Bush signs Schiavo legislation

[linwood]

They have no conscience...

A memo from GOP leaders meant to be seen only by Republican senators pointed out the political ramifications of the Schiavo debate and how it could help them with Christian conservatives in the 2006 midterm elections. According to The Washington Post, the memo singled out Sen. Bill Nelson, D-Tallahassee, who is up for re-election next year.
``This is an important moral issue and the pro-life base will be excited that the Senate is debating this important issue,'' said the memo, which was reported by ABC News and later given to the Post. ``This is a great political issue, because Senator Nelson of Florida has already refused to become a cosponsor and this is a tough issue for Democrats.''

http://news.tbo.com/news/MGB6YQPTI6E.html

 

[PixiFaerie]

The problem in this is two-tiered.

1. Terry's Husband is the legal decisionmaker, her parents aren't. Legally, in cases like this he has the power to do whatever he feels is appropriate as logn as it follows the letter of the law.

2. Terry is in what neurologists call a PVS. She will never recover. Ever. She is dead in all but name. If you were to look at her brainscans, which they do have on the net, you will see that the entire CAT of her brain is dark, void of any type of activity. The part of her brain that controls her personality and autonomy and "her" is gone and replaced with a slushy spinal cord fluid. Much of her brain has undergone some form of necrosis.

The only portions of the brain which are functioning are some of the stem and portions which control autonomical functions. Eating, breathing, digestion etc. There's nothing alive about Terry except for basic reflexes and organ functions.

THere has never been anyone who has come out of PVS. Ever. She's braindead, and science judges life by brain activity.

This is why Terry must be let go. There are statements made by Neurologists as late as 1998 saying that Terry was braindead, just as she is now. Time has only exacerbated her condition.

In This case, Euthanasia would be moral, but passive euthanasia takes too long and is waste of time. They should just use AE istead, but it's not legal for some silly reason.

 

[michel]

You guys must have seen this;

Bush backs family in 'right-to-die' case

2005-03-21 08:45:34

An emergency law has been rushed through US Congress to prolong the life of a brain damaged woman.

Terri Schiavo had her feeding tube removed on Friday after her husband said she did not want to be kept alive artificially.

President George W Bush has backed members of Terri's family, saying her rights have been violated and she should be kept alive.

The President cut short a Texas vacation and flew back to Washington to sign the bill.

Schiavo, 41, has been in a vegetative state since an operation went wrong 15 years ago - and her husband and legal guardian, Michael Schiavo, believes she should be allowed to die, but her parents disagree.

Her husband's lawyer called the last-minute attempt by US congressional Republicans to keep the tube in place "nothing short of thuggery" and called Democrats "spineless" for failing to thwart it.

Her husband won permission to remove the feeding tube after telling a court she would not have wanted to live in that condition.

 

[Green Gaia]

Posts split from US judge rules Schiavo should die and this thread placed in Political Issues... as this is now officially a political issue that could effect us all and our personal rights.. which seem to be shrinking by the day... .

 

[Green Gaia]

This what everyone should be paying attention to this morning, no matter what your feelings about this one woman....

Violation of limited government?
The bill was, said Frank, “the manifestation of a constitutional crisis.”

Congress was doing what only courts should do, Frank said. DeLay and other Republicans had rejected “a fundamental precept of American government, that is, a limited government.”

He pointed to a provision of the bill which said nothing in it would be a precedent for future legislation or private relief bills.

“Well, if it’s the right thing to do, why not?” asked Frank, arguing if the GOP majority was going to intervene in the Schiavo case, it was inconsistent not to do so in comparable cases.

“Of course, no one believes we’re only going to do this once,” he said.

We're losing our rights to make personal decisions now... the government wants to make those for us, even if it's against our wishes. This is scary stuff, people....

 

[Ceridwen018]

I wouldn't worry too much about that, Maize. The government can push and push until it ticks someone off, who will sue them, at which time the Supreme Court will whip them in. Things like this have happened in the past...its why we have the checks and balances system.

 

[Green Gaia]

The courts had already ruled on this... they decided that it was Terri's wish not to "live" like this and that she had no hope for recovery. The government ignored the court's ruling and did this anyway.... I don't think they really care what the courts have to say as long as they get politcial gain to push their agendas. It's a very sorry situation all-around....

 

[Sunstone]

I was listening to a talk radio program this morning on this subject, and it struck me how the radio host was demonizing the husband. The host commented on the husband's motives and announced that "they just didn't add up". He then proceeded to speculate that the husband had beaten his wife into a coma, and for that reason doesn't want her to recover. It was sickenning.

By the way, the same host attributed Bush's motives in signing the legistlation to the highest possible motives, declaring that Bush had nothing to politically gain by signing the legistlation, and was doing so only from the most noble motives.

Is there any relief from the bunk?

