Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
If a believer never sins, does he still need to repent for his parents and grandparents (on back) misdeeds or sins?
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Are we responsible for the sins of our gr.-gr.-grandparents
- Thread starter ThePainefulTruth
- Start date
If a believer never sins, does he still need to repent for his parents and grandparents (on back) misdeeds or sins?
Another contradiction, but no explanation as to which citation can be trusted as an accurate representation of intent.
Which one do we take as the truth?
Respectfully,
RRex
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
To me this is sadistic vengeance.
I don't believe in it. Why should the innocent suffer for someone else's sins?
I question the benevolence of such an entity.
That you do not believe in it does not make it untrue. It seems the majority of people keep expecting Yahweh to be different than the Torah states, and more like how Yeshua was portrayed in the New Testament. Why? The father is not the son.
A ' seeming ' contradiction. We need to consider context and setting:
Exodus 20:5 B is showing those who hate God can pass down that hatred to their children and children's children. Idol worship ( false worship ) can be passed down.
Father's sins - Exodus 34:7 - can bring suffering upon children that can last for generations because of their wrong or abusive behavior of the parent.
Also, under the Constitution of the Mosaic Law please notice Deuteronomy 24:16 and compare with Isaiah 54:13
As far as the crime of the father having to be paid by the son or vice versa that would never be the case - Ezekiel 18:20; 2 Chronicles 25:4 B
Since the Bible is Not written ABC as a dictionary, then one needs to study the Bible by topic or subject arrangement.
Taking one subject or topic at a time and see what the various Bible writers had to say on that particular subject or topic.
Timothy Bryce
Active Member
Then who is the father? And why have men hijacked religious ideology?
Kind regards.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Yahweh, if you are referencing the Bible. Allah, for the Quran. If you refer to another father, the question asked in the original post, which is specific to the Bible, can not apply.
I'm not bound by the Bible period. It says thousands of things by who knows how many people from who knows how many views. Although not a Christian myself, I believe Jesus was an advanced spiritual being with not always the ideal publicists.
The religious leaders were teaching the people their tradition which was outside of Scripture, wrongly teaching such tradition as Scripture. - Matthew 15:9
Jesus was warning the people Not to follow the wayward Pharisees - Matthew chapter 23 - but follow the teachings as recorded in Scripture.
So, God's Constitution of the Mosaic Law was Not changing, rather the religious leaders were changing.
Frankly, I can't take the Bible seriously because it is so inconsistent, and candidly speaking, evil.
The Christian God is a nasty creature who terrorized me throughout my childhood in the visage of extremely cruel priests and nuns.
A ruling document from a god should be clearly understandable and logical. It should not contradict itself and, thereby, rely upon "flawed" humans to interpret its every nuance.
It is a very disappointing book.
Respectfully,
RRex
The Christian God is a nasty creature who terrorized me throughout my childhood in the visage of extremely cruel priests and nuns.
A ruling document from a god should be clearly understandable and logical. It should not contradict itself and, thereby, rely upon "flawed" humans to interpret its every nuance.
It is a very disappointing book.
Respectfully,
RRex
Timothy Bryce
Active Member
This is not even effective dodging. Which your post only confirms further.
So, if I understand you correctly:
"men have hijacked religious ideology to the extent that human men are the only people privileged to make decisions".
Ugly.
Timothy Bryce
Active Member
"book" is the key word.
Many books are inspirational.
It's very, very easy to market bad books that retard the thoughtful and support anti-intellectualism,
I very much enjoyed reading one of Lawrence Taylor's brain-dead autobiographies. While I enjoyed it, it confirmed that the world is a frighteningly, angry place.
In the west, you are a winner, a loser or a player.
Carlita, there is no such person as believer who does not sin. If you understand what sin is, you can understand why this statement is true.
The sin that Jesus came to give his life for is the imperfection in our soul, our imperfect flesh that has a propensity now to want to go the wrong way. This was inherited from Adam. (Rom 5:12) This is sin that we cannot control. No descendant of Adam is born without it.
