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Christianity and Paganism -- Compatible?

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
I think Christianity and paganism are completely compatible. Why should they be in opposition? If there are hard lines drawn between them, they are only self created.
 

blackout

Violet.
It really depends on how one understands "christianity".

Gnostic christianity I can see yes.

Ahhhh... I just noticed you said "the christ myth".
 

Zephyr

Moved on
Given how "paganism" can mean pretty much anything now, I guess you could mash them together.
 

Dunemeister

Well-Known Member
This is but one video on the subject of the pagan roots of Christianity. The striking similarities between Christianity and pre-Christian religions cannot be denied.

Sure they can and they are. The "striking similarities" frequently come apart at the seams or are revealed as extremely superficial upon closer examination.

Could understanding the origins of the Christ myth make Christianity compatible with other religions and paganism?

If the story of Jesus were rooted in pagan religion, then of course it would. But it isn't, so they're not.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
Sure they can and they are. The "striking similarities" frequently come apart at the seams or are revealed as extremely superficial upon closer examination.



If the story of Jesus were rooted in pagan religion, then of course it would. But it isn't, so they're not.

How so?
 

Dunemeister

Well-Known Member

There are a couple of things. First, there's the radical dissimilarity between what Christians claimed about Jesus' resurrection and the available pagan options of the day. Pagans routinely mocked Christians for their belief in Jesus' resurrection for much the same reason that members of the modern Jesus Seminar do: we all know that dead men stay dead. Besides, in the ancient pagan worldview, resurrection was not only impossible but also undesirable. Why would anyone want to revisit this world of toil and pain? Much better to seek immortality through great deeds (the Homeric vision). This belief about the resurrection of Jesus is absolutely crucial in understanding the early Christian movement and its beliefs. Their belief in resurrection has no pagan precursors. There is no natural development from any pagan philosophy or religious perspective that we know about and the Christian vision of Jesus' (and our) post-mortem existence.

Second, there is also the fact that pagans routinely resisted Christianity, sometimes with violence. If the parallels between Christianity and paganism were so many and so obvious as is claimed by modern revisionists, we wouldn't expect such vehement opposition.

Third, in defending their gospel, Christians did not routinely resort to pagan sources, but rather attempted to demonstrate that the Jewish bible was as good as or better than Plato et al. Again, if Christianity were so similar to paganism and indeed was simply a development of it, why would Christians appeal to the holy books of a weird sect based in Palestine that had a reputation for thumbing their noses at pagans?

Essentially, the claim that Christianity is basically paganism in disguise simply cannot be held with any intellectual integrity when the actual history is examined. If Christianity were another version of paganism, its earliest proponents and opponents obviously (and universally) did a very bad job of understanding it.
 

Reiðrœska

Voice deeper than Thor's
Second, there is also the fact that pagans routinely resisted Christianity, sometimes with violence. If the parallels between Christianity and paganism were so many and so obvious as is claimed by modern revisionists, we wouldn't expect such vehement opposition.

Quoted for truth is I can really say.

However, I still believe Christianity 'stole' elements from other religions (not just Paganism, mind).

One example is Jesus hanging from a cross - rather similar to Odin hanging from an oak tree. There are others, I'm sure, but I can't think of any right now.
 

darkendless

Guardian of Asgaard
YouTube - Myth of Religion; The Solar Messiahs God's Sun Christ Horus

This is but one video on the subject of the pagan roots of Christianity. The striking similarities between Christianity and pre-Christian religions cannot be denied.

Could understanding the origins of the Christ myth make Christianity compatible with other religions and paganism?

James

Ask the millions of pagans killed by Christianities spreading of faith and see what they think about walking hand in hand. Typically Christianity took the best of each world making it better, and removing those who posed a threat to their new found glory. Opposition to the Roman state adopting Christianity was followed by mass execution. Similiar events occured in Norway, Sweden (burning of the temple Uppsala) and mass conversions of pagans in many northern European countries (Denmark, Finland, Poland).There is no denying that paganism flourished before Christianity, and the spreading of the Gospel brought many traditional religions to their knees.

Given such history do you still think paganism and Christianity are compatable? Especially when Christianity is responsible for sanatising many ancient mythologies passed orally which are still practised, to some extent today.
 

Azakel

Liebe ist für alle da
Reiðrœska;1240233 said:
Quoted for truth is I can really say.

However, I still believe Christianity 'stole' elements from other religions (not just Paganism, mind).

One example is Jesus hanging from a cross - rather similar to Odin hanging from an oak tree. There are others, I'm sure, but I can't think of any right now.