 

[painted wolf]

Since when does Congress have the right to step into the Judicial system and tell them how to do thier job?:areyoucra
Courts have heard this case, the Judical system has done its job.
When did the US Congress get the right to step in and make life and death desisions for individual citizens?
Regardless of my feeling tword this case, the Congress has broken its constitutional boundries and interfeared with the workings of an indipendant branch of government.
This Congressional act is Unconstitutional and must be punnished IMHO.:tsk:

The government doesn't get the right to pick and choose what rulings to uphold. It can't be allowed to ignore the desisions of the courts. That is how the Trail of Tears and many other gross injustices have happined in the past.

wa:do

 

[Dr. Nosophoros]

Not only do some people want to tell others how to live, but they also want to dictate how they should die because of their "supreme morality", it's a good lesson IMO.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

I'm going to raise my hand and step in with the 'I'm scared now' section. The checks are no longer balanced. Please let it be known that I'd much rather die than to be kept alive in such a situation, so that my organs and so on can be used by people who need 'em. (I've let my friends and family members know this, too.)

And if I've stated in the past that I would like to die if I was in such a situation, and all the various heavens-forbid that I wind up in that situation, and Bush of someone of his ilk tries to keep me alive... Well, I'd be rather angry. (That's the nicest way I can think to put it.)

I will be continuing to pray (the pagan way) that this woman's wishes are fulfilled. It's not that I don't feel horrible for the family, but that I feel even worse for the woman.

 

[Jaymes]

I'm beyond words right now. I just can't believe this. Sickwrong.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

This what everyone should be paying attention to this morning, no matter what your feelings about this one woman....

We're losing our rights to make personal decisions now... the government wants to make those for us, even if it's against our wishes. This is scary stuff, people....

Yes, I am very concerned about this issue as well. Feeding tubes are routinely pulled out at the wishes of the family. This is a case where the parents insanely believe that Terry will recover and politicians are taking advantage of the situation so that conservatives can take away our right to die with dignity. It's time to fly some senators home.

BTW: If you don't have a living will now would be a good time to get one drafted. They are relatively cheap (as far as attorney's fees), but in our culture a living will can sometimes be over-ruled by the family.

I am most bothered by a statement from a congressman that I heard on the radio. "We don't care about the quality of life... we just want to err on the side of life." That is downright insane and we as a people should write our senators and not allow the right wing to continue the madness.

 

[Green Gaia]

BTW: If you don't have a living will now would be a good time to get one drafted. They are relatively cheap (as far as attorney's fees), but in our culture a living will can sometimes be over-ruled by the family.

Very good point. And they are even cheaper online, from sites like legalzoom.com and others... just make sure you're working with a real lawyer. At least you will have your wishes written down in a legal document.

 

[jamaesi]

I thought republican stance was one of dislike and distrust of "big governement" and the want for the gov to stay out of their lives as much as possible.

Silly, silly me.


This is disgusting. I fear for my rights.

 

[croak]

This might be a dumb question, but how did she get PVS?? What is PVS?????

 

[MatCauthorn]

This might be a dumb question, but how did she get PVS?? What is PVS?????

I suugest you read this article for a good overview of what she is suffering from: http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050326/ap_on_he_me/brain_damaged_woman_videotapes

-- Mat

 

[Valjean]

RearingArabian -- PVS = persistent vegetative state. History: Mrs Shiavo suffered from bulimia, an eating disorder characterized by purposely vomiting after eating. This eventually caused an electrolyte imbalance, specifically a low potassium level that lead to either a cardiac arrest or a non-perfusing arrhythmia. After several minutes without circulation areas of her brain began to die (anoxic brain injury), leaving her with no higher mental functions. All this happened fifteen years ago. The case has been bouncing about in the courts for a dozen years.

 

[BUDDY]

So, let me see if I understnad this right. A memo was found that said something to the effect of, "make sure that while all of this with Terri is going on, that you make a feww speeches and make it clear to everyone what your stance is because it will really help us in the christian conservative base of voter." I mean, that is basically what was said, right?

And because of this, now everyone is afraid for their rights and is shouting about how horrible the government is. Well wake up people, politics is politics. It is the same now as it has always been. You think Democrats, Libertarians, Socialists and Cummunists have a moral high ground that keeps them from doing the same thing. No. All any Washington politician cares about (or a vast majority of them anyway) is how he or she can minipulate the headlines to secure their next elections. The elected don't care about Terri. They care about re-election, which in a way is good. If they get worried enough about our votes, that will keep them doing what the people want for them to do, and not what they think to do on their own. I mean be honest, how many of you would want politicians doing most of the thinking on their own?

 

[Feathers in Hair]

Actually, I don't think anyone has a higher or lower ground than anyone else. You're right. For all we know, any of the parties you mentioned might be willing to manipulate the same situation for their own benefit. I think this is, unfortunately, a bit of thinking that originated with the Clinton administration. Many people, during that time, claimed that our country would be taking the high road, would be morally superior, if Clinton had not been elected. Unfortunately, just as we can't know now what other parties would have done, we can't know what would have happened during that time. I was continually attacked for my political beliefs (although I was not old enough to vote) during that time. I don't support name-calling, whatever side one is on, though, and I will only stoop to it if I feel my rights are in danger.

Unfortunately, I do feel my rights are in danger. I don't think the government is horrible. I think there are a few people that are making it a bit more of a scary place than usual, though.

If your concern, though, is about Terri's life, then please note that (as far as I know) no one is attacking Christians or Republicans. They seem to only be angry (or frightened) of certain groups of people (and that includes many people) that are doing things that may or may not be in our best interest.

At least that's what I'm frightened of. I would be very happy if I didn't think there was anything to be worried over, though.