Can you go to heaven after you die a nonbeliever?

[Trailblazer]

That's a very beautiful passage, I love it!

God is infinite love, God's love is so immense that words could never describe this... it makes you feel the most special, the most loved, the most adored... the whole attention of God is on you, the whole love of God is on you, the whole care of God is for you, it's a love that........ when you are there, you wish to never come back here again, hence why those people that have a NDE do not want to come back, this is why!!! You drink this love, you smell this love, you touch this love, this love is touching you to the deepest parts of your being.

Well, Baha'u'llah wrote that the mysteries of man’s physical death and of his return to God have not been divulged because were they to be revealed, some souls would be so filled with gladness as to wish for death and beseech God to hasten their end. So we are told that is one reason why God is keeping the nature of the afterlife under His hat. The other reason is that the spiritual world is so different from this world that we could never really understand what it will be like. I am sure you know what I mean. You are trying to convey spiritual experiences in words, but words fall short.

“Know thou that every hearing ear, if kept pure and undefiled, must, at all times and from every direction, hearken to the voice that uttereth these holy words: “Verily, we are God’s, and to Him shall we return.” The mysteries of man’s physical death and of his return have not been divulged, and still remain unread.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 345

“Death proffereth unto every confident believer the cup that is life indeed. It bestoweth joy, and is the bearer of gladness. It conferreth the gift of everlasting life.

As to those that have tasted of the fruit of man’s earthly existence, which is the recognition of the one true God, exalted be His glory, their life hereafter is such as We are unable to describe. The knowledge thereof is with God, alone, the Lord of all worlds.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 345-346

 

[Trailblazer]

My life too so I understand you. Suffering made me to ask God day and night to come to me and help me understand the nature of reality, years after years of asking God on and on and on and on... going to sleep hoping that maybe God is going to finally answer... and the answer came exactly when I did not expect it and in a way that I did not expect at all.

Ditto on that... After years of suffering and trying to get help from psychotropic drugs and counselors and psychologists, I finally hit a kind of bottom in June 2014, and it has been a steady process of spiritual growth since then. I have posted my story on this forum to Christian and a Muslim who asked and here is the link to one of those posts in case you want to read it: Proof of Islam?

I only recently made some major breakthroughs in my feelings towards God and suffering and stopped blaming God for my suffering. All this I have worked through on this forum as I get many insights just from posting and discussing back and forth.

 

[Trailblazer]

A perfect description of what I also experienced... I have to study this too! We keep this curtain over our eyes... we are not true to ourselves... we run from ourselves.. we hide ourselves in ideas, in thoughts, in concepts... we have fabricated an "I" to identify with so that we can keep running from ourselves.

I achieved a degree of union with this Higher Self for about a week or so, in all this time, my live improved 1000 times... then I lost the connection because I returned to the old me and I am still stuck with the old me.. long road to Home when you are here, there, you are already Home.

Yes, it is a struggle to live IN this world and not be OF this world, because the material world puts so many roadblocks in our way, covering up the true reality, which is spiritual, but at least you know what is possible so you know what you have to look forward to.

Also, other people try to build roadblocks because they cannot believe what we have is real, and some people even get angry about that, but we know all too well it is real so we cannot allow those people to influence us. Rather I share what I believe and explain why I believe it and if they do not want it I let them go their own way.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Actually, if you really want the truth, the Bible says that no one goes to heaven. For some reason people want to ignore this abd keep believing in going to heaven. I have no idea why. Any ideas?

 

[Frank Goad]

Actually, if you really want the truth, the Bible says that no one goes to heaven. For some reason people want to ignore this abd keep believing in going to heaven. I have no idea why. Any ideas?

No ideas here.

 

[bobhikes]

I think 1 Peter 4:6 and 1 Peter 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15:29 imply it.But what makes this look like an impossibility is Hebrews 9:27.

I would refuse given the opportunity. I have no desire to live eternally. If reincarnation is a possibility I would go with that but eternal rest is fine as well.

