Assisted Suicide - Yay or Nay?

[Straw Dog]

Yay and nay depending. Sometimes suffering has purpose.

Would the particular suicide be serving the well-being of life?

If it is someone suffering from a terminal disease and they have become too weak to help themselves, much less others, then they may act towards assisted suicide rather than continue suffering for no purpose.

However, the vast majority of suicidal thoughts and attempts are misguided and unjustified.

 

[Leftimies]

Wrong.

Most suicide attempts fail, often with awful consequences.

I suggest that if you ever do decide to end your life, do some real research first, or you will probably be one of that very large number who screw it up and make things even worse.

"No, not me, I'm smart"

If you were that smart you would not have expressed such a misinformed opinion.

"It seems pretty simple to me".

Yeah, I'm sure it does ... things often seem that way when you don't investigate them. Check the statistics for yourself.

I would not kill myself in the first place. I am going to die in any case, I would rather wait for it. Ending one's life is quite pointless, unless one is in extreme physical pain and injury.

Did I say I am smart? I don't recall that, yet you put it with nifty quotation marks.

Do tell me, how can one fail in death from jumping off a cliff, say, 50 meters tall? Honestly. I am very curious.

 

[John Doe]

I would not kill myself in the first place. I am going to die in any case, I would rather wait for it. Ending one's life is quite pointless, unless one is in extreme physical pain and injury.

Did I say I am smart? I don't recall that, yet you put it with nifty quotation marks.

Do tell me, how can one fail in death from jumping off a cliff, say, 50 meters tall? Honestly. I am very curious.

So if your grandmother is suffering in a hospital or aged care home, you will advise her to go jump off a cliff ?

Sweet.

 

[John Doe]

Ending one's life is quite pointless, unless one is in extreme physical pain and injury.

Really ? So it isn't just a lifestyle choice ?

 

[Leftimies]

So if your grandmother is suffering in a hospital or aged care home, you will advise her to go jump off a cliff ?

Sweet.

I think euthanasia and assisted suicide bear different connotations: euthanasia is thought as an institutionalised method practiced by professionals; assisted suicide can occur in a garage of a suburb when John asks Jack to shoot him between the eyes. I was kind of expecting us to discuss the latter.

Institutionalised euthanasia has its problems though, and can become a structural body subject to abuse. But I do believe in death with dignity, when it comes to troubled elderly people.

 

[Amechania]

Just to be a pain it's really "yea or nay" not "Yay! or nay" Assisted suicide, yay!

 

[psychoslice]

I think euthanasia and assisted suicide bear different connotations: euthanasia is thought as an institutionalised method practiced by professionals; assisted suicide can occur in a garage of a suburb when John asks Jack to shoot him between the eyes. I was kind of expecting us to discuss the latter.

Institutionalised euthanasia has its problems though, and can become a structural body subject to abuse. But I do believe in death with dignity, when it comes to troubled elderly people.

I think you need to go to a hospital and watch how people die, and listen to the death rattle as they try to breath, my mother couldn't breath and we had to hold her down as she was trying to get out of bed, she then just fell back onto the bed and stopped breathing, we thought she was dead so I closed her eye's, then she started to breath again, and we had to go through the whole thing all over again, this happened three times before she finally died.

 

[Leftimies]

I think you need to go to a hospital and watch how people die, and listen to the death rattle as they try to breath, my mother couldn't breath and we had to hold her down as she was trying to get out of bed, she then just fell back onto the bed and stopped breathing, we thought she was dead so I closed her eye's, then she started to breath again, and we had to go through the whole thing all over again, this happened three times before she finally died.

Thus I said "i believe in death with dignity", you know, as approval of euthanasia in those cases.

 

[psychoslice]

Thus I said "i believe in death with dignity", you know, as approval of euthanasia in those cases.

I'm glad you agree, and I hope many more will also, this really needs to be looked at for the dignity of millions of people who will die in pain and much discomfort.

 

[Poisonshady313]

I think euthanasia and assisted suicide bear different connotations: euthanasia is thought as an institutionalised method practiced by professionals; assisted suicide can occur in a garage of a suburb when John asks Jack to shoot him between the eyes. I was kind of expecting us to discuss the latter.

