Bill Maher: "When Did Liberals Become the Fun Police?"

[Sunstone]

First part of video makes fun of far right conservative attitudes towards Halloween. Second part of video starts at 3:08 and makes fun of far left liberal attitudes towards Halloween.

Comments? Questions?

 

[David1967]

Comments? I think the guys right. PC culture is irritating.

 

[ecco]

As always, he is right on point.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Sunstone]

Comments? I think the guys right. PC culture is irritating.

The vast majority of Americans agree with you. Something like only 20% or less of Americans approve of PC culture -- and that includes most of us on the left.

 

[Shad]

Comments? Questions?

Is it the same stick? Like a time share?

 

[sun rise]

That was utterly beautiful. I've not been as close to ROTFLMAO for quite a while. (rolling on the floor laughing my *** off - in case you were wondering)

And yes, *** was not what I wrote. There is utterly nothing wrong with donkeys.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Bill Mahar is something of an irritating a.

But. He often gets a subject spot-on target. I think this was one of those times.

Bullying is bad, M'Kay? But if little Johnny never-ever experiences even the slightest bit of criticism? How is Johnny ever going to learn? Or grow up?

Part of Adulting is realizing the difference between some silliness and actual bullying. Halloween certainly fits within the category of Silliness.

It's not like it's an organized movement, who meet in large groups carrying torches and flags of countries and groups who were resoundingly defeated or something...

 

[Kapalika]

I'm going to have be in the minority then and say we probably shouldn't dress up as racial or ethnic stereotypes if we don't wanna seem like an ***. Is anyone here gonna actually defend dressing up in black face? If not, then why would you dress up in something considered sacred by it's people in a sacrilegious way? Or in a way that makes fun of Mexicans?

Perhaps it's more contextual, as a lot of these depictions have historically been used in racist contexts to make them seem inferior. People seem to forget where these stereotypes and types of depictions came from...

I'm not saying all costumes are this way, but I mean come on is everyone going to say it's really anything goes? Certainly there is some point at which we can say that it's gone too far and thus in poor taste.

 

[Father Heathen]

The vast majority of Americans agree with you. Something like only 20% or less of Americans approve of PC culture -- and that includes most of us on the left.

Right. Most liberals aren't as uptight as many on the right make them out to be regarding "political correctness", but they often use the extreme SJW trope as a straw man.

 

[Sunstone]

Right. Most liberals aren't as uptight as many on the right make them out to be regarding "political correctness", but they often use the extreme SJW trope as a straw man.

According to polls, 80% of blacks disapprove of PC culture, and even higher percentages of Hispanics, Asian Americans, and Native Americans disapprove of it. If I recall, the list is topped by the 88% percent of Native Americans who disapprove.

 

[Sunstone]

Dressing up as an "Indian chief" is definitely racist and literally any Indigenous political organizers you ask will tell you this.

Really? Do you have a rational explanation for why it's "racist", or are you just kind of saying it's "racist"?

 

[ecco]

I'm going to have be in the minority then and say we probably shouldn't dress up as racial or ethnic stereotypes if we don't wanna seem like an ***. Is anyone here gonna actually defend dressing up in black face? If not, then why would you dress up in something considered sacred by it's people in a sacrilegious way? Or in a way that makes fun of Mexicans?

Perhaps it's more contextual, as a lot of these depictions have historically been used in racist contexts to make them seem inferior. People seem to forget where these stereotypes and types of depictions came from...

I'm not saying all costumes are this way, but I mean come on is everyone going to say it's really anything goes? Certainly there is some point at which we can say that it's gone too far and thus in poor taste.

Is this costume really offensive? Why?

Is it offensive if worn by an Asian but not offensive if worn by a swarthy Italian who looks Mexican? What if it's worn by a Mexican?

Is this costume offensive if it's worn by an atheist?

Should we ban witches costumes?

Maybe we should ban Halloween altogether. After all, it teaches children that it's OK and usually rewarding to issue threats and ultimatums.

 

[Kapalika]

Is this costume really offensive? Why?

Is it offensive if worn by an Asian but not offensive if worn by a swarthy Italian who looks Mexican? What if it's worn by a Mexican?

Is this costume offensive if it's worn by an atheist?

Should we ban witches costumes?

Maybe we should ban Halloween altogether. After all, it teaches children that it's OK and usually rewarding to issue threats and ultimatums.

This a a strawman and not related to what I said. First and foremost no one least of all me has called for a ban on anything.

As for each costume, I don't think that dressing up as a mariachi band is in of itself an issue, just when it's conjoined with racist stereotypes. The pope costume doesn't seem stereotypical either.

Now as per the witch costume, I've know and have known a lot of real witches. At the very least the majority are annoyed with the caricatures if not offended. Imagine if every time someone found out you were a witch they pictured that and started applying fantasy tropes to you. Similarly as a Satanist I get pretty pissed at the depiction of Satanists as being bloodthirsty psychos because just like with the witch, these beliefs about us are being perpetuated by some of those types of depictions.

