Arkansas inflicts child abuse on its school children

[Polymath257]

Creation scientists, also there were forensics at the death, burial and resurrection. Jesus was really dead, He was really put in the secured tomb, He really rose from the dead and walked the earth for 40 more days, seen by over 500 people.

Really? Where are the testimonies of those people? All I ever see is the writings of one or two people who *claim* large numbers of people saw something. Or that claim that Jesus existed and did/said various things.

What is the actual evidence?

Evolution has no such evidence, all speculation.

Wrong. Evolution has the actual fossils, the actual rocks, the actual chemistry, the actual genetics, the actual dating methods, etc. That *is* evidence.

Really doesn’t matter though because you would’ve argued with Jesus that He didn’t really rise from the dead if He was standing in front of you talking to you.

Thomas was the only one to honestly question some claims.

 

[Polymath257]

Well, you are saying that random events happened and that’s how we got all of ordered life and that’s impossible for sure.

Nope. Chemistry and physics are NOT random.

Never happen, yet Noah and the flood certainly did happen because there is a Creator who made sure the account was written down and isn’t bound by His Creation, He can speak things into existence from nothing and exactly what He did in Creation. That is evidenced in what we see right now.

Nope, Noah's flood certainly never happened as a global flood. At best, it was a local flood. You claim a creator without actual evidence of such a being.

 

[ElishaElijah]

And the believers of all the other creation accounts say the same thing about their myths.

Your *claim* it is true is not *evidence* of its truth. For that matter, much of what you *claim* is not the result of even eye witness accounts, but of people writing much later about what *other* people supposedly saw. Given that they were writing to convince others of a claim, at least some skepticism should be used towards the writings.

There is only 1 true account of Creation and we can agree on that, correct?

 

[ElishaElijah]

Really? Where are the



Nope, Noah's flood certainly never happened as a global flood. At best, it was a local flood. You claim a creator without actual evidence of such a being.

Nope. Chemistry and physics are NOT random.



Nope, Noah's flood certainly never happened as a global flood. At best, it was a local flood. You claim a creator without actual evidence of such a being.

So then what is the origin of life if there was no creator? There is only one conclusion if you go back to the beginning of that scenario, there was nothing and it made something. This is illogical.
Even an experiment has a creator, someone to design and put everything together, manipulate things and make things happen. And then in Miller’s experiment when scrutinized has a lot of problems from what I’m reading.
As for the Bible and eye witnesses, the story of Creation, the Fall, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, Hebrews and Israel, the Land God promised, Jesus Christ, Apostles, The Church, Believers living today being born again and God making Himself known to people just like the Bible says. God made sure there was a record of what He has done and what He will do in the future. He spoke and said these things would happen before they did and they have. Jesus will return for believers.
God said and faith is believing what He said and acting on that. If God says the water will part when you walk in the river but you stand on the shore and say I need proof, you won’t get any proof. The proof is when you walk in the water and the water parts. I didn’t get my proof till I received the Gospel of Jesus Christ, my eyes were opened and I was changed. You have to get your own proof.

 

[ecco]

it was due to your empty grave comment, totally wrong to bring Covid into that.

Not wrong at all. There have been many graves filled by people who died of COVID because they didn't believe the science. Many of those believed their common sense that told them it was not worse than the flu.

Where does distrust of science come from? It comes from people denigrating scientific knowledge like evolution and physics because the Bible says something different.

 

[Polymath257]

There is only 1 true account of Creation and we can agree on that, correct?

At most one. I don't think any *creation* accounts are true.

Even if there is one that is true, nobody really knows which one it is.

 

[Polymath257]

So then what is the origin of life if there was no creator?

Why would there need to be a creator?

There is only one conclusion if you go back to the beginning of that scenario, there was nothing and it made something. This is illogical.

Wrong. Life came from previous chemistry. Just like life *today* comes from chemistry.

Even an experiment has a creator, someone to design and put everything together, manipulate things and make things happen. And then in Miller’s experiment when scrutinized has a lot of problems from what I’m reading.

