Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
Well then I'm out cause I'm somewhere below a shudra.
1. Brahmin
2. Kshatriya
3. Vaishya
4. Shudra
2,897. Vinayaka
34,954. Poeticus
Vinayaka,
Your thoughts?
Your thoughts?
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Can the Shudras study the Vedas....
- Thread starter Ravi500
- Start date
Glad you put yourself way below me. It shows you for the great, but humble being you are.
In all seriousness, I will study the Vedas if I ______ feel like it. Still I can have nightmares of old hunched Brahmin men beating me with a cane... "You there! Get away from that book. It's not for you!"
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
Technically yes, no one can stop you. However, it certainly wouldn't be very dhArmik of you to do so.
I see you have your cane at the ready. You're prepared to come over yonder to Canuckistan and lay a berating and a beating on me in the name of dharma, are you? That would be your dharma.
Namaste
You are telling Vinayaka he isn't Dharmic if he reads the Veda? Who are you to say that to him? You are not authorized to tell him such a thing, and you obviously know nothing of his sampradaya and teachers. He lives the Vedas. He is a walking Veda. You should want to help respect and protect such advanced souls as him.
Om Namah Sivaya
You are telling Vinayaka he isn't Dharmic if he reads the Veda? Who are you to say that to him? You are not authorized to tell him such a thing, and you obviously know nothing of his sampradaya and teachers. He lives the Vedas. He is a walking Veda. You should want to help respect and protect such advanced souls as him.
Om Namah Sivaya
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
I see you have your cane at the ready. You're prepared to come over yonder to Canuckistan and lay a berating and a beating on me in the name of dharma, are you? That would be your dharma.
If V goes down, then
I go down with V.
I go down with V.
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
A caste supremacist.
Just take a look at
this thread - it reeks
of caste apologetics.
Just take a look at
this thread - it reeks
of caste apologetics.
Dalles Airport here we come. Pull out the welcome mat! Oh, sorry. This is America, the land of the free. We stopped caning some time back.
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
I see you have your cane at the ready. You're prepared to come over yonder to Canuckistan and lay a berating and a beating on me in the name of dharma, are you? That would be your dharma.
Do you understand the meaning of "no one can stop you?"
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Take it with a grain of salt or two.
They still exist. Fortunately my local Brahmin priest would vouch for me.
When he and family needed a host to travel to Vancouver for a week there two summers ago, he asked me, this lowly Dalit. I did ask him why somewhere on the 12 hour drive, maybe at a relaxing waterfall or lake.Something about trust, being vegetarian, not drinking, and such. I guess he didn't trust the community Brahmins to take him. Unfortunately for me I guess he didn't bring his cane.
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
They sure do. They have this absurd "holier than thou"
attitude, while at the same time drinking hard liquor and
smoking cigarettes while refusing to share a plate with
a person of low-caste. If that's not hypocrisy, then I
don't know what that is.
attitude, while at the same time drinking hard liquor and
smoking cigarettes while refusing to share a plate with
a person of low-caste. If that's not hypocrisy, then I
don't know what that is.
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
If he considers himself to be an adhikArI, then he can go ahead, but since he's not a dvija, it's not his svadharma (as per varNAshrama), nor is it even his inclination (he stated multiple times that he really isn't a fan of reading), which is what I am getting at.
If you have any issues, please take them up with kR^iShNa, not me:
shreyAn svadharmo viguNaH paradharmAt svanuShThitAt|
svadharme nidhanaM shreyaH paradharmo bhayAvahaH||3.35||
I see you have your cane at the ready. You're prepared to come over yonder to Canuckistan and lay a berating and a beating on me in the name of dharma, are you? That would be your dharma.
Take it with a grain of salt or two.
They still exist. Fortunately my local Brahmin priest would vouch for me.
Something about trust, being vegetarian, not drinking, and such. I guess he didn't trust the community Brahmins to take him. Unfortunately for me I guess he didn't bring his cane.
I don't know if this is too much to ask, but can you two maintain a certain degree of maturity rather than making absurd claims? Not being able to read the veda-s does not imply that individual is lesser; as per my views, all bhakta-s are equal, meaning that an illiterate bhakta is more pure than the most scholarly brAhmaNa (if he or she engages in rituals without devotion). Of course, I understand that it's much easier to strawman the other individual and troll rather than address the concept of who is and who is not permitted (as per the shAstra-s, shruti and smR^iti) to take vedadIkShA, right?
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Fireside_Hindu
Jai Lakshmi Maa
I find the question of whether someone can study/learn the Vedas to be a silly one.
As Shivafanji said, anyone can learn anything. Who is to stop me? I can go to any library I want - even if I don't have a membership - and sit and read on any topic I see fit to read about. It's merely a question of desire and resources.
"You can't study that! It's not your Dharma."
Oh yeah? Just try and stop me.
So what if I never become a "expert". That's not really the point of learning. The point is to be able to make more educated choices about one's behavior and to foster an understanding and empathy for others.
Ignorance is the greatest enemy of Dharma. Education is the salve.
Knowledge is power and those who try to restrict the spreading of knowledge are merely trying to hold tightly to a false sense of security and power.
:camp:
As Shivafanji said, anyone can learn anything. Who is to stop me? I can go to any library I want - even if I don't have a membership - and sit and read on any topic I see fit to read about. It's merely a question of desire and resources.
"You can't study that! It's not your Dharma."
Oh yeah? Just try and stop me.
So what if I never become a "expert". That's not really the point of learning. The point is to be able to make more educated choices about one's behavior and to foster an understanding and empathy for others.
Ignorance is the greatest enemy of Dharma. Education is the salve.
Knowledge is power and those who try to restrict the spreading of knowledge are merely trying to hold tightly to a false sense of security and power.
:camp:
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
Actions define an individual rather than words. For an individual who considers shUdra-s to be lesser than brAhmaNa-s (see here) to accuse an individual who consider shUdra-s more blessed than brAhmaNa-s (see here) of being a "caste-supremacist" is nothing short of hypocrisy, and is frankly somewhat disrespectful. One can classify themselves however low they want, but unless he/she acts on it and respects others, I'm afraid it has no meaning.
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Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
Are you blind? Vinayaka and I
are clearly far below Shudra-s.
How desperate can you get?
are clearly far below Shudra-s.
How desperate can you get?
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
I'm afraid you didn't understand my post or perhaps I didn't convey it effectively. You created an explicit hierarchy of castes, I did not, and yet you accused me of being a caste supremacist. In addition, in this thread alone, both of you made multiple snide and/or offensive remarks and strawmanned my arguments. An individual who truly considers him/herself to be lower will not so easily disrespect another human as you two have done, hence why I stated that actions speak louder than words. Again, if you do not have anything productive to contribute to this thread, then I request that you please do not derail this thread with personal insults or accusations, because it frankly gives one the impression that you are trolling.
Jaskaran Singh
Divosūnupriyaḥ
On one post you state that you meant that you were lower than all other castes, yet in the post immediately following it, you say you were being satirical? If you cannot be consistent in your statements, then its unproductive to converse with you. Clearly you're not taking this thread very seriously.
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
This is quite laughable.
Here, I'll create another
one, one that is more
to your liking. I apologize
for leaving you out:
Here, I'll create another
one, one that is more
to your liking. I apologize
for leaving you out:
1. Jaskaran Singh
2. Brahmin
3. Kshatriya
4. Shudra
2,453. Vinayaka
34,560. Poeticus
2. Brahmin
3. Kshatriya
4. Shudra
2,453. Vinayaka
34,560. Poeticus