By Their Fruits You Shall Recognize Them

[Scuba Pete]

I think that what I am trying to understand is if the religion is the tree and the fruit it's members, if one or many of the fruits do a disservice in the name of God or bring reproach upon their religion is this a fair assumption that the tree and the fruit that they bear is unedible for human consumptiom or unacceptable in the eyes of God? If this is so, can any of the trees bearing fruits today be an exemplary example for this kind of recognition? Could the scripture have had individual intention or meaning; for example, that we are own trees and are good works the fruit from these trees?

First, religion can be a dirty word. Christianity is a way of life more than it is anything else. Love should be apparent to all and so should the other fruits. As with any fruit bearing plant, some prunning has to take place to make it as fruitful as possible. If there is some bad fruit growing then the source of that badness (your heart) has to be dealt with. The more I love like Jesus, the more I grow in his grace and become just like him in his attitudes towards others. Rarely do you see only a "part" of the tree prosper. Usually, if the fruit is good, then the entire tree is doing well. However, sometimes you have to cut the canker out to save the entire tree.

 

[*Paul*]

That is correct, how can you be a believer and not believe the gospel which is tulip ?

Because i knew God before I had ever heard of this man made system of theology. I was broken down by the Law of God, i was made to realise my defilement and hoplessness before God. The gospel was pressed upon me by the Holy Spirit and I believed according to the promise of scripture I am born again.
You are putting your trust in one mans systematic theology - a man lacking in fruit and with blood on his hands, who accepted infant baptism, who taught that being baptised as an infant was one sure way to know if you were one of God's elect, who relied heavily on "Saint" Augustine :liturgy: to formulate his institutes . (Augustine was a persecutor ((Like John Calvin))

BTW, you are not bible believing either if you reject the bible teaching of the gospel which tulip exemplifies ! All the truthes tulip teach are in the bible :yes:

I can assure you I am bible believing and i do not supplement it with the works of men as you do, you are almost a restorationist. John Calvin is your Joseph Smith or Charles Taze Russell.

Duh, how is it pointless, preaching the gospel reveals their salvation to them, the elect, thats their good news....
That was pauls passion in his preaching !
2 tim 2 10Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

This makes it sound as if it is down to Pauls efforts and endurance that the elect may be saved not some predestined decree. If Paul is enduring all things that the elect may also (as well as who?) be saved then it is down to Pauls efforts and not Gods pre-determined decree.

 

[UnTheist]

Thats not what I said, I said that salvation is not based on human peformance or good behaviour , but on grace.

That's exactly what I addressed. Salvation should be based on how you act and how you help others. I have never seen or felt or sensed God in my life. How does that make Hell for me justified if I could never see Him? I'm not going to base my life on blind faith. Something as little as a mere belief would not be good enough for God.

You are misinterpreting the way God is.

 

[beloved57]

That's exactly what I addressed. Salvation should be based on how you act and how you help others. I have never seen or felt or sensed God in my life. How does that make Hell for me justified if I could never see Him? I'm not going to base my life on blind faith. Something as little as a mere belief would not be good enough for God.

You are misinterpreting the way God is.

Your whole philosophy is anti scripture and christ and God !

For the just shall live by faith and not sight !

1. gal 3

11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

2. 2 cor 5

7(For we walk by faith, not by sight


3. jn 20:

29Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Evidently , you are a unbeliever according to scripture...:sorry1:

 

[UnTheist]

Wrong again. But don't worry about my faith. It doesn't matter how YOU interpret the scripture. I will go to heaven. You can count on that.

 

[beloved57]

paul says

Because i knew God before I had ever heard of this man made system of theology.

You knew a god !

I was broken down by the Law of God, i was made to realise my defilement and hoplessness before God.

The Law of God has not taught you or broke you down from Idolatry :no:

The gospel was pressed upon me by the Holy Spirit and I believed according to the promise of scripture I am born again.