Miller's experiment only focused on one question: could amino acids be made in what are possible conditions on the early Earth? The big news is that it *is* possible. Subsequent experiments looked at a variety of other conditions (so we don't have to assume that Miller got them exactly right) and the conclusion still holds for a large range of possibilities.

As for the Bible and eye witnesses, the story of Creation, the Fall, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, Hebrews and Israel, the Land God promised, Jesus Christ, Apostles, The Church, Believers living today being born again and God making Himself known to people just like the Bible says. God made sure there was a record of what He has done and what He will do in the future. He spoke and said these things would happen before they did and they have. Jesus will return for believers.

yes, I know the story. Do you have any actual evidence (as opposed to a few anecdotes and unsubstantiated claims)?

God said and faith is believing what He said and acting on that. If God says the water will part when you walk in the river but you stand on the shore and say I need proof, you won’t get any proof. The proof is when you walk in the water and the water parts. I didn’t get my proof till I received the Gospel of Jesus Christ, my eyes were opened and I was changed. You have to get your own proof.

Yes, i know the *claims* about what God supposedly said. I also know that it is mighty *convenient* to not have evidence *before* belief. Every *other* subject requires it that way.

'Proof' after belief is also known as confirmation bias.

 

[ecco]

Well, you are saying that random events happened and that’s how we got all of ordered life and that’s impossible for sure.

If you are referring to abiogenesis when you use the term "ordered life" then, again, science doesn't know, at this time, the exact sequence of events.

If you are talking about the evolution of life thereafter, you need to show why it is impossible. Science has show it is possible and how it occurred. There have always been, and always will be, people like you deny science and believe in gods. If you were alive several hundred years ago, you would have said it is impossible that the earth revolves around the sun. You would have insisted that God said differently.,

yet Noah and the flood certainly did happen

The genealogies as referenced by Bishop Usher set a clear date for the flood. This is specified in great detail in one of the websites you referenced earlier:

Timeline for the Flood

Calculated BC date for creation: 4004
Calculated AM date for the Flood: - 1656
Calculated BC date for the Flood: 2348
Current Year (minus one2): + 2011
Number of years since beginning of Flood: 4359​

Science knows that people lived before, during, and after that time and there is no evidence of a worldwide flood.
How did kangaroos get to Australia? Did they hop across the Pacific?

How do you explain that? Or do you just, once again, dismiss science?

because there is a Creator who made sure the account was written down

How did he make sure it was written down? Did he dictate the events to someone? Who?

He can speak things into existence from nothing

Sure. And He can make things disappear from existence in an instant. Instead, he caused little children and pregnant women and their fetuses to die horrible deaths by drowning and being buried alive in horrendous mudslides. That'll teach 'em - right.



Also, did He speak COVID into existence to punish us some more for Adam's failures?

 

[ecco]

So then what is the origin of life if there was no creator?
...
Even an experiment has a creator, someone to design and put everything together, manipulate things and make things happen.

With one big exception - right? Your uncreated creator! If your creator was not created, the only other viable option is that He existed for eternity. Eternity is a very, very long time. It is far more than 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000....... years. Yet your uncreated creator sat around doing absolutely nothing for about (1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000...... - 6000) years before creating everything. He had all that time to use his omniscience to figure out exactly how to make the universe and its inhabitants. Within the blink of an eye following creation, His creation (the one in His own image) disobeyed Him. Then, a few years later, He horrifically wiped from the earth almost all living creatures to start over again. I'd call that ****-poor planning.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Not wrong at all. There have been many graves filled by people who died of COVID because they didn't believe the science. Many of those believed their common sense that told them it was not worse than the flu.

Where does distrust of science come from? It comes from people denigrating scientific knowledge like evolution and physics because the Bible says something different.

Has nothing to do with Jesus Christ rising from the dead. Science does a fine job with distrust all by itself. God has already proven himself reliable. Bible doesn’t mention Covid but does give instructions for sickness, quarantines etc. They are common sense solutions, for example the Bible says to quarantine if you have an infectious disease not if you’re healthy.