Paul described a inner struggle with this "sin" at Rom 7:14-25:
"For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin. 15 For I do not understand what I am doing. For I do not practice what I wish, but I do what I hate. 16 However, if I do what I do not wish, I agree that the Law is fine. 17 But now I am no longer the one doing it, but it is the sin that resides in me. 18 For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh, there dwells nothing good; for I have the desire to do what is fine but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good that I wish, but the bad that I do not wish is what I practice. 20 If, then, I do what I do not wish, I am no longer the one carrying it out, but it is the sin dwelling in me.
21 I find, then, this law in my case: When I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me. 22 I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within, 23 but I see in my body another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my body. 24 Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death? 25 Thanks to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So, then, with my mind I myself am a slave to God’s law, but with my flesh to sin’s law."
I have never seen it described better. But you see we have a rescuer?
The sin that we "choose" to commit is the one we CAN control. We are in the driver's seat...we are the captain of our own vessel....we steer it where we want it to go. If we deliberately crash it into a large object, can we complain about the damage or the cost to repair it?
We all stand or fall by what we choose to believe, so if we inherit beliefs from our parents and grandparents, without substantiating them, we are like those people who for generations teach false truths to their children. Is it the children's fault that they are taught the wrong things? No, but if they hang onto those false beliefs and perpetuate them without questioning them, then they are as culpable as their forebears. The truth is not hidden...it is out there for all to see, examine and choose....or reject.
In what stretch of whose imagination do you call that Christianity? When did Jesus ever behave like that....when did he paint his Father as a cruel and unreasonable despot? Catholicism did that, not God.
I believe that you need to separate "the church" from Christ...because he separated from them a long time ago. Come the judgment time, he will tell them that he NEVER knew them. (Matt 7:21-23)
All I can say is that you haven't really read it for yourself or examined its teachings away from Christendom. It is not contradictory or inconsistent. It is perfectly understandable.
What examples can you give for this flawed work?
I'm sorry but I'm not going to take responsibility for anyone but myself.
I didn't know Adam and I didn't know Eve. Maybe we're related and maybe we aren't. None of us will know the truth of things until we die and perhaps not even then.
I don't believe in Original Sin. It's silly. I'm not apologizing or asking for forgiveness for something that supposedly happened thousands/millions/whatever years ago.
We've evolved for a reason and it isn't so we can continue living in the Dark Ages.
I didn't know Adam and I didn't know Eve. Maybe we're related and maybe we aren't. None of us will know the truth of things until we die and perhaps not even then.
I don't believe in Original Sin. It's silly. I'm not apologizing or asking for forgiveness for something that supposedly happened thousands/millions/whatever years ago.
We've evolved for a reason and it isn't so we can continue living in the Dark Ages.
I think that is a given. We will all answer for ourselves.
What do you expect to happen when you die? Heaven? Hell? Annihilation? Nothing?
What do you think "original sin" is exactly? It may not be what you were taught.
Who is asking you to? You only need to be forgiven for what YOU do. How is that not fair?
Look at the world....can you really say we aren't living in the 'dark' ages?
Humans have obviously 'evolved' into the most heinous of creatures who can now wipe out every living thing on this planet out of existence.
The planet itself is groaning under the strain of man's greed and inept management of his own waste....
I think you need a reality check....
Mycroft
Ministry of Serendipity
If he was that advanced, why didn't he sort it out himself?
Everyone has a different perspective, including you.I think you need a reality check....
I've shared mine. Don't judge me for it. The knowledge was hard won
Timothy Bryce
Active Member
&don't like
Everyone has a different perspective, including you.
I've shared mine. Don't judge me for it. The knowledge was hard won
So was mine.....I was raised in church too but I did my own research and found a spiritual home that is very satisfying. They do exist, you just have to "keep seeking...keep asking...keep knocking"