Atheism doesn't exist?:)

[Darkforbid]

Of course i do, they tried to kill my children.

They drove me from the church i loved.

Did their god belief try to kill my children? Did their god belief mock my disability? Sure the bible has him as a genocidal maniac who condones rape, slavery and theft but in real life was it their god belief Or was it Christians?

But feel free to twist the implication it in whatever way massages your ego, you usually do

And the country you live in didn't condemn until 2001. They are only now addressing the countries effacement of their slavery 'The government’s announcement comes after years of frustration in France’s black community — one of the largest in Europe — over what they consider the effacement of a traumatic history.

Pot and kettle come to mind

 

[Rabbi Daniel]

Very hard to have a decent, and smart discussion, if after an argument, we get : maybe you are in a matrix and all those B.S.
But all those stupid arguments may not prevent a person from his/her moral obligation
Imagine in a trial: You robbed a bank and you are guilty. No judge, my brain was controlled by a computer.
But that's O.K, guys. I am happy to be with you

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Very hard to have a decent, and smart discussion, if after an argument, we get : maybe you are in a matrix and all those B.S.
But all those stupid arguments may not prevent a person from his/her moral obligation
Imagine in a trial: You robbed a bank and you are guilty. No judge, my brain was controlled by a computer.

You started this by talking about absolute certainty. Do you want to talk about practical certainty instead?

Edit: the idea of a god is no less ridiculous and absurd to me than the idea that we're living in the Matrix. Regardless, I can't absolutely reject either possibility with perfect certainty.

But that's O.K, guys. I am happy to be with you

Good that one of us is happy; I'm starting to get annoyed with you.

 

[ChristineM]

And the country you live in didn't condemn until 2001. They are only now addressing the countries effacement of their slavery 'The government’s announcement comes after years of frustration in France’s black community — one of the largest in Europe — over what they consider the effacement of a traumatic history.

Pot and kettle come to mind

Yes, majority christian country despite the secularist leanings of the constitution. Thanks for mentioning it

So you think it ok for Christians to (attempt to) kill innocent children???

You think its ok for Christians to mock disability of young child???

So much so you have to mock the post that mentions it. Can i ask, are you christian by any chance?

Oh and i moved to france in 2015, how dies that impact on your bigotry?

And i do not know your location, you seem reticent to disclose it in your profile for some reason. I wonder why that is?

 

[Darkforbid]

Yes, majority christian country despite the secularist leanings of the constitution. Thanks for mentioning it

So you think it ok for Christians to (attempt to) kill innocent children???

You think its ok for Christians to mock disability of young child???

So much so you have to mock the post that mentions it. Can i ask, are you christian by any chance?

Oh and i moved to france in 2015, how dies that impact on your bigotry?

And i do not know your location, you seem reticent to disclose it in your profile for some reason. I wonder why that is?

I don't hide anything! I'm fully Googlable

But please tell me how Christianity tried to murder your children

 

[ChristineM]

I don't hide anything! I'm fully Googlable

View attachment 36265
But please tell me how Christianity tried to murder your children

Ok so i dont click your profile, instead i must be a mind-reader and go searching for it. No thanks, you aren't worth the time.

The stories of how christians tried to kill my children and incidentally succeeded in removing my aunts arm are available on this forum, all you need to do is search.

 

[Darkforbid]

Ok so i dont click your profile, instead i must be a mind-reader and go searching for it. No thanks, you aren't worth the time.

The stories of how christians tried to kill my children and incidentally succeeded in removing my aunts arm are available on this forum, all you need to do is search.

Like I haven't posted the same info before you ask me if I'm a Christian every time I post

And I've searched your name, children and murder it showed no link like you've claimed

 

[ChristineM]

Like I haven't posted the same info before you ask me if I'm a Christian every time I post

And I've searched your name, children and murder it showed no link like you've claimed

Tough

 

[Darkforbid]

Tough

I'll just assume you're taking rubbish then

Not that that's new

 

[ChristineM]

I'll just assume you're taking rubbish then

Not that that's new

You can assume what you want, just remembered what they say about assuming?

I wonder if i were a christian whether you would be just as assuming?

 

[ChristineM]

Like I haven't posted the same info before you ask me if I'm a Christian every time I post

And I've searched your name, children and murder it showed no link like you've claimed

BTW

I have just done a search and found several threads with details, do you want a lesson on how to use the RF search function?

 

[Darkforbid]

You can assume what you want, just remembered what they say about assuming?

I wonder if i were a christian whether you would be just as assuming?

Silly question. Obviously I'd be very interested in attempted murder by any Christian Church. Either you bull****ing or being completely honest

 

[Darkforbid]

BTW

I have just done a search and found several threads with details, do you want a lesson on how to use the RF search function?

Go on then

 

[ChristineM]

Silly question. Obviously I'd be very interested in attempted murder by any Christian Church. Either you bull****ing or being completely honest

Is it a silly question?

I have no god to lie for so i have no need to lie, assume from that what you will

 

[ChristineM]

Go on then

Enter one keyword/phrase (i think your error was searching for "children and murder" i have never written those words as a phrase)
Click the search icon alongside the keyword/phrase
Enter posted by member.
I guess to keep the results manageable you could limit the search to this year
Click search

 

[lukethethird]

Catchy title. A-theism means something like No theism. And it's rare maybe almost impossible that somebody would not believe in God 100%. Not even a 0.01% that maybe God created this world.
And if he/she thinks that there is a very small percentage so, than it's not atheism; and still he/she will call himself an atheist.
BTW, a famous said or wrote something like that.