 

[ElishaElijah]

With one big exception - right? Your uncreated creator! If your creator was not created, the only other viable option is that He existed for eternity. Eternity is a very, very long time. It is far more than 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000....... years. Yet your uncreated creator sat around doing absolutely nothing for about (1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000...... - 6000) years before creating everything. He had all that time to use his omniscience to figure out exactly how to make the universe and its inhabitants. Within the blink of an eye following creation, His creation (the one in His own image) disobeyed Him. Then, a few years later, He horrifically wiped from the earth almost all living creatures to start over again. I'd call that ****-poor planning.

God has life in Himself and He knew from the beginning that He was going to have to redeem mankind, that is in Genesis.

 

[ElishaElijah]

If you are referring to abiogenesis when you use the term "ordered life" then, again, science doesn't know, at this time, the exact sequence of events.

If you are talking about the evolution of life thereafter, you need to show why it is impossible. Science has show it is possible and how it occurred. There have always been, and always will be, people like you deny science and believe in gods. If you were alive several hundred years ago, you would have said it is impossible that the earth revolves around the sun. You would have insisted that God said differently.,





The genealogies as referenced by Bishop Usher set a clear date for the flood. This is specified in great detail in one of the websites you referenced earlier:

Timeline for the Flood

Calculated BC date for creation: 4004
Calculated AM date for the Flood: - 1656
Calculated BC date for the Flood: 2348
Current Year (minus one2): + 2011
Number of years since beginning of Flood: 4359​

Science knows that people lived before, during, and after that time and there is no evidence of a worldwide flood.
How did kangaroos get to Australia? Did they hop across the Pacific?

How do you explain that? Or do you just, once again, dismiss science?



How did he make sure it was written down? Did he dictate the events to someone? Who?

Sure. And He can make things disappear from existence in an instant. Instead, he caused little children and pregnant women and their fetuses to die horrible deaths by drowning and being buried alive in horrendous mudslides. That'll teach 'em - right.



Also, did He speak COVID into existence to punish us some more for Adam's failures?

Have you ever considered there are blessings and curses? Blessing for obeying God’s commands and a curse or negative consequence for disobeying God’s commands. Mankind introduced death and disease, God said you can eat of any tree in the garden except this tree, if you do you will die and they ate, rebelled against God and we still are, but some have repented and been born again. When He offered me the gift of eternal life I said ok I trust you and He gave me eternal life.

 

[Polymath257]

Has nothing to do with Jesus Christ rising from the dead. Science does a fine job with distrust all by itself. God has already proven himself reliable. Bible doesn’t mention Covid but does give instructions for sickness, quarantines etc. They are common sense solutions, for example the Bible says to quarantine if you have an infectious disease not if you’re healthy.

Do you have *independent* evidence of Jesus rising from the dead?

I thought not.

 

[Polymath257]

Have you ever considered there are blessings and curses? Blessing for obeying God’s commands and a curse or negative consequence for disobeying God’s commands. Mankind introduced death and disease, God said you can eat of any tree in the garden except this tree, if you do you will die and they ate, rebelled against God and we still are, but some have repented and been born again. When He offered me the gift of eternal life I said ok I trust you and He gave me eternal life.

Again, that is your belief. But what *evidence* do you have that this is correct?

If anything, the belief in curses and blessings seems to be the mark of someone who is *way* too superstitious.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Do you have *independent* evidence of Jesus rising from the dead?

I thought not.

I was dead and now I’m alive so yes I have evidence. I didn’t deliver myself but God did and I’m alive to tell it. I wasn’t physically dead but in every other way, now I’m alive.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Again, that is your belief. But what *evidence* do you have that this is correct?

If anything, the belief in curses and blessings seems to be the mark of someone who is *way* too superstitious.

I got married and made a covenant with God to be faithful to my wife and her with me. We are covered by God and have received blessing upon blessing. Before that I lived a promiscuous life that resulted in disease and other negative consequences, no thanks. I like my life now. Man what a difference life is now compared to the first 28 years of my life. Maybe it has been some sort of experiment because I’ve lived God’s Word out and He is faithful just like He said. You reap what you sow, pretty simple.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Again, that is your belief. But what *evidence* do you have that this is correct?