 

[Trailblazer]

Actually, if you really want the truth, the Bible says that no one goes to heaven. For some reason people want to ignore this abd keep believing in going to heaven. I have no idea why. Any ideas?

I think I know what verses you are referring to and I believe you have misinterpreted those verses.

So where do you believe you go after you die? Was all this for nothing? What do you think eternal life means?

 

[Trailblazer]

I would refuse given the opportunity.

But what if you had no choice?

I have no desire to live eternally.

How do you know unless you know what eternal life is like?
I am not too keen on living forever either but that is because I do not know what the accommodations, scenery or itinerary will be.

If reincarnation is a possibility I would go with that but eternal rest is fine as well.

You must have have a better life than me to want to come back here.
I would never want to relive life in this world, once is enough.
I am past ready to move on to bigger and better things.

 

[bobhikes]

But what if you had no choice?

How do you know unless you know what eternal life is like?
I am not too keen on living forever either but that is because I do not know what the accommodations, scenery or itinerary will be.

You must have have a better life than me to want to come back here.
I would never want to relive life in this world, once is enough.
I am past ready to move on to bigger and better things.

This life can be both heaven and hell and you have the ability to try and achieve either. This life is always changing. Yes you struggle much more than you win but when you when its an incredible feeling. As long as you can let your regrets go then move to the next challenge it is always exciting. I definitely would never want things to always work out, only infinite challenges would ever make me happy and I already have infinite challenges here. I do feel there will be a time when I get tired and want to rest, its not to far off. The only way I would come back is with a reset so all the challenges could be new again. Its only a challenge if I can fail, if I can't fail its not worth trying.

 

[Trailblazer]

This life can be both heaven and hell and you have the ability to try and achieve either. This life is always changing. Yes you struggle much more than you win but when you when its an incredible feeling. As long as you can let your regrets go then move to the next challenge it is always exciting.

I understand what you mean but not all people have the same kind of life. Not everyone can have an exciting life just because they might want one. I have had many challenges but I do not want to have them anymore unless they serve a purpose.

I definitely would never want things to always work out, only infinite challenges would ever make me happy and I already have infinite challenges here. I do feel there will be a time when I get tired and want to rest, its not to far off. The only way I would come back is with a reset so all the challenges could be new again. Its only a challenge if I can fail, if I can't fail its not worth trying.

What makes you think there will e no challenges in the afterlife? I believe there will be just as many challenges, as many as we want, but they will be different from the challenges we have in this life, because heaven is not a material world. Other than human and animal relationships, many if not most of the challenges we face here are of a material nature. When there is no more material world there will be spiritual challenges.

Anyhow, below is what I believe. There will be work to do but we will not suffer under any of the physical and time limitations we have in this world.

“A friend asked: “How should one look forward to death?”
‘Abdu’l-Bahá answered: “How does one look forward to the goal of any journey? With hope and with expectation. It is even so with the end of this earthly journey. In the next world, man will find himself freed from many of the disabilities under which he now suffers. Those who have passed on through death, have a sphere of their own. It is not removed from ours; their work, the work of the Kingdom, is ours; but it is sanctified from what we call ‘time and place.’ Time with us is measured by the sun. When there is no more sunrise, and no more sunset, that kind of time does not exist for man. Those who have ascended have different attributes from those who are still on earth, yet there is no real separation.” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá in London, pp. 95-96

 

[gurudavid]

I think 1 Peter 4:6 and 1 Peter 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15:29 imply it.But what makes this look like an impossibility is Hebrews 9:27.

 

[gurudavid]

Good morning. My personal view is that anyone, of any faith, of any age, of any colour and regardless of their position on the social scale; can and do go to what people call heaven.

As a Vartisian I believe that it is how someone lives the life that they are given and how they make use of that life that matters. Following a particular faith is simply a means by which we can, if we follow that faith, use it to create a good life.

A God is not fooled by verbal piety and so it is the real behaviours, not thoughts of human that matter.

Positive behaviours produce positive results and negative behaviours produce negative results. All the false piety in the world will not change that.

Have a good one.