Sounds like consensual homicide.

I say nay.

If a person can't commit suicide on their own, they shouldn't ask anyone to do it for them unless they're asking a medical professional to put them out of their misery because there's no other option.

 

[Revoltingest]

Sounds like consensual homicide.

I say nay.

If a person can't commit suicide on their own, they shouldn't ask anyone to do it for them unless they're asking a medical professional to put them out of their misery because there's no other option.

Who needs a doctor or nurse to come in & do for $5,000 what one of my friends will do for free?
Hmmm....I intended that to be a rhetorical question, but there is an answer: The AMA.

 

[Poisonshady313]

Who needs a doctor or nurse to come in & do for $5,000 what one of my friends will do for free?
Hmmm....I intended that to be a rhetorical question, but there is an answer: The AMA.

Perhaps if there were Kevorkian style video records of individuals asking to be put out of their misery...

You don't want people using "but he asked me to" as a defense in a murder trial. If it's consensual, there ought to be proof.

 

[Revoltingest]

Perhaps if there were Kevorkian style video records of individuals asking to be put out of their misery...
You don't want people using "but he asked me to" as a defense in a murder trial. If it's consensual, there ought to be proof.

That's a solvable problem.

 

[Leftimies]

Sounds like consensual homicide.

I say nay.

If a person can't commit suicide on their own, they shouldn't ask anyone to do it for them unless they're asking a medical professional to put them out of their misery because there's no other option.

Yes, this was my opinion too. I also tend to be of opinion that suicide outside extreme reasons is never constructive, because it will traumatise others who don't have luxury of not bearing witness to the mess left behind.

As others have pointed out, if you are on your deathbed, having prolonged battle against a disease you cannot possibly win, and even if you did you would die soon anyways, there is no reason why euthanasia would not be morally valid option. Hell, wouldn't it be the only morally valid option?

I sure would prefer to leave the physical misery behind with my lover's face and handholding being the last thing i see and feel. Out on my own terms.

In any other case, I tend to be of nay opinion. I guess this is one of those multifaceted questions where it really does depend a lot.

 

[John Doe]

Would someone like to tell me why a person is obliged to live ?

 

[Leftimies]

Would someone like to tell me why a person is obliged to live ?

It is kind of idea of building the world together for (more or less) universally desired better future. If you don't do it for yourself, then do it for others who wish for better life. You can always help others (once again, assuming that it is not a case of physically challenging medical condition and that everything is, basically, fine).

It is a form of altruism.

 

[BSM1]

It is kind of idea of building the world together for (more or less) universally desired better future. If you don't do it for yourself, then do it for others who wish for better life. You can always help others (once again, assuming that it is not a case of physically challenging medical condition and that everything is, basically, fine).

It is a form of altruism.

Wouldn't this be an example of expecting everyone to embrace your concept of existence?

 

[Gjallarhorn]

"When a human being takes his life in depression, this is a natural death of spiritual causes. The modern barbarity of 'saving' the suicidal is based on a hair-raising misapprehension of the nature of existence." -Zapffe

Yea, to all scenarios.

 

[Leftimies]

Wouldn't this be an example of expecting everyone to embrace your concept of existence?

Yes, it is, I suppose. I am happy as hell that I didn't act on my suicidal thoughts back when I went through bad depression. I would've missed out a world worth of experience and wonder.

Your basic emo case of suicide is arrogance based on lack of experience - if the person was humble and experienced, he'd probably wait and see, giving a chance to the impermanence of things. Impermanence also extends to suffering and depression, it too, is impermanent.

I was arrogant in this sense in my worst years. I am happy that life humbled me.

 

[BSM1]

Yes, it is, I suppose. I am happy as hell that I didn't act on my suicidal thoughts back when I went through bad depression. I would've missed out a world worth of experience and wonder.

Your basic emo case of suicide is arrogance based on lack of experience - if the person was humble and experienced, he'd probably wait and see, giving a chance to the impermanence of things. Impermanence also extends to suffering and depression, it too, is impermanent.

I was arrogant in this sense in my worst years. I am happy that life humbled me.

Not to split hairs (I'm glad you're here) but how do you know that the other side isn't so much better? A paradise?