Believing in Santa once again.

[Mock Turtle]

You don't lie to your kids unless you have to. Sure sometimes you can't always tell the whole truth after all kids aren't as mature as adults. But in those circumstances you tell the kid what you can and what they can understand. You dont lie to them. And you dont have to lie about Santa. For one that's a really big lie. It involves the kids worldview.

Well you said it all - as to what kids can understand - and why so many parents tell their lies, big or little, and mostly in the belief that they are protecting them. Do you really want small children to know the facts of life as to procreation and for them to experiment? The point about Santa Claus is that it is mostly just fun and most kids do realise at some stage where the presents come from. I doubt so many feel that cheated.

One might make the same argument - always telling the truth - so as to never mention fairies, luck, and so many other things that help in some ways and not in others. Just think of all the traditions that you could banish to the rubbish bin of history if we were all literally truthful all the time. It might start with God for so many and going all the way down to things like 'bad luck to .. whatever'. Would we better off for such or not?

 

[Mock Turtle]

@Mock Turtle
And if you cant tell a kid something then you tell them that. You don't have to lie

As mentioned, it is mostly fun, and small children do much the same when they invent imaginary friends or give 'lives' to their toys, so it it is hardly completely new to them, but perhaps just being one that their parents see value in too.

 

[VoidCat]

Guys im not going to ruin Santa for little kids. I see why people do it. It's just if i adopt kids I'm not going to do Santa cuz of how I feel about it.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Atheists are ignorand and wrong. There is a God.

Everyone is ignorant, atheists included. And you're welcome to believe there is a God.
Imagine if I posted 'Theists are ignorant and wrong. There is no God.'.

Impactful right? You'd likely change your whole belief system in a moment, given how compelling that is. Right? No??

 

[stvdv]

I am regularly told that I should "seek god with an open heart", etc

I did not say that

That's good of you. I wasn't aware that I needed your permission though

I did not say that

 

[stvdv]

Everyone is ignorant, atheists included

Very true, I appreciate honesty

Ignorant:
Especially considering the universe is huge
And human is a speck of dust compared
Knowing close to nothing of its mystery

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Personally speaking, I don't believe in lying to children about Santa or about anything else, and I don't approve of deceiving children into believing in fictional characters, whether it's Santa, the Easter Bunny, or the Tooth Fairy. As a mother of seven children, I think it's best to be honest with my children, and they have learned to be open and honest with me. Our relationship is based on mutual trust and respect. My husband and I never lied to our children by telling them that Santa Claus was a real person. We decided we wouldn't do that when our oldest son was a toddler. We received a lot of backlash around Christmas time for our decision when our children were still young, and we dealt with it. My husband and I have always thought it was hypocritical of other Christian parents who lied to their children about Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy while also teaching their children that lying is a sin and punishing them when caught lying. My husband and I have never believed that "Do as I say, not as I do" is good parenting. Admittedly, it got a little tricky for us when our now 19-year old daughter had an imaginary friend when she was five. As a medium, I knew her imaginary friend wasn't a figment of her imagination, but I never pushed her to believe in her imaginary friend or pushed either of her younger sisters to believe in their imaginary friends. I never lied to them by telling them that their imaginary friends weren't real, because they were real. As long as these imaginary friends were benevolent, I didn't have a problem with them interacting with my children.

 

[JustGeorge]

Guys im not going to ruin Santa for little kids. I see why people do it. It's just if i adopt kids I'm not going to do Santa cuz of how I feel about it.

I haven't done Santa with my younger two. While we attend the Christmas event the extended family puts on, we don't celebrate Christmas in our home anymore.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I know I’m comparing a belief in God to a belief in Santa, but I don’t intend to belittle belief in God. Nor do I necessarily believe that atheists have a monopoly on truth.

Then why do it?

 

[Mock Turtle]

Guys im not going to ruin Santa for little kids. I see why people do it. It's just if i adopt kids I'm not going to do Santa cuz of how I feel about it.

