possible to change it.

 

[Timothy Bryce]

In Australian law school, I was enlightened to the fact that the was once a (reasonably repealed) doctrine that an Australian lawyer would be unfit for legal practice if they had a "convict" in their ancestral history. Thank **** we grew out of that one.

I understand the concept of highs and illnesses being trickled down through generations in a social context but I also understand that one or two generations removed, there is literally no basis for an evaluation of an individual's ancestry. People who make that their business are shoveling snake oil at people.

 

[Covellite]

In Australian law school, I was enlightened to the fact that the was once a (reasonably repealed) doctrine that an Australian lawyer would be unfit for legal practice if they had a "convict" in their ancestral history. Thank **** we grew out of that one.

I understand the concept of highs and illnesses being trickled down through generations in a social context but I also understand that one or two generations removed, there is literally no basis for an evaluation of an individual's ancestry. People who make that their business are shoveling snake oil at people.

Could be.
From my experience it's far more complex.

 

[Timothy Bryce]

Could be.
From my experience it's far more complex.

It always seems to be complex. For everyone. It's not. People just chase their tails when they know they have a problem that they don't want to address. Self-victimizing is a huge personal business in the west; often it's attributed to a lack of responsibility and accountability - "I've failed; therefore it must be someone else's fault".

It's difficult to discern what's truly valuable.

 

[RRex]

Self-victimizing is a huge personal business in the west; often it's attributed to a lack of responsibility and accountability - "I've failed; therefore it must be someone else's fault".

So true, and exasperating for those who do take responsibility for themselves.

 

[Pastek]

In Ezekiel it says in the chapter 18

18.20 The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child. The righteousness of the righteous will be credited to them, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against them.

So everyone is responsabile of himself.

 

[Mycroft]

Side point: It just makes me glad I have moved beyond the Old Testament in my beliefs.

Another side-point: Doesn't the New Testament say that God is 'unchanging'? And does it also say that Jesus told people to honor the laws of the old testament?

 

[RRex]

In Ezekiel it says in the chapter 18

18.20 The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child. The righteousness of the righteous will be credited to them, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against them.

So everyone is responsabile of himself.

Ex. 20:5--I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Why does the Bible contradict itself?

 

[Deeje]

I sure do want to hear a Christian point of view. We are responsible for are our own actions not for our family's.

Tumah has answered this well.

Ex 37:6, 7:
"Yahweh—Yahweh is a compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger and rich in faithful love and truth, maintaining faithful love to a thousand generations, forgiving wrongdoing, rebellion, and sin. But He will not leave the guilty unpunished, bringing the consequences of the fathers’ wrongdoing on the children and grandchildren to the third and fourth generation."

This tells us exactly what is meant in the OP.

If successive generations carry on the error of their parents and grandparents, they will be punished for it as well. Those who obey their God, repenting of their sins, will be forgiven up to many generations. No one is found guilty of wrongdoing if they seek God and obey his laws. Having bad examples in your family is no excuse to break God's laws. Israel's kings were a classic example of this. Some of the worst kings had the best and most obedient sons, but some of the best kings had the worst. Individual hearts are at work here.