People seem to make "political correctness" to be some bogyman within America that is going to "take away" fun stuff. All it really is is a suggestion on being nicer to other people.

Really? Do you have a rational explanation for why it's "racist", or are you just kind of saying it's "racist"?

He already followed up with it, but certain things like headdresses have a special meaning, here is a Native American on it to give an idea:

"It's just like how if people were to don military honors and decorations on their blazers without having actually gone through the process of wearing them," Dorsey said."

Is it ever OK for a white person to wear a feather headdress?

 

[Stanyon]

Is it okay for black children to dress like Dracula?

(IMO the sequel "Scream Blacula Scream" was better overall)

or Nazis?

 

[Kapalika]

According to polls, 80% of blacks disapprove of PC culture, and even higher percentages of Hispanics, Asian Americans, and Native Americans disapprove of it. If I recall, the list is topped by the 88% percent of Native Americans who disapprove.

@Sunstone you are missing key points of data, and I'm actually finding that liberals are more supportive of free speech and that conservatives are more likely to want their own "political correctness" not vieled in the buzzwords.

Everything we think about the political correctness debate is wrong

"The overall debate about “political correctness” as a phenomenon tends to suffer from an excess of vagueness and ambiguity.

By rhetorically lumping in instances of rare, fairly extreme behavior with much more common behaviors under the broad heading of “political correctness,” it is easy to paint an alarming picture of the hecklers as a leading edge of an increasingly authoritarian political culture..

If nothing else, it would be useful for writers to do a better job of distinguishing between how life feels when you participate in unmoderated online exchanges — where being on the wrong end of pile-ons can certainly create the subjective impression that vicious mobs are constantly trying to shut down anything they find disagreeable — from what we actually see in the data, which is a public that is increasingly supportive of free expression, with liberals and college graduates being especially supportive."

Also, your statistic is off according to this, which even goes to braek it down by various groups: In 'political correctness' debate, most Americans think too many people are easily offended

It cites 67% of blacks favoring 'being more careful with language as to not offend' among other such figures. That article also has a bunch of other stats and stuff in there, too much to really get into in one post.

This breaks it down as well: Poll: 71% of Americans Say Political Correctness Has Silenced Discussions Society Needs to Have, 58% Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

And it points out what I said about conservatives:

It follows that a solid majority (59%) of Americans think people should be allowed to express unpopular opinions in public, even those deeply offensive to others. On the other hand, 40% think government should prevent hate speech. Despite this, the survey also found Americans willing to censor, regulate, or punish a wide variety of speech and expression they personally find offensive:

• 51% of staunch liberals say it’s “morally acceptable” to punch Nazis.
• 53% of Republicans favor stripping U.S. citizenship from people who burn the American flag.
• 51% of Democrats support a law that requires Americans use transgender people’s preferred gender pronouns.
• 65% of Republicans say NFL players should be fired if they refuse to stand for the anthem.
• 58% of Democrats say employers should punish employees for offensive Facebook posts.
• 47% of Republicans favor bans on building new mosques.

So with all of that, I think that "political correctness" isn't an issue, because in my view it's largely a strawman when you actually look at the data which kind of shows that everyone is for some kind of censorship and consider different things even to be hate speech.

And in the middle of all of this, just as the Vox article pointed out, is people claiming that people like me saying to just be a bit' nicer are being conflated with people who want to ban things. I mean hell 47% of republicans want to violate the 1st amendment by banning building new mosques! Why do we never talk about the censorship advocated by Republicans which all the research in those links show are much more likely to want to stifle free speech?

 

[suncowiam]

I'm a liberal and I hate PC.

Man, you should hear of all the racial jokes in my soccer games. I didn't say racist because we have the context to know it's just jokes. We have all nationalities in our games.

 

[Stanyon]

If it was made to look like he had a boner and he chased actual children around it might be kind of funny but would probably be in bad taste and children shouldn't be involved.

Should we ban witches costumes?

No, but I need more data:

Still a no for me, Witch costumes should not be banned.
Veronica Lake if you are curious

 

[Kapalika]

Still a no for me, Witch costumes should not be banned.
Veronica Lake if you are curious

Again no one is calling to ban any costumes! How hard is this to understand?

If it was made to look like he had a boner and he chased actual children around it might be kind of funny but would probably be in bad taste

So you admit there is a point where something is in bad taste? Well that's the "political correctness" that usually everyone is raging about!

 

[fantome profane]

Speaking personally, as a phantom, I am deeply offended by the living dressing up in cheap stereotypical insensitive ghost costumes.

This is not what I look like at at. If you saw what I really look like you would have nightmares for the rest of your life.

Boo!

 

[David1967]

Another good one on this subject.