Catholics what is your opinion?

[stvdv]

Kick out any priest, cardinal, bishop that's done this and hand them over to the authorities

Do not forget to kick out any Pope that's done this. He is the one in charge, so the one responsible IMO.
Don't tell me he did not know. He is a man of God. You believe God didn't tell him? He didn't know this?

Kick out?
He should get prison time, like all heads of organizations involved in criminal activities.

I thought I made that very obvious, coloring RED "what I refered to" = handing over to the authorities
The sad part is when Western authorities are Christian then the ones in power shield each other
Prison time for a pedophile is like "they do to him what he did to others" so very Biblical I think
https://www.quora.com/What-happens-to-pedophiles-in-prison

 

[Mindmaster]

Remember kids, if your claim isn't cranky enough add phrases like "end of discussion" and "period". That ought to kick your crankiness off to a more optimal level.

My comments aren't directed to ridicule those whom must live in that manner, but rather a prompt to encourage some self-introspection on the issue. The desire for mating is as natural as the desire to eat, and all I was getting at is that people should definitively know the why. We shouldn't presume that this is a healthy choice as there are physical aspects of all this as well. Sex is required for sexual organ health, it is how we are built but it is also required for emotional health and low sexual contact also reduces life expectancy. You can become impotent and unable to function in that manner and develop other mental conditions purely from refraining. It's certainly worth a warning.

 

[Mindmaster]

Exactly. I refuse to have sex. My genetics will never go on because of my fam ... wait. Dang it, you're right.

Not having sex at all reduced life expectancy and all sorts of other negative effects. I don't mean this to criticize people, but rather to encourage them to understand themselves in the why. If the reason is something like bad experiences, bad partners, or whatever then I think those issues should be addressed before claiming one is celibate. If one embraces that at that juncture then one must do so wary of the risks, understanding that the state of a human is not naturally the way or healthy. It is not so much that child production is the goal but that it is one of the ways humans have to be the closest to one another.

My comments in this regard are of course to incite people to receive help if they need it, maintain their sexual health, and their emotional health. There is also nothing wrong with seeking outside help via professional help in order to understand oneself in relation to the matter either. It is far better than to write oneself off and suffer the consequences. I feel that many whom claim to be celibate really are feeling more that it is out of their control or they're doomed with the thing and hence my opinion. I think everyone deserves to be happy and healthy.

 

[InChrist]

Maybe is the other way round. They start pedophile and become priests because of the opportunities to get in contact with kids and the protection they get when caught.

After all, we always try to find a job that fulfills our natural inclinations.

Ciao

- viole

Probably not true for everyone who becomes a priest or part of an organization with access to children, but likely in many, many cases.

 

[stvdv]

Maybe is the other way round. They start pedophile and become priests because of the opportunities to get in contact with kids and the protection they get when caught.
After all, we always try to find a job that fulfills our natural inclinations. Ciao
- viole

I never thought about it in that way. Of course that is a possible scenario. But hopefully not.
Probably they were abused themselves as kids by priests, so I agree that they start pedophile and became priest.
When a kid is not able to stand up against abuse, he will suppress and label it as okay to survive. So "naturally" he sees no bad in this because he never said NO.

So in general I don't think it is as bad as you say. Those doing it fully aware I would rather label as sociopath pedophile.

 

[stvdv]

Not having sex at all reduced life expectancy and all sorts of other negative effects. I don't mean this to criticize people, but rather to encourage them to understand themselves in the why. If the reason is something like bad experiences, bad partners, or whatever then I think those issues should be addressed before claiming one is celibate. If one embraces that at that juncture then one must do so wary of the risks, understanding that the state of a human is not naturally the way or healthy. It is not so much that child production is the goal but that it is one of the ways humans have to be the closest to one another.

My comments in this regard are of course to incite people to receive help if they need it, maintain their sexual health, and their emotional health. There is also nothing wrong with seeking outside help via professional help in order to understand oneself in relation to the matter either. It is far better than to write oneself off and suffer the consequences. I feel that many whom claim to be celibate really are feeling more that it is out of their control or they're doomed with the thing and hence my opinion. I think everyone deserves to be happy and healthy.

I do not agree with the first line.
I could agree if you said "Many people claiming to be celibate have suppressed trauma's which now will stay hidden, which might result in reduced life expectancy etc."

People who stay celibate for the right reason without hidden trauma's I expect to live even longer and without all the negative effects of marriage/sex etc.
But in general I fully agree how you put it here. There is nothing wrong with sex. It's very useful to seek help and work on your trauma's etc.etc.
Everyone deserves to be happy and healthy and live the way he likes to live. Don't let religions impose all kind of unnatural rules on you.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Maybe is the other way round. They start pedophile and become priests because of the opportunities to get in contact with kids and the protection they get when caught.

After all, we always try to find a job that fulfills our natural inclinations.