 

[danieldemol]

I think 1 Peter 4:6 and 1 Peter 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15:29 imply it.But what makes this look like an impossibility is Hebrews 9:27.

I believe that virtuous non-believers will have just as much reward as virtuous believers, but I don't rely on nonsensical scriptures to tell me how a secure merciful God will behave

 

[exchemist]

This a pretty large mari-go-round isn`t it?

Oh, don't bring Mary into it, or all the Hot Prots will get their knickers in a twist!

 

[bobhikes]

I understand what you mean but not all people have the same kind of life. Not everyone can have an exciting life just because they might want one. I have had many challenges but I do not want to have them anymore unless they serve a purpose.

What makes you think there will e no challenges in the afterlife? I believe there will be just as many challenges, as many as we want, but they will be different from the challenges we have in this life, because heaven is not a material world. Other than human and animal relationships, many if not most of the challenges we face here are of a material nature. When there is no more material world there will be spiritual challenges.

Anyhow, below is what I believe. There will be work to do but we will not suffer under any of the physical and time limitations we have in this world.

“A friend asked: “How should one look forward to death?”
‘Abdu’l-Bahá answered: “How does one look forward to the goal of any journey? With hope and with expectation. It is even so with the end of this earthly journey. In the next world, man will find himself freed from many of the disabilities under which he now suffers. Those who have passed on through death, have a sphere of their own. It is not removed from ours; their work, the work of the Kingdom, is ours; but it is sanctified from what we call ‘time and place.’ Time with us is measured by the sun. When there is no more sunrise, and no more sunset, that kind of time does not exist for man. Those who have ascended have different attributes from those who are still on earth, yet there is no real separation.” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá in London, pp. 95-96

Well then we do not share the same opinion. I do not need another's quote to state my position it is simple. Let me rest in peace.

 

[stvdv]

Actually, if you really want the truth, the Bible says that no one goes to heaven. For some reason people want to ignore this abd keep believing in going to heaven. I have no idea why. Any ideas?

Makes sense to me. Sounds the same as highest Advaita Teachings from Indian Scriptures
Your True Self neither dies nor is reborn, hence there is no going or not going to Heaven

It is just Awareness of being in Heaven or Lack of Awareness of being in Heaven

 

[stvdv]

A perfect description of what I also experienced... I have to study this too! We keep this curtain over our eyes... we are not true to ourselves... we run from ourselves.. we hide ourselves in ideas, in thoughts, in concepts... we have fabricated an "I" to identify with so that we can keep running from ourselves.

I experienced the same ... stop running around (in the mind) is the key

I achieved a degree of union with this Higher Self for about a week or so, in all this time, my live improved 1000 times... then I lost the connection because I returned to the old me and I am still stuck with the old me.. long road to Home when you are here, there, you are already Home.

Good part is that at least you know what is in store of you. Should be a good incentive to work hard. But I am surprised that I have so much laziness in me in regard to doing hard spiritual work. But my Master explained it wonderfully "the wheel of past karma takes awhile before it stops"

 

[Aupmanyav]

I think 1 Peter 4:6 and 1 Peter 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15:29 imply it.But what makes this look like an impossibility is Hebrews 9:27.

Did I ever show an interest in getting to your heaven?

When there is no more sunrise, and no more sunset, that kind of time does not exist for man.

Did the son of your Iranian preacher say how is the environment lighted in heaven? No sun, do they have to work in moon-light or even that is not there. Do they have electricity around, bulbs, LEDs to light? Or one has to become adept at staying in darkness all the time? Did he go there and return or the Iranian preacher said something about it?

 

[stvdv]

Did I ever show an interest in getting to your heaven?

Oh, but you might love "my Heaven" though

 

[stvdv]

I think 1 Peter 4:6 and 1 Peter 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15:29 imply it.But what makes this look like an impossibility is Hebrews 9:27.

Can you go to heaven after you die a nonbeliever?
God knows whether or not Heaven is real, and who/how get there.

IF we reincarnate a million++ times THEN we all get Atheistic and Theistic lives to live