Atheist by birth?

[idav]

And how is that different from many gods that are no longer believed in?

As far as I know, Pinocchio was never considered to be a real boy. Fairies weren't obviously made up by someone as a fictional character, like the example given, and thus are a more accurate analog to gods.

Oh I know that is why if something just started floating in my room for no apparent reason gods and fairies would be one of first things that come to mind along with demons, aliens and government/NASA.

 

[jarofthoughts]

I tend to be more of a naturalist even in regards to whatever the source for existence might be.

Sure, but when we consider what is real and not, and plausibly so, we need some criteria to work from.
And I don't see a whole lot of difference between the gods of modern religions and things we generally now call mythology.

 

[blackout]

This whole snipe hunt you've led us on has been off-topic.


Off the top of my head, acknowledging that babies and rocks are atheists refutes the claim that they're Muslim, which I've heard some Muslims make.

Yes: originally, it meant someone who didn't believe in the mainstream god(s) of that particular society: to the Romans, Christians were "atheists" because they didn't believe in the Roman pantheon.

In more modern European history (i.e. the last thousand years or so), "atheist" generally meant "non-Christian", and since baptism was the rite of initiation into the Christian religion, a newborn, unbaptized baby would have been an atheist.


What you are and what you identify as are two separate things. They don't necessarily have to be the same.

So baptism makes a baby a theist?

 

[idav]

Sure, but when we consider what is real and not, and plausibly so, we need some criteria to work from.
And I don't see a whole lot of difference between the gods of modern religions and things we generally now call mythology.

No not much difference. It is mythology and should be seen that way. Not to knock on mythology cause they aren't just stories that talk about origins or attempts at explaining the natural world but they are usually dealing with moral issues as well. We could learn something from it, that is if we aren't insistent on learning things the hard way all the time.

 

[idav]

So baptism makes a baby a theist?

Possibly since the baby would be endowed with the holy spirit or God like trinitarians like to say. Really it was about keeping those unbelieving/atheist babies out of hell.

 

[blackout]

Possibly since the baby would be endowed with the holy spirit or God like trinitarians like to say. Really it was about keeping those unbelieving/atheist babies out of hell.

Well you can always baptize a baby in the womb.

It's already immersed in water.

Therefore a baby could be born a theist.


(really doesn't know why she is back in this crazy talk thread)

 

[idav]

Well you can always baptize a baby in the womb.

It's already immersed in water.

Therefore a baby could be born a theist.


(really doesn't know why she is back in this crazy talk thread)

That is a good point and goes well with the symbolism of being reborn of water and spirit. Of course it makes more sense when you take such things symbolically.

Sure does take a lot of pages to point out that babies are (not)theist/(a)theist.

 

[outhouse]

So baptism makes a baby a theist?

No, it makes the parents think it is

 

[outhouse]

Well you can always baptize a baby in the womb.

It's already immersed in water.

Therefore a baby could be born a theist.


(really doesn't know why she is back in this crazy talk thread)

your bored as I am.



until a child makes a decision about deities, one would still be a atheist in the absense of theism.


My daughter is about to turn 5, she was in a christian day care who influenced her. Mother had her baptised. She has heard the word "god and jesus" but still doesnt believe or have a opinion of her own yet. Both me and her lack theism at this point. I contend we are both atheist.

There is a good chance my daughter will never be a theist.


by those who appose baby atheist, at what age would someone without theism, be labeled as a atheist????? please set up the qualifier that no dictionary has.

 

[outhouse]

in other words, you are born non-theistic and you remain non-theistic, then you are a atheist.

my point is that nothing was ever learned and the person never changed from birth. You dont learn to be a non-theist there are no lessons.


theism is the learned trait that changed your default vaules.

 

[Revoltingest]

in other words, you are born non-theistic and you remain non-theistic, then you are a atheist.
my point is that nothing was ever learned and the person never changed from birth. You dont learn to be a non-theist there are no lessons.
theism is the learned trait that changed your default vaules.

That's how I see it too.
But it's not the only way.

 

[outhouse]

That's how I see it too.
But it's not the only way.

I agree with you.

 

[Revoltingest]

I agree with you.

Well, what fun is that?

 

[outhouse]

Well, what fun is that?

im bored, not that bored lol :jester5:

 

[Acim]

in other words, you are born non-theistic and you remain non-theistic, then you are a atheist.

my point is that nothing was ever learned and the person never changed from birth. You dont learn to be a non-theist there are no lessons.


theism is the learned trait that changed your default vaules.

Alright, only cause you're bored do I offer this up.

Science (and method) are learned traits that changed your default values. You were ascientific at birth, and nothing was ever learned to make you ascientific. You don't learn to be non scientific, you simply might get indoctrinated into this way of (falsely) looking at the world and yourself. But it's okay, you can always unlearn. The beauty of the default position.

Oh, and same goes for socialism.
And for heterosexuality. You can unlearn it and be the bisexual you were born to be.

 

[outhouse]

You were ascientific at birth,

wrong

at birth a baby is all about cause and effect.

hey im out of my warm cozy surroundings and im hungry, ERRaaa um wait a second, does this finger fix that? no.

hey whats this tasty thing here, num num num num. ill be looking into more of this later after a nap lol.

The beauty of the default position

scientific thinking is natural and doesnt have to be learned. only refined with education.

only cause you're bored do I offer this up.

im not that bored

 

[Valjean]

and what would reincarnation have to do with the existence of God? Could be a natural, process with an understandable mechanism.

 

[Acim]

wrong

at birth a baby is all about cause and effect.

hey im out of my warm cozy surroundings and im hungry, ERRaaa um wait a second, does this finger fix that? no.

hey whats this tasty thing here, num num num num. ill be looking into more of this later after a nap lol.

Really? You're going with that?
Wow, you really were bored to be that silly.

scientific thinking is natural and doesnt have to be learned. only refined with education.

Yeah, that scientific method is visible all around nature, ainna?

 

[blackout]

I'm pretty sure I came out knowing I was God/dess.

 

[outhouse]

I'm pretty sure I came out knowing I was God/dess.

dang right baby!!!!


And thats why we love you!