Ciao

- viole

You mean they are already pedophilia tendencies but become priests.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Not having sex at all reduced life expectancy and all sorts of other negative effects.

Having a hard time finding sources that aren't blogs or forum posts or something. Got any decent links?

My comments in this regard are of course to incite people to receive help if they need it, maintain their sexual health, and their emotional health.

Or I could accept that asexuality is a thing and I could accept that of myself because the thought of sex icks me out.

I think everyone deserves to be happy and healthy.

I've seen my family. Sex clearly doesn't improve things.

 

[serp777]

The bible never says that raping children is bad. its not in the commandments or condemned anywhere as far as i'm concerned. It talks about homosexuality, but not a male priest and a young girl. Its truly disgusting and awful, and also demonstrates why the bible is not a good moral guide.

 

[Mindmaster]

The bible never says that raping children is bad. its not in the commandments or condemned anywhere as far as i'm concerned. It talks about homosexuality, but not a male priest and a young girl. Its truly disgusting and awful, and also demonstrates why the bible is not a good moral guide.

From my perspective the Catholic church is a sex abuse ring masquerading as a religion, but YMMV on that concept. If the religion cannot separate itself from the predators at this juncture then the only logical conclusion is that is the sole reason for it to exist. (No offense meant to the poor lay people who were duped.)

 

[stvdv]

The bible never says that raping children is bad. its not in the commandments or condemned anywhere as far as i'm concerned. It talks about homosexuality, but not a male priest and a young girl. Its truly disgusting and awful, and also demonstrates why the bible is not a good moral guide.

I fully agree that the Bible is not a good moral guide, when they left out this important detail, which makes me conclude:
1: sex abuses happens a lot nowadays ... year 1500 was more barbaric ... year 0000 even more probably ... so sex abuse MUCH MORE in those years
2: Ergo the Bible writers/compilers priest then were also into "this sex abuse" so obvious they left that part out [that's why I rather not stick to old scriptures blindly]

From my perspective the Catholic church is a sex abuse ring masquerading as a religion, but YMMV on that concept. If the religion cannot separate itself from the predators at this juncture then the only logical conclusion is that is the sole reason for it to exist. (No offense meant to the poor lay people who were duped.)

I fully agree. I even wrote an email to the Pope in Rome in which I explain he is responsible and should do something about it, telling him its long overdue. [He is thinking about it]

 

[serp777]

I fully agree that the Bible is not a good moral guide, when they left out this important detail, which makes me conclude:
1: sex abuses happens a lot nowadays ... year 1500 was more barbaric ... year 0000 even more probably ... so sex abuse MUCH MORE in those years
2: Ergo the Bible writers/compilers priest then were also into "this sex abuse" so obvious they left that part out [that's why I rather not stick to old scriptures blindly]


I fully agree. I even wrote an email to the Pope in Rome in which I explain he is responsible and should do something about it, telling him its long overdue. [He is thinking about it]

You're actually in contact with the pope? The problem is he won't do anything because as soon as he starts attacking the catholic church, things are going to get ugly and there will likely be a power struggle. Its hard to fight such a systemic problems, which is why no popes have been able to deal with.

 

[stvdv]

You're actually in contact with the pope? The problem is he won't do anything because as soon as he starts attacking the catholic church, things are going to get ugly and there will likely be a power struggle. Its hard to fight such a systemic problems, which is why no popes have been able to deal with.

Oh no, I am not in contact with the Pope. I just downloaded an app which had the option to send a mail to the Pope, which I did. No reply/change, hence "the Pope is still thinking".

It's not so hard to solve this problem. Once My Master kicked out 3 countries from the international organisation because some persons in the organisation misbehaved big time. The whole countries were ex-communicated. That worked miracles, within a few years they solved their problems and were allowed back.

@Cacotopia also shared a wonderful story using the same principle.
Catholics what is your opinion?

That the Pope does not take such drastic, but highly needed actions, means he has no real power, or he has other interests IMO.

[In Holland we also had allegedly messy sexual stuff going on, which someone told me last month (google "round house holland" gives details). They now say it's conspiracy, but I don't believe that. Rich people are known to do creepy things. And normally they never demolish such a monument]
Round House (Nunspeet, Netherlands) - Wikipedia

 

[stvdv]

what are things that some of you (Catholics) would suggest could be done differentl?

I think sexual abuse problem in the Catholic Church won't be solved soon. Millions of people are involved and very high up in the hierarchy. They all cover for each other.

It would be best if we could stop it today at once. Because then no kids would suffer from now on. When they do it the normal way this will take many decades I think.

Maybe the best way to stop it now, is to make the Catholic Church an offer they can't refuse [a priest should have a conscience and being glad to start a clean slate; or is this confession thing of the CC just one big joke?].

