Children and Transitioning

[SigurdReginson]

Disclamer: Having not gone through the process of transitioning, my explanations on the subject are going to be tertiary, so please contribute and correct anything I say that might be wrong or different from your experiences.

When I was on another forum (a very christian forum), the topic of children transitioning from male to female, or female to male came up. Now, folks over there tend to not support the idea of adults doing that, even, but I have to wonder what you folks would think since there's a much broader range of religious and non religious backgrounds here. I supposed this question is for those who remain neutral or support the matter of transitioning, since we already know what those who are against it would say.

From what I've learned from transgendered friends and coworkers, the sooner the transition begins, the better. If it can happen before puberty, that's the best case scenario. During transitioning, muscle and fat distribution changes, and this happens much more naturally if it happens before puberty starts building on those muscle and fat reserves that are associated with the sex a child's born with. I also hear that by starting the transition process via hormones and such later on in life, it can be much harder healthwise on the individual.

Not only that, but then we have to consider the psychological impact. I've heard stories from my friends where they didn't pass well enough for someone to notice, and someone ended up bulling them or acting violently towards them. I can't help but wonder if they would have been able to pass a little better if their transition had began sooner. On the other hand, there have been people who have transitioned and then come to regret it later on in life, and that can be psychologically damaging as well.

So then, if we are talking about this perfect window of time for transitioning to take place, we are talking about children by extension. Should children be able to transition? Why, or why not? Should children be able to make life altering decisions at all? How much should parent involvement be made in those decisions?

It's a hefty topic, and one that a lot of people (including myself) are innately ignorant of. Transitioning is a tough pill for a lot of people to swallow to begin with, but children lack the experience and objectivity that an adult would (or should) possess, so that makes this whole thing even more tricky. What are your thoughts?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Disclamer: Having not gone through the process of transitioning, my explanations on the subject are going to be tertiary, so please contribute and correct anything I say that might be wrong or different from your experiences.

When I was on another forum (a very christian forum), the topic of children transitioning from male to female, or female to male came up. Now, folks over there tend to not support the idea of adults doing that, even, but I have to wonder what you folks would think since there's a much broader range of religious and non religious backgrounds here. I supposed this question is for those who remain neutral or support the matter of transitioning, since we already know what those who are against it would say.

From what I've learned from transgendered friends and coworkers, the sooner the transition begins, the better. If it can happen before puberty, that's the best case scenario. During transitioning, muscle and fat distribution changes, and this happens much more naturally if it happens before puberty starts building on those muscle and fat reserves that are associated with the sex a child's born with. I also hear that by starting the transition process via hormones and such later on in life, it can be much harder healthwise on the individual.

Not only that, but then we have to consider the psychological impact. I've heard stories from my friends where they didn't pass well enough for someone to notice, and someone ended up bulling them or acting violently towards them. I can't help but wonder if they would have been able to pass a little better if their transition had began sooner. On the other hand, there have been people who have transitioned and then come to regret it later on in life, and that can be psychologically damaging as well.

So then, if we are talking about this perfect window of time for transitioning to take place, we are talking about children by extension. Should children be able to transition? Why, or why not? Should children be able to make life altering decisions at all? How much should parent involvement be made in those decisions?

It's a hefty topic, and one that a lot of people (including myself) are innately ignorant of. Transitioning is a tough pill for a lot of people to swallow to begin with, but children lack the experience and objectivity that an adult would (or should) possess, so that makes this whole thing even more tricky. What are your thoughts?

I think it is important to not judge those who thinking about doing it, or those who have already gone through with it. Personally i have nothing i can say for or against it, because it is up to each person to deside what is right for them. The situation may be more difficult when it comes to children who wish to do the transition. The topic in it self is a very difficult topic to discuss especially for one who have no experience with it.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

No. Personally, I don't believe they should. From talking to people that identify as no-gender, both genders, transgender, and so forth, it may be appropriate for one person with gender dysphoria but (assuming) it wouldn't be appropriate for another. I'm sure there are more factors involved to meet the criteria for transitioning that children may not know until they are older. I don't think the question would be brought up if many children were brought up in a supportive environment to where parents can help them out until they are psychologically ready to make that jump. That's my personal opinion. The ins and outs I don't know.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I think it is important to not judge those who thinking about doing it, or those who have already gone through with it. Personally i have nothing i can say for or against it, because it is up to each person to deside what is right for them. The situation may be more difficult when it comes to children who wish to do the transition. The topic in it self is a very difficult topic to discuss especially for one who have no experience with it.