Well just for the record, I very much doubt I would have gone with the Santa fantasy if I'd had children, but then I would have had the problem of how to ensure the kids knew how to deal with those who did believe in such, and so as not to cause frictions - perhaps best to just stay silent - as in many things.

 

[InChrist]

Did you believe in Santa Claus as a kid? My dad and the step mothers I had were all for lying to me and telling me some magical jolly fat man gives me presents once a year. It seems to be tradition amongst many, telling kids to believe in Santa Claus.
Wasn’t it nice? Ignorance is bliss. But, eventually, you grew out of the Santa Claus belief.
Imagine now that you were to try to believe in Santa Claus once again. You miss the gifts. You also miss the idea of an omniscient being judging your morality and rewarding it.
How would you go about believing in Santa Claus once again? You can’t! There is no way, once the truth has been realized.
So why does one ask an atheist to believe in God? Is it not the same as asking an adult to believe in Santa?
Discuss?
I know I’m comparing a belief in God to a belief in Santa, but I don’t intend to belittle belief in God. Nor do I necessarily believe that atheists have a monopoly on truth.

Well, for one thing at Christmas time there are Santa’s everywhere who are people dressed in costumes. Lots of dads, grandfathers and others dress up pretending to be Santa and everyone at some point realizes this.
I don’t know of any human who has played God and actually created as God created heaven and earth. Or know future events. Or resurrect life from death.

 

[InChrist]

Personally speaking, I don't believe in lying to children about Santa or about anything else, and I don't approve of deceiving children into believing in fictional characters, whether it's Santa, the Easter Bunny, or the Tooth Fairy. As a mother of seven children, I think it's best to be honest with my children, and they have learned to be open and honest with me. Our relationship is based on mutual trust and respect. My husband and I never lied to our children by telling them that Santa Claus was a real person. We decided we wouldn't do that when our oldest son was a toddler. We received a lot of backlash around Christmas time for our decision when our children were still young, and we dealt with it. My husband and I have always thought it was hypocritical of other Christian parents who lied to their children about Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy while also teaching their children that lying is a sin and punishing them when caught lying. My husband and I have never believed that "Do as I say, not as I do" is good parenting. Admittedly, it got a little tricky for us when our now 19-year old daughter had an imaginary friend when she was five. As a medium, I knew her imaginary friend wasn't a figment of her imagination, but I never pushed her to believe in her imaginary friend or pushed either of her younger sisters to believe in their imaginary friends. I never lied to them by telling them that their imaginary friends weren't real, because they were real. As long as these imaginary friends were benevolent, I didn't have a problem with them interacting with my children.

We also were truthful with our children concerning Santa, the Easter Bunny, etc. We didn’t make a big deal about it, but just told them those characters were pretend. It was somewhat difficult because our parents (the grandparents) were so into making Santa seem real.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

We also were truthful with our children concerning Santa, the Easter Bunny, etc. We didn’t make a big deal about it, but just told them those characters were pretend. It was somewhat difficult because our parents (the grandparents) were so into making Santa seem real.

My husband and I had a difficult time with my adopted mother when our children were younger because her reaction towards our decision to let our children believe in Santa was "Well, Santa will be real in my house," to which my daring husband replied, "Well, we just won't come to your house for Christmas then." She lost it after he told her that, and she accused him of being completely unfair and fussed about how we were depriving our children of the "magic of Christmas," as she called it. He shrugged her off. We stuck to our guns and didn't go to her house for Christmas for the next two years. On the third year, she relented, but she complained about it while we were there, and she complained to everyone else whether they wanted to hear it or not. We didn't go back to her house for almost 14 years after that because of how badly she treated me and my husband. We're estranged from her and my dad now, which is honestly for the best. My husband and I also experienced some very harsh backlash from other Christian parents in our church.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Belief is irrelevant in both cases: Santa Claus and God. All that matters is faith, and the results that come from engaging in that faith. You either get the gifts, or you don't.

In the case of faith in God, most people find that they get the gifts they need, and so choose to continue placing faith in the God of their choosing.

It's really just that simple. Belief is unnecessary.