If anything, the belief in curses and blessings seems to be the mark of someone who is *way* too superstitious.

What happens when you steal, lie, cheat, murder, get drunk? Good things or bad things result? You become a better person or more corrupt? Or the opposite generous, faithful, forgiving, honest? Good things happen and your conscience is clear.

 

[ElishaElijah]

What happens when you steal, lie, cheat, murder, get drunk? Good things or bad things result? You become a better person or more corrupt?

Again, that is your belief. But what *evidence* do you have that this is correct?

If anything, the belief in curses and blessings seems to be the mark of someone who is *way* too superstitious.

I’d like to grow some apples, what do I do? Get some apple seed and good soil, plant it and take care of it. Not superstitious. Superstition is if you break a mirror it’s bad luck, or Friday the 13th is a bad day or walking under a ladder etc.

 

[Polymath257]

I was dead and now I’m alive so yes I have evidence. I didn’t deliver myself but God did and I’m alive to tell it. I wasn’t physically dead but in every other way, now I’m alive.

So, you weren't dead. You changed your beliefs and feel better for it.

Others change their beliefs the other way and feel better that way as well.

Lesson? Feeling better after a change of belief doesn't mean you found the truth.

I got married and made a covenant with God to be faithful to my wife and her with me. We are covered by God and have received blessing upon blessing. Before that I lived a promiscuous life that resulted in disease and other negative consequences, no thanks. I like my life now. Man what a difference life is now compared to the first 28 years of my life. Maybe it has been some sort of experiment because I’ve lived God’s Word out and He is faithful just like He said. You reap what you sow, pretty simple.

Yes, being responsible and honest leads to a better life than the other choice. This has nothing to do with religion. it seems to me that you are mistaking a change from irresponsibility to responsibility to be the same as a change from non-god-belief to god-belief.

What happens when you steal, lie, cheat, murder, get drunk? Good things or bad things result? You become a better person or more corrupt? Or the opposite generous, faithful, forgiving, honest? Good things happen and your conscience is clear.

And what does that have to do with a deity? Nothing at all from what i can see. If you are irresponsible, you won't do well.

What you don't seem to grasp is that my conscience is clear and I have no god-belief. it is clear because I care for others, try to be a better person, learn about the world around me, and such things. Religion, however, I have found to be a distraction from being a good person.

 

[ElishaElijah]

So, you weren't dead. You changed your beliefs and feel better for it.

Others change their beliefs the other way and feel better that way as well.

Lesson? Feeling better after a change of belief doesn't mean you found the truth.



Yes, being responsible and honest leads to a better life than the other choice. This has nothing to do with religion. it seems to me that you are mistaking a change from irresponsibility to responsibility to be the same as a change from non-god-belief to god-belief.



And what does that have to do with a deity? Nothing at all from what i can see. If you are irresponsible, you won't do well.

What you don't seem to grasp is that my conscience is clear and I have no god-belief. it is clear because I care for others, try to be a better person, learn about the world around me, and such things. Religion, however, I have found to be a distraction from being a good person.

I had a belief of life without God and it ended up in shipwreck. Then called out to God or Jesus Christ and He delivered me and showed me how to life a different way and His way has resulted in blessing so think what you want but He makes it clear in His Word how to live.
“Blessed is the one who does not walk in step with the wicked or stand in the way that sinners take or sit in the company of mockers, but whose delight is in the law of the Lord, and who meditates on his law day and night. That person is like a tree planted by streams of water, which yields its fruit in season and whose leaf does not wither— whatever they do prospers. Not so the wicked! They are like chaff that the wind blows away. Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous. For the Lord watches over the way of the righteous, but the way of the wicked leads to destruction.”
‭‭Psalms‬ ‭1:1-6‬ ‭NIV‬‬
Truth and this is what God showed me and has come to pass.