That's kind of where I'm at, too. I feel that that's precisely why we need to talk about these things, though. It's easy to ignore something and not even consider it's existence if we never force ourselves to think about it.

I'd be curious to know where child psychiatry is on this issue. I imagine the guidance of a councilor on this matter would be vital.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That's kind of where I'm at, too. I feel that that's precisely why we need to talk about these things, though. It's easy to ignore something and not even consider it's existence if we never force ourselves to think about it.

I'd be curious to know where child psychiatry is on this issue. I imagine the guidance of a councilor on this matter would be vital.

Since my knowledge of this topic is so limited, it am sure other people can answer this questions a lot better and deeper than i am able to do

 

[SigurdReginson]

No. Personally, I don't believe they should. From talking to people that identify as no-gender, both genders, transgender, and so forth, it may be appropriate for one person with gender dysphoria but (assuming) it wouldn't be appropriate for another. I'm sure there are more factors involved to meet the criteria for transitioning that children may not know until they are older. I don't think the question would be brought up if many children were brought up in a supportive environment to where parents can help them out until they are psychologically ready to make that jump. That's my personal opinion. The ins and outs I don't know.

Yah, that's true... Kids do sometimes change their minds about things later on in life. Then again, the folks I've talked to who have transitioned have known since their earliest memories. And as you say, there are some dead giveaways like gender dysphoria. Hmmm... I wonder if there's like a checklist that psychologists have for this kind of thing?

 

[SigurdReginson]

Since my knowledge of this topic is so limited, it am sure other people can answer this questions a lot better and deeper than i am able to do

Me too.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Disclamer: Having not gone through the process of transitioning, my explanations on the subject are going to be tertiary, so please contribute and correct anything I say that might be wrong or different from your experiences.

When I was on another forum (a very christian forum), the topic of children transitioning from male to female, or female to male came up. Now, folks over there tend to not support the idea of adults doing that, even, but I have to wonder what you folks would think since there's a much broader range of religious and non religious backgrounds here. I supposed this question is for those who remain neutral or support the matter of transitioning, since we already know what those who are against it would say.

From what I've learned from transgendered friends and coworkers, the sooner the transition begins, the better. If it can happen before puberty, that's the best case scenario. During transitioning, muscle and fat distribution changes, and this happens much more naturally if it happens before puberty starts building on those muscle and fat reserves that are associated with the sex a child's born with. I also hear that by starting the transition process via hormones and such later on in life, it can be much harder healthwise on the individual.

Not only that, but then we have to consider the psychological impact. I've heard stories from my friends where they didn't pass well enough for someone to notice, and someone ended up bulling them or acting violently towards them. I can't help but wonder if they would have been able to pass a little better if their transition had began sooner. On the other hand, there have been people who have transitioned and then come to regret it later on in life, and that can be psychologically damaging as well.

So then, if we are talking about this perfect window of time for transitioning to take place, we are talking about children by extension. Should children be able to transition? Why, or why not? Should children be able to make life altering decisions at all? How much should parent involvement be made in those decisions?

It's a hefty topic, and one that a lot of people (including myself) are innately ignorant of. Transitioning is a tough pill for a lot of people to swallow to begin with, but children lack the experience and objectivity that an adult would (or should) possess, so that makes this whole thing even more tricky. What are your thoughts?

It's child abuse as far as I'm concerned.

Children should not be forced into something they have no control over, and later may regret their parents decisions to permanently alter their bodies.

 

[SigurdReginson]

It's child abuse as far as I'm concerned.

Children should not be forced into something they have no control over, and later may regret their parents decisions to permanently alter their bodies.

Hmmm... When does something become a child's decision vs. the parent's decision? If I were to take a much less drastic life altering decision, like ear piercing, would that still be the parent's decision?

 

[fantome profane]

Also not an expert, but from what I have been told and read going through puberty as the “wrong” gender can be extremely traumatic. You can imagine a young person who identifies as a male going through puberty and developing a female body or vice versa.

I think it is important for the good of the child that some kind of treatment begin early, even if it is just to delay puberty.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Yah, that's true... Kids do sometimes change their minds about things later on in life. Then again, the folks I've talked to who have transitioned have known since their earliest memories. And as you say, there are some dead giveaways like gender dysphoria. Hmmm... I wonder if there's like a checklist that psychologists have for this kind of thing?