If there were no theists running around saying there are invisible gods out there, there would be no atheists saying I don't believe you. No theists, no atheists, that simple.

Atheism is predicated on there being theists.

 

[Darkforbid]

Is it a silly question?

I have no god to lie for so i have no need to lie, assume from that what you will

So you loved the church you claimed drove you out,, and because of the actions of that church you now have no God. Atheist based on resentment. Most atheists I know would tell you that's something you need to get through before making a decision to become atheist

 

[ChristineM]

So you loved the church you claimed drove you out,, and because of the actions of that church you now have no God. Atheist based on resentment. Most atheists I know would tell you that's something you need to get through before making a decision to become atheist

Nope, atheist based on reading the bible. It is very revealing about the type of person it manipulates into mocking disability. Of that i want no part.

But feel free to make bigoted assumptions

 

[Darkforbid]

Nope, atheist based on reading the bible. It is very revealing about the type of person it manipulates into mocking disability. Of that i want no part.

But feel free to make bigoted assumptions

Tell you what I'll just post your claim of attempted child murder to the relevant authorities. It's not like there ignore claims like that

Done

 

[Windwalker]

Thanks. That makes your inability to understand my position understandable to me. And maybe, possible for me to explain my position to you. I was in a similar position to you.

Based on what you say, I actually very much doubt you have been in any position close to my own, but I could be wrong. I also don't think I have an inability to understand your position. The only thing I have said is that for anyone to reject the idea of God, they have to have an idea in their minds of what that looks like. You quote the Tao Te Ching in a minute. I'll agree with that and explain why in a minute. But I'll say here, that to say you are an atheist (or agnostic), you are naming the Tao. The Tao Te Ching does not say God does not exist. It is not teaching atheism.

I had an image of god based on what theists had told me about their image and based on their scripture. And often in discussion, when I had said "god is X" or "god did Y" the answer was: "But that is not the god I believe in.". I had, unwittingly, stawmaned their position.
So I tried to steelman the theists position by trying to find those properties all their images of god had in common. And guess what, I came up with an empty set. My logical response was that I stopped having an image of god. I had to force myself because every image I would have, would be a straw man for at least some theists.

Getting rid of an image of God is in fact the path of the world's mystics in many of the world's religion. Meister Eckhart the Christian mystic, for instance said, "I pray God make me free of God that I may know God in his unconditioned being". While that is paradoxical in nature, it makes perfect sense from a nondual perspective. Apophatic approaches to the Absolute, or the Divine, or the Tao, or apply any other name to it, "God", is to negate any and all mental ideas you have of God, in order to allow what simply is to enter into your awareness unaffected by mental images. This is a practice used within meditation.

That is not what atheism or agnosticism is doing at all. It has a very specific idea of what "God" is, in saying it does not exist. They are not saying you should not name the Tao, because that makes "it" a mental object as opposed to Reality. That's hardly the case. Do you consider atheism an intended path to Enlightenment or spiritual Awakening?

You are half way on that road.

Or I could be several roadways further along that journey, having completed that road many years ago now. You shouldn't assume to know where I am at.

You have admitted that you have a mental image. You just have to learn that that image is wrong (in that it is not consensus among theists). Every image you could have is wrong. Just get rid of them. "The Dao that can be named is not the Dao." - Lao Tse

I find it pleasing you quote from the Tao Te Ching. I find myself very much adopting to Taoist philosphy as a spiritual path through my daily Tajiiquan practice. Let me try to share some more to see if maybe the idea you have of how I believe might be helped.

First, whatever mental image of God I may choose to have at any given time, is not a matter of right versus wrong. I simply do not think in those strict, radical dualistic terms. If one recognizes that one has a mental image, and understands the nature of metal images and the purpose, not as descriptors of reality, but as metaphors to point to a Reality wholly beyond those images, then they have a viable, functional, and important purpose. So long as you recognize them as simply mental constructs.

I mentioned the path of negation above. You find this in the teachings of Christianity, as well a Buddhism from Nargarjuna, where he sets to deconstruct all ideas we have about the Absolute in order to get rid of us looking to our ideas for answers. You have the same thing in Hinduism with "Neti Neti", that God is "not this, not that". But you also have, using Christian parlance, a cataphatic approach. That is to say God with qualities, or to say something positive about it.

When I choose to speak about or think mentally about the divine, those images are highly fluid and dynamic, not fixed and set in theological stones. I understand they are not definitions, nor descriptors of God. But they do provide some value and benefit. It's when they are gotten rid of, that's in mystical experience so as to not allow them to interfere. In short, if you are looking to a mental image of God with an expectation that experience should match that, you're never going any further than that mental image. You're not seeing God. You're seeing your own mind.

None of that whatsoever fits in with atheism or agnosticism. Do you relate to any of that? Have you walked on that road yet, the road beyond all beliefs about what is true and real? Do you practice mediation, or some other spiritual path into the deep inner spaces beyond time and thought? Then "The Tao that can be named is not the Tao", is meaningless to that. The Tao Te Ching is not saying "There is no Tao". It affirms its reality, without naming it (even though paradoxically it does - which proves my point about you have to be able to same something.)