Atheism is not a default position

[Thief]

Sure. I do believe in God, but that is irrelevant. We are saying that atheism does not require saying this. It merely required a "lack of belief".

Now you are playing a word game.

I believe the angelic have far less patience than I do in such matters.....

Belief has consequence.
Denial has consequence.

Shall we be adult about it?

 

[leibowde84]

So go back and delete....

Again ... can you please try to write more coherently. I have no idea what you mean like this. Why would I delete my comments? You sound crazy.

 

[Thief]

We are discussing those that say I have not been convinced that belief in God is warranted. They don't believe that God does not exist or cannot exist, as that would be ridiculous all the same, as anything is possible. They mere lack a belief in the existence of God.

It remains a declaration.....consequence pending....

 

[leibowde84]

Now you are playing a word game.

I believe the angelic have far less patience than I do in such matters.....

Belief has consequence.
Denial has consequence.

Shall we be adult about it?

We aren't discussing denial. So how is that relevant?

 

[leibowde84]

It remains a declaration.....consequence pending....

Why would there being a consequence matter?

 

[Thief]

We aren't discussing denial. So how is that relevant?

Say to me..... there is no God.
as if you understand the denial.....

 

[Blastcat]

We are discussing those that say I have not been convinced that belief in God is warranted. They don't believe that God does not exist or cannot exist, as that would be ridiculous all the same, as anything is possible. They mere lack a belief in the existence of God.

And what is your position on the appropriate default position on truth claims?

 

[leibowde84]

It remains a declaration.....consequence pending....

So babies who die are punished?

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Well, the PROBLEM I see that your having with the idea is the way that you USE "dis".

I'm fine with all of your logical explanations of why the words mean what they mean, etc.

But let's just take a look at the reasons someone might want to advocate the position that a baby, or indeed anyone in the "default" state we've been discussing, can be deemed "atheist". The reasons are, as far as I have seen, to further or strengthen the atheist argument or position. And THIS is what I take issue with. It is COMPLETELY MEANINGLESS to say babies and the completely uninformed make the realm of "atheists" a very strong category or large group, or that the community of people who consider themselves atheist is better off for having babies and the uninformed among our ranks.

And therefore, it is completely useless to use that idea in any argument on behalf of the stance atheism.

The theists: "We've got God on our side!"
The atheists: "But we've got all the babies! Hahahahaha! Aren't we clever?"

And the answer... no. No you are not.

 

[leibowde84]

And what is your position on the appropriate default position on truth claims?

Atheism.

 

[Blastcat]

Say to me..... there is no God.
as if you understand the denial.....

It's almost impossible to fill your request if it isn't at all CLEAR what you mean.
Not being clear doesn't help your case.


CAN you clarify please?

 

[leibowde84]

I'm fine with all of your logical explanations of why the words mean what they mean, etc.

But let's just take a look at the reasons someone might want to advocate the position that a baby, or indeed anyone in the "default" state we've been discussing, can be deemed "atheist". The reasons are, as far as I have seen, to further or strengthen the atheist argument or position. And THIS is what I take issue with. It is COMPLETELY MEANINGLESS to say babies and the completely uninformed make the realm of "atheists" a very strong category or large group, or that the community of people who consider themselves atheist is better off for having babies and the uninformed among our ranks.

And therefore, it is completely useless to use that idea in any argument on behalf of the stance atheism.

The theists: "We've got God on our side!"
The atheists: "But we've got all the babies! Hahahahaha! Aren't we clever?"

And the answer... no. No you are not.

That is another straw man. We are talking about semantics, there is no agenda. And the reverse could be said about your position.

 

[Thief]

So babies who die are punished?

nay....of such as these is made the kingdom of heaven..

and let's be adult....and drop the baby thing....again.

 

[Thief]

Atheism.

that response makes you a closet nonbeliever.

 

[leibowde84]

nay....of such as these is made the kingdom of heaven..

and let's be adult....and drop the baby thing....again.

That is the topic.

 

[leibowde84]

that response makes you a closet nonbeliever.

Care to support this a bit? Because I think you are incorrect ... big time.

 

[Thief]

The declaration..... there is no God.....
is a belief.

 

[Thief]

Belief takes consideration.
Your thoughts and feelings are your own responsibility.

I believe we stand before God a heaven....with every thought and feeling revealed.

 

[leibowde84]

The declaration..... there is no God.....
is a belief.

Sure it is. But we never claimed otherwise. Many lack a belief in God without making that declaration. Choice between the two options you cite is not required.

 

[leibowde84]

Belief takes consideration.
Your thoughts and feelings are your own responsibility.

I believe we stand before God a heaven....with every thought and feeling revealed.

This is irrelevant to the topic.