I wouldn't say change their minds. I'd say have a more sturdy definition and clarify of what they feel, how they feel, "without" anyone saying what they are supposed to feel and without doctors jumping the gun thinking they have one thing when they may have something else.

There should be some clarity more than "having early memories and body/mind dissociation" when it comes to medical treatments like that.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I wouldn't say change their minds. I'd say have a more sturdy definition and clarify of what they feel, how they feel, "without" anyone saying what they are supposed to feel and without doctors jumping the gun thinking they have one thing when they may have something else.

There should be some clarity more than "having early memories and body/mind dissociation" when it comes to medical treatments like that.

Thank you for your thoughts.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Thank you for your thoughts.

Ha. Hey. You asked.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Hmmm... When does something become a child's decision vs. the parent's decision? If I were to take a much less drastic life altering decision, like ear piercing, would that still be the parent's decision?

I would say an age when the child is mature enough to understand the implications.

Plus a sex change is a lot more invasive and permanent then a simple peirce job.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I would say an age when the child is mature enough to understand the implications.

Plus a sex change is a lot more invasive and permanent then a simple peirce job.

If you are talking about sexual reassignment surgery, that's true. I don't know of anyone who has gone straight to that, though. It's my understanding that folks wait until most of the big things in their transition are done first. They start with hormone therapy - that's the one that really matters as far as when you get it done earlier, since it alters how your body outwardly changes (such as giving curves to women transitioning from male to female).

Needless to say, hormone therapy can also permanently alter your body as well; it's not nearly as drastic or dangerous as sexual reassignment surgery, though, and much of it can be undone.

 

[idea]

First let me say I have no problem with LGBTQ, let everyone define themselves how they want, marry who they want. I do not quite understand anyone's infatuation with looks though, whether it is someone spending hundreds to color their hair, do their nails, extravagant clothing - I just see looks as superficial, something we should not judge people by. With limited time and resources, I think it is more healthy to spend time learning how to play a musical instrument, reading a book, volunteering, hiking in nature etc. and who cares what your body looks like? Focus on looks, for kids or adults, is the wrong focal point ... just my opinion.

 

[Twilight Hue]

If you are talking about sexual reassignment surgery, that's true. I don't know of anyone who has gone straight to that, though. It's my understanding that folks wait until most of the big things in their transition are done first. They start with hormone therapy - that's the one that really matters as far as when you get it done earlier, since it alters how your body outwardly changes (such as giving curves to women transitioning from male to female).

Needless to say, hormone therapy can also permanently alter your body as well; it's not nearly as drastic or dangerous as sexual reassignment surgery, though, and much of it can be undone.

That's where the debate is going to go. That "yet to be determined" point of no return.

I think at that point of no return, ie; cannot be reversed or undone, should be made at his or her consent at least with an age where such consent includes a full understanding with all consequences and repercussions should and when such things occur.

I think the only exception at a super young age might be made in case of hermaphrodites.

 

[SigurdReginson]

That's where the debate is going to go. That "yet to be determined" point of no return.

I think at that point of no return, ie; cannot be reversed or undone, should be made at his or her consent at least with an age where such consent includes a full understanding with all consequences and repercussions should and when such things occur.

I think the only exception at a super young age might be made in case of hermaphrodites.

Yah, I actually have a friend who is intersex. She was raised as a boy clear through high school, but she ended up having to go through a lot of the same transitioning experiences that transgendered folks go through. It's a rough road...

 

[SigurdReginson]

First let me say I have no problem with LGBTQ, let everyone define themselves how they want, marry who they want. I do not quite understand anyone's infatuation with looks though, whether it is someone spending hundreds to color their hair, do their nails, extravagant clothing - I just see looks as superficial, something we should not judge people by. With limited time and resources, I think it is more healthy to spend time learning how to play a musical instrument, reading a book, volunteering, hiking in nature etc. and who cares what your body looks like? Focus on looks, for kids or adults, is the wrong focal point ... just my opinion.

Hmmm... Do you think it's of no importance how we present ourselves, or that it doesn't effect our self esteem or the ways we identify with ourselves in our environments? I think this is an issue that might just go a little more deeper than skin deep (no puns here ).

Honestly, if I was forced to present myself in a way I didn't like, I would be unhappy... I want to be able to be me.

 

[sun rise]

Can Children Know, At Age 2, They Were Born The 'Wrong Sex'? from 2012 exposes all the issues from the early age some kids feel they're the wrong sex to how many change their minds about being transgender at some point.

I see no easy answer to the issue.