An offer could be something like:"No one will get jailed when admitting NOW having done these sexual acts. Of course they have to stop being priest when they admit, but no jail time. You can make them pay 1000 dollar per child. And from those, who do not take this offer and get caught afterwards, the bodypart associated with the abuse will be cut off [or some other good incentive; @Cacotopia might know some from Bali. These solutions seems to work miracles in Bali, and we know that the Church believes in miracles and also loves miracles]".

I think maybe millions of kids are abused by the CC now. Making such an offer and saving those kids is more important than having the priests put in jail using normal legal ways, which will take decades thereby allowing millions of kids still being abused. Sometimes we need to cut our losses, choose the best of 2 bad situations.

 

[Cacotopia]

I think sexual abuse problem in the Catholic Church won't be solved soon. Millions of people are involved and very high up in the hierarchy. They all cover for each other.

It would be best if we could stop it today at once. Because then no kids would suffer from now on. When they do it the normal way this will take many decades I think.

Maybe the best way to stop it now, is to make the Catholic Church an offer they can't refuse [a priest should have a conscience and being glad to start a clean slate; or is this confession thing of the CC just one big joke?].

An offer could be something like:"No one will get jailed when admitting NOW having done these sexual acts. Of course they have to stop being priest when they admit, but no jail time. You can make them pay 1000 dollar per child. And from those, who do not take this offer and get caught afterwards, the bodypart associated with the abuse will be cut off [or some other good incentive; @Cacotopia might know some from Bali. These solutions seems to work miracles in Bali, and we know that the Church believes in miracles and also loves miracles]".

I think maybe millions of kids are abused by the CC now. Making such an offer and saving those kids is more important than having the priests put in jail using normal legal ways, which will take decades thereby allowing millions of kids still being abused. Sometimes we need to cut our losses, choose the best of 2 bad situations.

what do I know?

 

[Cacotopia]

The "justice system" in Bali is local justice. Like the village bands together and beats a thief to death.

But it is HIGHLY CORRUPT here. You can bribe your way out of nearly anything here if you have to money to do it.

Or you can buy your justice too if you have the money to do it.

My solution was to stab them in the wallet so to speak. That ALWAYS works. If there is a priest pedo ring and say the govt gives the church an ultimatum like.

We the USA govt will remove your tax exempt status, if you do not find a solution to your kid diddling racket problem. If there are more than 1 case a year from this point forward you will lose your tax exempt status permanently.

I bet you my life savings that the church would crack down on priest pedos so hard that it would seem like an act of god happened within the church.

 

[stvdv]

what do I know?

You had a nice example with "taxi gangs" raping girl. Within 3 days it was solved.

The "justice system" in Bali is local justice. Like the village bands together and beats a thief to death.
But it is HIGHLY CORRUPT here. You can bribe your way out of nearly anything here if you have to money to do it.
Or you can buy your justice too if you have the money to do it.

I think that is the only problem everywhere. Humans are too corrupt. So the Church is also too corrupt. Politicians are corrupt and some might be into this sex abuse also
This has to be evangelized "Truth = Church is corrupt". Then people stop going to the church and that would solve sexual abuse (at least in the church)

 

[Cacotopia]

You had a nice example with "taxi gangs" raping girl. Within 3 days it was solved.



I think that is the only problem everywhere. Humans are too corrupt. So the Church is too corrupt. Politicians are corrupt and some might be into this sex abuse also
This has to be evangelized "Truth = Church is corrupt". Then people stop going to the church and that would solve sexual abuse (at least in the church)

The solution I feel is through their ability to operate, IE disrupt their cash flow as a consequence to their actions, since everyone seems to be driven by money in the first place.

 

[stvdv]

The solution I feel is through their ability to operate, IE disrupt their cash flow as a consequence to their actions, since everyone seems to be driven by money in the first place.

Cash comes from the members. Make members more aware:
1) Make them aware that happiness can be found without the church
2) Highlight the sexual abuse, which is happening the last few years, so I think the Church is about to be finished. Once the snowball is rolling not even the Pope can stop it.

 

[metis]

Considering praying didn't keep these kids from being sexually abused, and based on the reactions of the people in following video, what are things that some of you (Catholics) would suggest could be done differentl?

I've already covered this on another thread, but I'll repeat myself here on this one.

1.All sexual abuse accusations must be forwarded to the civil authorities [this already has been mandated here in the States by the bishops]

2.Any move by a bishop to take a priest or church worker of any parishioner accused of such should also be reported to civil authorities, plus the Church should defrock the bishop if confirmed he did wrong.

3.The Vatican should make it abundantly clear that in each country that sexual abusers and any bishop that just moves them around should be turned over to civil authorities for prosecution.

4.The Vatican should have a convening of all bishops to educate them on this zero-tolerance policy, including steps that must be followed.

5.That parishioners will be informed not only of these procedures but also how they can help by being whistle-blowers.

6.Allow for having married priests,plus increase the number of married deacons, the latter of which is already happening.

7.I'm sure there can be more steps that I can't right now conjure up.