Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Mister Emu said:
it was me but I deleted my posts.
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Ask a Mormon! (Part Two)
- Thread starter Bishka
- Start date
it was me but I deleted my posts.
FFH
Veteran Member
This is a great point you've brought up...which leaves a little doubt as to whether we (our spirits) are the literal offspring of God....Mr. Emu said:
John 1: 14
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Jesus Christ was the only begotten of the Father.
If we try to define this term it reads..
Jesus Christ was the only literal offspring of the Father, which would leave no room for us to also be the literal offspring of the Father.
Unless we inserted the term earthly between literal and offspring.
Jesus Christ was the only literal earthly offspring of the Father.
In which case this would leave room for us to be the literal spirit offspring of the Father.
The key to understanding this is to determine whether the Father was referring to His Son as being a literal spirit offspring or a literal earthly offspring.
I believe the Father refers to Jesus Christ as His only literal earthly offspring, so that we know, without a doubt, no other children of His were literally and immaculately conceived on earth.
Our Heavenly Father uses the term "only begotten" to reassure us that Mary was the only one to have conceived and born an earthly child for Him..
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Do Mormons believe that Jesus is a creation of the Father?
FFH
Veteran Member
Jesus Christ is referred to as our "elder brother" in LDS theology. This would indicate that He was also a literal spirit offspring of the Father, and had to come to earth, just as we have done, in order to obtain a literal earthly physical body to house His spirit. Jesus Christ is the only one with a Heavenly Father, not an earthly one, who has begotten Him.Mister Emu said:
We are not literally and physically begotten of our Heavenly Father, for we have an earthly father who has literally and physically "begotten" us so to speak...
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Mister Emu said:
We believe that Jesus is the firstborn of the spirit children of God (which were spiritually begotten) and that the Father is the literal father (as Katzpur explained earlier) of His physical body.
We do not think anything was actually created if you would like to be exacting. We believe that everything was assembled or organized, since matter cannot be created nor destroyed. We believe that matter is eternal.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
FFH said:
nah, I think you end up in the right spot, you just use circular logic to get there. Becky has already smacked me around for messing up her threads.
That leads me to this question.
Does the LDS teach that God cannot circumvent natural law?
Could God destroy the universe and all the matter within? Or was that a generalization?
Why would that be the case?
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Mister Emu said:
LDS doctrine teaches that God is omnipotent. The scripture Soup is referring to is one concerning God being unjust (alma 42) or being unchanging (Mormon 9).
I have a much more involved answer but it would only serve to complicate things. How about this - we may have a different view on what natural law actually is. In other words, God would not have to circumvent natural law in order to do whatever he chooses with the matter in the universe.
Now, whether or not He could destroy the universe and all the matter within? I have no idea. The D&C says that the elements are eternal.
93: 33 For man is spirit. The elements are eternal, and spirit and element, inseparably connected, receive a fulness of joy;
Do you believe God could create matter? Destroy it?
Thanks for your answer, jsut trying to clarify things here
FFH
Veteran Member
God does not need to overide natural law to destroy something.Mister Emu said:
Just replace the word destroy with disassemble or remove.
For instance God can destroy (disassemble/remove) cancer from our bodies.
I believe in such a case God disassambles the particles and removes them so as to be harmless.
All matter can be assembled and disassembled or removed to another location.
When God destroys something, no matter is lost, but simply changed into a different form..
Likewise when God creates something, no matter is gained, but simply changed into a different form.
It's the same with water, when we use it, nothing is ever gained or lost, but only recirculates. If we try to "destroy" it (see how this term can be misused) it simply changes forms.
*sigh*
I am sorry, I apologize for being obscure.
My question isn't really a matter of does, but of can.
I am sorry, I apologize for being obscure.
My question isn't really a matter of does, but of can.
FFH
Veteran Member
Good question...I don't think there is any LDS scripture which deals with this specifically, but there are only scriptures which talk of matter as eternal, meaning it has always existed and will always exist, therefore we can deduct that it is impoossible for God to "destroy" it.Mister Emu said:
Can God make matter not exist. In my opinion no.
Just as we cannot make water not exist, but can only change it's form.
Comprehend
Res Ipsa Loquitur
Mister Emu said:
Our doctrine says that God is Omnipotent. Which would mean that he can our could.
Thanks both of you
Really though, thanks. This is the first place I have heard of anyone saying matter is eternal... lots to digest, you all have a good night... I'll be back
Really though, thanks. This is the first place I have heard of anyone saying matter is eternal... lots to digest, you all have a good night... I'll be back
FFH
Veteran Member
There is a good LDS scripture which talks about spirit matter as being matter that is more refined and we are only able to discern or detect this refined matter with our spirit, or more refined, eyes, which sometimes God gives us in order to see into the spirit realm, for instance if you have ever seen someone who has passed on then your eyes were transformed, temporarily, into more refined matter, in order to see into the spirit world/realm, which is all around us.Emu said: