Biden Puts the Heat on Settler Violence in the West Bank

[Revoltingest]

Biden's remarkably inhumane and irresponsible handling of the war didn't surprise me, considering that he's an establishment Democrat mostly offering more of the same politics the party has advocated for years. What has surprised me is Bernie Sanders' vote against a ceasefire, after all of these years of positioning himself as a defender of the marginalized and voiceless.

Perhaps Sanders would be more likely to support a ceasefire if someone told him that Fidel Castro was still alive and residing in Gaza.

Bernie is Jewish, so we shouldn't be surprised
that he has more loyalty to The Jewish State
than sympathy for the plight of Palestinians.
Also, his record on civil rights is spotty &
inconsistent with his high sounding rhetoric....

The Angle: Stop Abusing Civil Asset Forfeiture Laws

It’s a huge victory for Land Rover owners everywhere.

slate.com

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Bernie is Jewish, so we shouldn't be surprised
that he has more loyalty to The Jewish State
than sympathy for the plight of Palestinians.
Also, his record on civil rights is spotty &
inconsistent with his high sounding rhetoric....

The Angle: Stop Abusing Civil Asset Forfeiture Laws

It’s a huge victory for Land Rover owners everywhere.

slate.com

I don't know what Bernie's deal is. He flip flops all over the place. He poses as a leftist but acts like a typical DNC establishment type. I've been disappointed with him for years. I voted for him in the primaries.

There's many Jewish anti-Zionists. They just aren't allowed a public platform in the US and aren't spoken about, so we never hear of them. The great scholar Norman Finkelstein is a very passionate defender of the Palestinians, for instance:

("If you had any heart in you, you'd be crying for the Palestinians!")

There's a very insidious push to smear all Jews as Zionists and that's flat out wrong. Zionism is merely a political ideology (and is actually heretical to traditional Judaism, but that's another topic). There's Jews in Israel who oppose it, for example who work in human rights. It needs to be made quite clear that Jewish people and Zionism are two separate things.

 

[Debater Slayer]

Bernie is Jewish, so we shouldn't be surprised
that he has more loyalty to The Jewish State
than sympathy for the plight of Palestinians.
Also, his record on civil rights is spotty &
inconsistent with his high sounding rhetoric....

The Angle: Stop Abusing Civil Asset Forfeiture Laws

It’s a huge victory for Land Rover owners everywhere.

slate.com

I would rather not profile Sanders (or anyone else), so to speak, or assume what his position would be based on ethnicity or religion, but I do think he should be held accountable for his positions regardless of either.

For the same reasons, I wouldn't agree with an overgeneralization such as, "X is a Muslim [or Arab], so we shouldn't be surprised that he has more sympathy for Hamas than for Jewish civilians who were killed by them." Each individual's position expresses them only.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Was there not a cease fire on October 6th?

There was, and in my opinion, the living conditions in Gaza helped to enable Hamas' radicalism to gain foothold. I don't think the use of military force alone will ultimately address the root of the problem, especially not when the vast majority of those killed (whether Palestinians or Israelis) have been civilians.

Unfortunately, I don't believe there's any easy path going forward, and I'm under no illusion that positive change will occur overnight. I would expect it to be a gradual, difficult, and long process.

Yes!

I'm not sure, however, what this observation has to do with the Bernie Sanders opposition to a ceasefire, particularly given that Sanders almost certainly would agree with you as well.

For what it's worth, I found The Nation article on "humanitarian pause" verses "ceasefire" useful. I favor a humanitarian pause, one aimed at

• qualitatively curtailing the current brutal assault on Gaza's non-combatants,
• orchestrating the structured delivery of urgently needed aid to the population at large,
• providing adequate Red Cross access to all hostages, and
• conducting a preliminary evaluation of war crimes claims.

Needless to say, much if not all of this would facilitated by releasing the hostages, an act which might well have preempted much of the post-Oct7th carnage.

Again, October 7th violated a cease-fire. Furthermore, it was a well planned, egregious, and barbaric violation that Hamas and its supporters view with pride. Rewarding Hamas with what would clearly amount to a unilateral ceasefire seems to me tantamount to simply giving them a hall-pass.

 

[Revoltingest]

Again, October 7th violated a cease-fire. Furthermore, it was a well planned, egregious, and barbaric violation that Hamas and its supporters view with pride. Rewarding Hamas with what would clearly amount to a unilateral ceasefire seems to me tantamount to simply giving them a hall-pass.

So you want Israel to continue bombing,
killing, maiming, & destroying?

 

[oldbadger]

When the nazis invaded Poland, and began rounding up the Jews for extermination, it was the Poles themselves that told the nazis who the Jews were, and where they were living, because after the nazis took them away, the Poles that turned them in would steal their homes, and their land, and their belongings.

Now we've come full circle, and it's the Jews that are stealing the homes and the land and the belongings of the Palestinians living around them, as they're being targeted for extermination (as terrorists).

Sadly, yes. After watching the film 'The pianist' and reading the book about a well known musician who was saved by assistance from academic friends, a Jewish policeman, amazing luck and a German officer, the list of countries which banned the book (and film?) was quite a shock to me. Poland, Israel, Lithuania all banned the book. Polish, Lithuanian and Jewish officials all caused great embarrassment to those countries.

 

[Revoltingest]

So the Jews are Nazis now?

There are parallels, eg, fear & loathing for an
enemy means losing humanity & empathy for
that enemy. Impose brutal oppression.
It's happened many times throughout history.
As we see in USA & Israel...Israelis, Jews, &
Christians are not immune to descent into evil.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Was there not a cease fire on October 6th?

Apparently not as Hamas didn't procure that stockpile of weapons overnight.

 

[David1967]

Do you see parallels between Northern Ireland and Israel/Gaza/West Bank?

The troubles in Northern Ireland seem to have dissipated in conjunction with economic prosperity in the 1990s. The era of the Celtic Tiger.

Could economic development help in Gaza, which has no commerce or industry of their own.

I can't speak from experience regarding this, but I have a close friend from Ireland who grew up their at the height of unrest. Due to his experience there, he is very sympathetic to the Palestinians plight.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Due to his experience there, he is very sympathetic to the Palestinians plight.

There is context for this as well.