Christianity verses athiests

[McBell]

But it's impossible for all of those titles to refer to the same entity, since they have different viewpoints on us, and different properties.

Hello....
:slap:

God is all powerful...

 

[Tathagata]

why do athiests keep demanding "evidence" of god's existence or biblical beliefs

Because you must have evidence and good reasons to back up your belief. If you have no good reasons for believing something, then it shouldn't be believed in, let alone asserted as truth.

from christians when THERE IS NONE?

Actually, there is evidence and valid philosophical arguments for the existence of God, perhaps you should look around more. (Despite this, I don't find any of it to be sufficient nor convincing.)

why do christions keep trying to present "evidence" of god's existence or of biblical beliefs to athiests when THERE IS NONE

See above.

the only evidence that could prove or disprove either would have to be conceived by one of the five senses, touch, taste, smell, hearing or sight. IT DOESNT EXIST

So you don't agree that logic and philosophy combined with scientific data are valid?

FAITH, an intangible force, derived through a sixth sense from ones mind and heart is all that there is that devides the two.

Well, faith, emotion, and occasionally (rarely) reason.

either you have it or you dont. GIVE IT A REST

You think that we should stop having discussions about the greatest questions of existence? We need more debate, more thinking, more awareness raising; not less.



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[AxisMundi]

Christianity WINS!

Put that in your smipe and poke it.

Christianity has never held even half of the world's population in thrall, despite the best colonial and conversion efforts of Europe and Great Britian.

Indeed, ALL three Abrahamics don't have half of the world's population at this time.

Christianity is also far from the oldest relgiions in the world, examples of which have been dated to 65,000 years of age. Compare that to two thousand year old Christianity.

Your scriptures are full of self-contradictions and disproved myths.

So, how does "Christianity win"?

 

[Richard Hayman]

I don't agree. I don't consider my faith a superstition and I don't think all the world's problems can be blamed by religion (I blame people for the world's problems).

People doing things in the name of God.... If you have faith in a supreme being and an afterlife or anything along these irrational lines than your beliefs are superstitious.

Religion appeals to the ego, and rulers exploit this. Religion aside from being an early and poor explanation for everything was and in many places still is a tool of totalitarianism.

If our societies laws were based on the Bible 9(most popular here) we would actually resemble places like Saudi Arabia and Iran. In fact right now I would be committing a thought crime if I thought my neighbors house, car and wife were better than mine.... (coveting thy...) Yet Jealousy and emulation have been proven to be a good evolutionary traits because they promote progress.

 

[McBell]

Christianity has never held even half of the world's population in thrall, despite the best colonial and conversion efforts of Europe and Great Britian.

Indeed, ALL three Abrahamics don't have half of the world's population at this time.

Christianity is also far from the oldest relgiions in the world, examples of which have been dated to 65,000 years of age. Compare that to two thousand year old Christianity.

Your scriptures are full of self-contradictions and disproved myths.

So, how does "Christianity win"?

Appeal to numbers fallacy.

 

[AxisMundi]

Appeal to numbers fallacy.

How so?

There is simply no other criteria to measure the success of Christianity.

Any and all "good deeds" are instantly negated by the millenia of oppression, discrimination, murder, and systematic attempts to erase "the competition", ie different religions and cultures.

 

[McBell]

How so?

There is simply no other criteria to measure the success of Christianity.

Any and all "good deeds" are instantly negated by the millenia of oppression, discrimination, murder, and systematic attempts to erase "the competition", ie different religions and cultures.

The number of followers, or lack of in this particular case, have no bearing on the truth or falsehood of Christianity.

 

[Richard Hayman]

The number of followers, or lack of in this particular case, have no bearing on the truth or falsehood of Christianity.

That is true.... But I ask: Why is it than Christians here in Canada and the US mostly say they are right because they represent a majority? A big non argument that many if not most Christians cite in debate.

 

[ChristineES]

Because you must have evidence and good reasons to back up your belief. If you have no good reasons for believing something, then it shouldn't be believed in, let alone asserted as truth.

I am not sure what you are saying here. Are you telling that I shouldn't believe in God because you find no evidence of Him? There may be no scientific evidence, but I see "evidences" of Him all the time. It is nothing that would convince you or any other atheist so I would never bother presenting it (And besides that it more than likely would not be allowed).

If you don't believe in God, there is nothing that you or I or anyone else can do about it. I can't force you to believe, you can't force yourself to believe (that is, if you wanted to). But even if there is no evidence of any God scientifically or physically, we theists have a right to believe in Him and we have a right to follow our faith, whatever it may be. The only thing we wouldn't have a right to do would be to harm another person, even if it has something to do with our faith.

 

[Tathagata]

I am not sure what you are saying here. Are you telling that I shouldn't believe in God because you find no evidence of Him?

When did I say that? I was simply laying out the standards for what should qualify as justified belief.

Also, immediately after laying out the qualifying standards of justified belief, I stated: "Actually, there is evidence and valid philosophical arguments for the existence of God, perhaps you should look around more." -- Tathagata

There may be no scientific evidence, but I see "evidences" of Him all the time. It is nothing that would convince you or any other atheist so I would never bother presenting it (And besides that it more than likely would not be allowed).

Again, see above.