I'm not even sure that one was taken ether from Paganism. The Romans of the time did crucify people for going against them and for crimes. If Jesus was really there would a good chance that the Romans did crucify him.
 

Dunemeister

Well-Known Member
Reiðrœska;1240233 said:
However, I still believe Christianity 'stole' elements from other religions (not just Paganism, mind).

One example is Jesus hanging from a cross - rather similar to Odin hanging from an oak tree. There are others, I'm sure, but I can't think of any right now.

It may be that the image of Jesus hanging from a cross is similar to Odin hanging from an Oak tree. But it's also similar to someone hanging from a gallows, isn't it? Besides, thousands of people had been hung on a cross before Jesus and many thousands after him. Did the stories those people's friends took home about the event "steal" something from Norse myths? If not in their case, why in Jesus' case?

Although it superficially resembles an event from the Odin myth, that does not mean the event didn't actually happen. And that's a crucial point. The Christians weren't telling this story as the Norse bards told their sagas. The Norse bards knew they were trafficking in myth and they didn't expect the listeners to take it all in literally. But with Christianity, the apostles claimed that Jesus really was hung from a cross and subsequently really raised. By contrast, the mystery religions current in Jesus' day viewed the dying and rising of their gods in entirely symbolic terms. If anything, these dying and rising gods merely represented changing seasons. For the early Christians, the changing of seasons was entirely irrelevant, and the events actually occurred.
 

Zephyr

Moved on
Reiðrœska;1240233 said:
Quoted for truth is I can really say.

However, I still believe Christianity 'stole' elements from other religions (not just Paganism, mind).

One example is Jesus hanging from a cross - rather similar to Odin hanging from an oak tree. There are others, I'm sure, but I can't think of any right now.
More Heathens! Yay!:D Welcome to RF.
 

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
Second, there is also the fact that pagans routinely resisted Christianity, sometimes with violence. If the parallels between Christianity and paganism were so many and so obvious as is claimed by modern revisionists, we wouldn't expect such vehement opposition.


Considering it was the Christians who were going around telling Pagan to convert to die what do you expect to happen?





Essentially, the claim that Christianity is basically paganism in disguise simply cannot be held with any intellectual integrity when the actual history is examined. If Christianity were another version of paganism, its earliest proponents and opponents obviously (and universally) did a very bad job of understanding it.


There is a lot of evidence showing how Christiany took from Pagan belifes, it's up to the person reading it to make up his/her mind from that point. Christianty is not another version of Paganism but it does take some from it & made into what it is today.
 

Kcnorwood

Well-Known Member
Someone here wanted something that showed Christianty took something from the Pagan belief. I won't go into the easy things but here's an intresing one.

Many Celtic Gods were worshipped in triple form or triune form, the Hindus had three main Gods that they worshipped. Brahma, the creator, Vishnu, the Preserver & Shiva the Destroyer. The same can be said for the Greeks Zeus, Poseidon, & Hades.


Christianity later adopted this worship of triune God ship. Father Son Holy Ghost. Not from Judaic culture to which it is alien but from the Greek interpretation aided by the concepts of early Christians.
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
Care to share with us which ones those are?

Osiris, Thoth, Krishna, Attis, Adonis, Dionysius, Mithra, Odin, Phoenix, etc.

Some have a pretty uncanny resemblance to the Jesus story, others not so much, but the point is that resurrection myths did indeed have pagan precursors contrary to what people were claiming otherwise.
 

Azakel

Liebe ist für alle da
Osiris, Thoth, Krishna, Attis, Adonis, Dionysius, Mithra, Odin, Phoenix, etc.

Some have a pretty uncanny resemblance to the Jesus story, others not so much, but the point is that resurrection myths did indeed have pagan precursors contrary to what people were claiming otherwise.

I had a good post type up for quoting your post, some of it agreed with you(from what I found), some ask to show source for some of the Gods, and one part show that there where really no similarities between them. I x out of it and didn't mean to and am to hungry right now to re-type it.
 

Dunemeister

Well-Known Member
There is a lot of evidence showing how Christiany took from Pagan belifes, it's up to the person reading it to make up his/her mind from that point. Christianty is not another version of Paganism but it does take some from it & made into what it is today.

The standard Christian line is that paganism doesn't get it all wrong. There is wisdom to be found there, and whatever is true, lovely, worthy of assent, and honorable ought to find a place within Christianity. (That's not to say we haven't bungled along the way. It's only to say that Christianity isn't committed to the view that pagans have made nothing but mistakes.) As a result, we shouldn't be surprised to find areas of agreement between Christianity and paganism. The thorny question throughout history has been whether the church has borrowed too much or not enough.
 
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