That makes little sense.

"Faith" here, is a specific type of belief.
That type being: rationally unjustified belief.

The opposite of faith-based beliefs would be evidence-based beliefs.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Atheists are ignorand and wrong. There is a God.

Great argument you got there...

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

You don't lie to your kids unless you have to. Sure sometimes you can't always tell the whole truth after all kids aren't as mature as adults. But in those circumstances you tell the kid what you can and what they can understand. You dont lie to them. And you dont have to lie about Santa. For one that's a really big lie. It involves the kids worldview.

I can proudly say that while I do play the saint nicolas game (the western european counterpart of "santa", which is actually the original "santa" before he got imported into the US by the dutch and got 'americanized' into santa at christmass, while Saint Nicolas is dec 6), I have never lied to my kids.

I have never told my son that he's real. I also never told him that he isn't. He learns about St Nicolas from pop culture, his friends, tv, etc. And he gets his gifts that we set up at night when he's already sleeping.

But NEVER did I lie.
When he asks me if the dude is actually real, I don't give him an answer. I'll say "what do you think?" and I let him figure it out for himself.

He'll understand soon enough. And he won't be able to say that I lied to him.

 

[InChrist]

My husband and I had a difficult time with my adopted mother when our children were younger because her reaction towards our decision to let our children believe in Santa was "Well, Santa will be real in my house," to which my daring husband replied, "Well, we just won't come to your house for Christmas then." She lost it after he told her that, and she accused him of being completely unfair and fussed about how we were depriving our children of the "magic of Christmas," as she called it. He shrugged her off. We stuck to our guns and didn't go to her house for Christmas for the next two years. On the third year, she relented, but she complained about it while we were there, and she complained to everyone else whether they wanted to hear it or not. We didn't go back to her house for almost 14 years after that because of how badly she treated me and my husband. We're estranged from her and my dad now, which is honestly for the best. My husband and I also experienced some harsh backlash from other Christian parents in our church.

It sounds like you had a very hard time with your adopted mother over Santa/Christmas besides other experiences you’ve shared. We were more fortunate in that while our parents didn’t like some of our way of doing things, they did still love and respect us.. for the most part. When the kids got a little older we started stayed home for Christmas and then went to visit all the grandparents afterwards. It was easy to do it that way because we lived in a different state. I do remember one time, though when my in-laws were visiting for the summer into the Fall, as they had a second home on the property next to ours. We had already told them we did not celebrate Halloween, yet we came home one day to find our house decorated with spiderwebs, spiders, skeletons, witches and various other Halloween decorations. My mother-in-law had come in and decorated while we were in town. We were all rather shocked. I was annoyed. We took the stuff down. We didn’t make a big deal, though, because I think God was already reminding me to show grace and realize not everyone understands or thinks as I do. I realize there are some situations that require definite boundaries, but it that case it didn’t seem her actions were malicious. It was a good opportunity to talk to the kids, though.
I am surprised that you had Christians that got down on you for not doing the Santa thing. I thought it was usually the other way around.

 

[syo]

Great argument you got there...

I see you are an atheist. Can you show to me in a sentence that theism is wrong?

 

[syo]

'Theists are ignorant and wrong. There is no God.'.

Ok. Prove it in a sentence.

 

[PureX]

That makes little sense.

"Faith" here, is a specific type of belief.
That type being: rationally unjustified belief.

The opposite of faith-based beliefs would be evidence-based beliefs.

Faith requires no belief. Faith is based on hope, not on belief.

Belief is just the presumption that what we hope to be so, is so. It's irrational. (And to my mind, dishonest). Whereas faith requires no such pretense. Faith can be fully aware that what we hope to be so may not be. But that it also may be. And if it is, it's worth hoping in. So we do.

If acting on this hope proves valid, and we get the results we'd hoped for, then we will continue to choose to act on our hopes, again. If not, then we will probably change what we are hoping for, or how we are acting on our hopes, or maybe stop hoping all together.

Again, neither belief nor evidence is required for us to choose to act on hope. Which is what faith, is.