If you don't believe in God, there is nothing that you or I or anyone else can do about it. I can't force you to believe, you can't force yourself to believe (that is, if you wanted to). But even if there is no evidence of any God scientifically or physically, we theists have a right to believe in Him and we have a right to follow our faith, whatever it may be. The only thing we wouldn't have a right to do would be to harm another person, even if it has something to do with our faith.

I will simply have to refer you to my original statement because you seemed to have overlooked it.

"Because you must have evidence and good reasons to back up your belief. If you have no good reasons for believing something, then it shouldn't be believed in, let alone asserted as truth." -- Tathagata

"Good reason to believe something" does not necessarily mean it must be backed up by scientific or physical evidence and I never implied such. Good reasons can come in the form of philosophical argument, logical induction, even intuitive induction, but never appeal to emotion, appeal to what you wish to be true, or appeal to faith.


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[Jeremiah]

why do athiests keep demanding "evidence" of god's existence or biblical beliefs from christians when THERE IS NONE?

why do christions keep trying to present "evidence" of god's existence or of biblical beliefs to athiests when THERE IS NONE

the only evidence that could prove or disprove either would have to be conceived by one of the five senses, touch, taste, smell, hearing or sight. IT DOESNT EXIST

FAITH, an intangible force, derived through a sixth sense from ones mind and heart is all that there is that devides the two.

either you have it or you dont. GIVE IT A REST

"FAITH, an intangible force, derived through a sixth sense from ones mind and heart is all that there is that devides the two.

either you have it or you dont. GIVE IT A REST"

There is nothing that a theist can perceive that, I, the atheist, can not also perceive. There are no secrets reveled only to one or the other. We are both human; we both have a human mind, we both have a human heart and we both have a human soul.

"Atheist" vs. "Theist": it is only a superficial division; we are all just humans.

 

[AxisMundi]

The number of followers, or lack of in this particular case, have no bearing on the truth or falsehood of Christianity.

Then present your criteria for truth, and we shall debate that.

I msut warn you, however, that your bible is far from self-supporting evidence, considering the self-contradictions and disproved myths.

 

[ChristineES]

When did I say that? I was simply laying out the standards for what should qualify as justified belief.

Also, immediately after laying out the qualifying standards of justified belief, I stated: "Actually, there is evidence and valid philosophical arguments for the existence of God, perhaps you should look around more." -- Tathagata

Again, see above.

I will simply have to refer you to my original statement because you seemed to have overlooked it.

"Because you must have evidence and good reasons to back up your belief. If you have no good reasons for believing something, then it shouldn't be believed in, let alone asserted as truth." -- Tathagata

"Good reason to believe something" does not necessarily mean it must be backed up by scientific or physical evidence and I never implied such. Good reasons can come in the form of philosophical argument, logical induction, even intuitive induction, but never appeal to emotion, appeal to what you wish to be true, or appeal to faith.


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The statement wasn't clear to me which is why I asked you what you meant. Now that you've explained it more, I think I understand more.

 

[sniper762]

the intangible force can be likened to one's "conciance". everyone's is different.

 

[Wotan]

"There is nothing that a theist can perceive that, I, the atheist, can not also perceive. There are no secrets reveled only to one or the other. We are both human; we both have a human mind, we both have a human heart and we both have a human soul.

"Atheist" vs. "Theist": it is only a superficial division; we are all just humans."

Not according to their "holy" book. It quite explicitly says they have understanding and insight NOT available to the rest of us.

 

[Tathagata]

"Atheist" vs. "Theist": it is only a superficial division;

It's a real, intellectual division. Just because we are all humans doesn't mean there aren't divisions. What's next? "There are no males and females, we're all just humans."

we are all just humans.

Stating the obvious doesn't change the fact.


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[Richard Hayman]

"FAITH, an intangible force, derived through a sixth sense from ones mind and heart is all that there is that devides the two.

either you have it or you dont. GIVE IT A REST"

There is nothing that a theist can perceive that, I, the atheist, can not also perceive. There are no secrets reveled only to one or the other. We are both human; we both have a human mind, we both have a human heart and we both have a human soul.

"Atheist" vs. "Theist": it is only a superficial division; we are all just humans.

If you believe you have a soul... You're not an atheist. Other than that you are correct though lol.

 

[Jeremiah]

It's a real, intellectual division. Just because we are all humans doesn't mean there aren't divisions. What's next? "There are no males and females, we're all just humans."



Stating the obvious doesn't change the fact.


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"It's a real, intellectual division. Just because we are all humans doesn't mean there aren't divisions. "

O, then what is this "division"? What is it that the atheist has that the theist does not have?

"There are no males and females, we're all just humans."

As most are aware, there are actual physiological differences between a man and a woman. I am sorry you have to learn about the birds and the bees this way. But unlike you, women were not born with a pee-pee.

 

[Jeremiah]

If you believe you have a soul... You're not an atheist. Other than that you are correct though lol.

"If you believe you have a soul... You're not an atheist. "

Atheism is the disbelief or lack of belief in God(s). It has nothing to do with a belief in souls.

Also;

Simply because I use the word soul, that does not mean I am suggesting it is in any way otherworldly.

 

[McBell]

That is true.... But I ask: Why is it than Christians here in Canada and the US mostly say they are right because they represent a majority? A big non argument that many if not most Christians cite in debate.

um...
Because it works on some people?
They do not know any better?
They do not understand that it is a logical fallacy?
They honestly believe that numbers prove their beliefs?
It is good enough for them?