You never heard the gospel which is tulip. How can you have heard the gospel when you never heard the gospel

You are putting your trust in one mans systematic theology - a man lacking in fruit and with blood on his hands, who accepted infant baptism, who taught that being baptised as an infant was one sure way to know if you were one of God's elect, who relied heavily on "Saint" Augustine :liturgy: to formulate his institutes . (Augustine was a persecutor ((Like John Calvin))

I do not care about the history of those men, all men are sinful by nature, but what I am declaring is the gospel which is tulip , those truthes are in the bible,you just reject them and therefore reject the gospel, you cannot be a true believer and don't believe the gospel, it is impossible..:no:

 

[astarath]

gal 3

11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Paul's writing's clearly state above that just by declaration of faith we are saved. No man is justified in the law. Cry Lord and be saved right!!!!

 

[Katzpur]

gal 3

11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Paul's writing's clearly state above that just by declaration of faith we are saved. No man is justified in the law. Cry Lord and be saved right!!!!

Jesus' teachings, on the other hand, say something quite different:

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

 

[beloved57]

gal 3

11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Paul's writing's clearly state above that just by declaration of faith we are saved. No man is justified in the law. Cry Lord and be saved right!!!!

A man is not saved for crying Lord, a person is saved if Christ died for them, period..

 

[astarath]

AWWWW i was hoping somebody would agree...darn.

As well Matt 5:17-20

 

[Katzpur]

A man is not saved for crying Lord, a person is saved if Christ died for them, period..

And John 3:16 says that whoever believes in Him will have eternal life. I take that to mean that He died for me, too.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 

[beloved57]

And John 3:16 says that whoever believes in Him will have eternal life. I take that to mean that He died for me, too.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

There are many false christ out there , which one you believe in ? Do you believe in the Christ that Died to save ONLY the Elect of God ?

 

[Katzpur]

There are many false christ out there , which one you believe in ? Do you believe in the Christ that Died to save ONLY the Elect of God ?

Nope. I believe in the Christ who said, "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

 

[astarath]

John 3:16 states belief. The equivalent of belief is faith. Faith is proved by works. This is the value of the statements, those who cry lord lord shall not be known and those who bear good fruits shall be good trees

 

[beloved57]

Nope. I believe in the Christ who said, "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

Well Thats only relevant to those he chose !

Jn 15

16Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

 

[beloved57]

John 3:16 states belief. The equivalent of belief is faith. Faith is proved by works. This is the value of the statements, those who cry lord lord shall not be known and those who bear good fruits shall be good trees

You are under the curse of the law, and the only way you will get to hraven is if you keep it perfectly !

ja 2
10For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

gal 3

10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

 

[*Paul*]

paul says
You knew a god !

No, I know the God of the bible, he is not a god of my imagination shaped to suit my preferences, i read the bible and let it shape me and teach me who God is. My position is scripture only yours is scripture mediated and interpreted through John Calvin, but:
Ps 118v8-9: It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man.
It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in princes.

The Law of God has not taught you or broke you down from Idolatry :no:

I am not following a god of my own invention, you have an idol and it is called T.U.L.I.P. Nice flower but bad theology.

You never heard the gospel which is tulip. How can you have heard the gospel when you never heard the gospel

The gospel is never once presented by an apostle in the bible according to the dictates of Calvinism.

I do not care about the history of those men, all men are sinful by nature, but what I am declaring is the gospel which is tulip, those truthes are in the bible,you just reject them and therefore reject the gospel, you cannot be a true believer and don't believe the gospel, it is impossible..:no:

All men are sinful but:
1Jn 3v15: Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
If you are believing a system formulated by a man with a persecuting heart you are without excuse as it is evident that he was lacking somewhat in the fruits of the Spirit.

It feels strange to be on the receiving end of this kind of conversation and the irony is not lost on me.

 

[James the Persian]

It feels strange to be on the receiving end of this kind of conversation and the irony is not lost on me.

There's hope for you yet!

James

 

[*Paul*]

I really hate debating with a brother (even though he doesn't see me as one) but sometimes it has to be done to stop the spread of error:

Ex 32v27: And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.

1Cor 11v19: For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

opcorn:



Peace,
Mystic